Still Missing Two Mitchell Deaths - probably in workhouses

[PhotoFamily]

From what I've read, I think I understand that London workhouses were pretty consolidated by 1881, especially for a hospital/infirmary setting. There is a John Mitchell who goes in and out of the Islington workhouse in the early 1881 year, maybe even in the time frame of the 1881 census - which could explain why he wasn't with Anne in the 1881. BUT the age is wrong (60) and he's a coal porter and a widower in the 1881 census. Could they have misread/mistranscribed his age? Could he have been a coal porter (yes, in one census he was a warehouseman)? Could they have assumed he was a widower when he was married?

Wish I could find the workhouse admission for the John Mitchell who died in 1881.

[cbcarolyn]

I don't know enough about the electoral role, he is on there in 1842 and have also found him in 1861 matching census address, I thought this meant you had a certain amount of earnings/wealth to get on it in those days?

[vera2013]

No...didn't London start burying people out of the city by then? And I really don't think they had any money. Pretty sure that Anne was an Annuitant of the Fishmonger's Company thru her father, and that her husband was unable to work by 1861 when he had "no occupation". Anne reported in 1881 that she was still married, but died as a widow in 1887 - her son was the informant, so that should be accurate.

Haven't traced her son with any certainty - he may be my next round of GRO roulette. I'm pretty sure the 1881 death is my man.

Thanks PhotoFamily. Yes not sure when but at one point the London dead were buried e!sewhere. Think there was a dedicated Train Station for them. I have searched for burials on Ancestry. Had thought Anne's burial at least would be found but not in the City and Tower Hamlets Cemetery or London burial records.

As has already been posted,
John B could have been an inmate of a workhouse. He could also have been an in patient. Either way should turn up on GRO.

I think the 1881 Islington GRO may not be your man. A Probate Record on Ancestry has a John Mitchell dying Dec 1881. However could be some other clues on BC to at least dismiss it. Likewise 1882 Islington.

I did briefly look at Samuel. Got as far as 1891 only. Saw some Army Pension records.

Will keep looking

vera

[PhotoFamily]

Thanks PhotoFamily. Yes not sure when but at one point the London dead were buried e!sewhere. Think there was a dedicated Train Station for them. I have searched for burials on Ancestry. Had thought Anne's burial at least would be found but not in the City and Tower Hamlets Cemetery or London burial records.

As has already been posted,
John B could have been an inmate of a workhouse. He could also have been an in patient. Either way should turn up on GRO.

I think the 1881 Islington GRO may not be your man. A Probate Record on Ancestry has a John Mitchell dying Dec 1881. However could be some other clues on BC to at least dismiss it. Likewise 1882 Islington.

I did briefly look at Samuel. Got as far as 1891 only. Saw some Army Pension records.

Will keep looking

vera

Thanks, Vera - I hadn't looked at Samuel's records in a very long time, and refreshed my memory last night. Samuel was briefly in the Hackney Union Workhouse in 1888.

Maybe this is he in 1901

https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/7814/images/HAMRG13_1056_1057-0107?pId=1083184

and there's a death in Fulham in 1906 that might be his as well.

I haven't retrieved the Chelsea record, guess that's something I should do next time I'm at the library.

Another possibility with Samuel - he had relatives in the US, Channel Islands and more. He could have gone overseas after his mother died.

But - I'm really interested in John (1803) and his father William (~1780). They are my direct line.

[cbcarolyn]

this was copied from the previous post you made, added a few addresses as was trying to decide where he was last 'seen' or the family were

John Bidgood Mitchell, born 1803

Occupations:
1833 - Labourer (son's baptism)
1841 - Warehouseman
1844 - Labourer (3 children's baptisms)
1851 - Tinplate Worker (daughter's baptism*)
1851 - Warehouseman 6 Edwards Street, Mile End Old Town, Towers Hamlets
1853 - Labourer (2 sons' baptisms)
1855 - Contractor (son's wedding)
1856 - Contractor (his own wedding)
1861 - "No Occupation" - his wife was a "nurse" and there were two "nurse children" in the home
1871 - Annuitant 2 Edward Lane, Stoke Newington
1873 - Providence Row, Old Ford Street, Tower Hamlets - reg of elector - same as 1861 census
1874 - Gentleman (Daughter's wedding)
1875 - Gentleman (Daughter's wedding)
1881 - Annie on her own 16 Canal Road, Mile End Old Town, Tower Hamlets

* I think this is an error - JBM's father was a Tinplate worker. This child was baptized out of sequence - I suspect she was ill, and there may have been time pressures which lead to errors. And it was St Dunstans - I think I have other errors from them, and others have commented about errors from that parish.

I have the death cert for 1875 in Bethnal Green. I've not seen this address before - but they moved often. And occupation was Porter. I can't be certain it is he.

I actually think they had money problems, despite the "gentleman" & "annuitant" occupations. I know that one son joined the Royal Artillery at age 14 yrs, 10 mo. My g'g'grandfather, if he is indeed of that family, was a Royal Engineer. And, as discussed in another thread, if you look at his neighbors, they usually were hardworking people - working class occupations, no servants. In the other thread, there was a comment that "gentleman" sounded better than "unemployed". And, technically, their children were illegitimate.

[PhotoFamily]

The 1875 Bethnal Green DC - I am certain that it is not he.

This is the John Mitchell who died in Bethnal in 1875 - not my man.

https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/7619/images/LNDRG10_486_489-0136?usePUB=true&_phsrc=ytp3&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&pId=12185946

[PhotoFamily]

John B could have been an inmate of a workhouse. He could also have been an in patient. Either way should turn up on GRO.

I think the 1881 Islington GRO may not be your man. A Probate Record on Ancestry has a John Mitchell dying Dec 1881. However could be some other clues on BC to at least dismiss it. Likewise 1882 Islington.

The DC for John Mitchell who died in Islington "City of London Union Workhouse" has a DOD of 17 Oct 1881.

1861 • 10 Providence Rd, Old Ford Bow, Middlesex, England
1871 • 2 Edward St, St Luke, Kensington, London, England

I hadn't realized he was on voter reg. So, given that he disappears off the voter reg, does this indicate a change of status? Off to verify that he does drop off.

I lied. found him at Old Ford, looking for Kensington

[PhotoFamily]

Anne dies in 1887 at 121 Gibsons Buildings, Stamford Hill, Hackney

[PhotoFamily]

I don't know enough about the electoral role, he is on there in 1842 and have also found him in 1861 matching census address, I thought this meant you had a certain amount of earnings/wealth to get on it in those days?

From Wikipedia, Registration process from 1832
"In the boroughs, the rate-book—which the overseers already compiled—provided a natural basis for the electoral register. An elector who had paid his rates up to the start of the registration period did not need to make a claim, unless there had been a change of address or qualification. By 20 July the assessors and collectors of taxes had to report to the overseers the names of those who were in arrears with payment of their rates. The overseers then compiled a draft electoral register of all those they considered as being qualified to vote"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_registration_in_the_United_Kingdom#Registration_process_from_1832

So, it sounds like if you were keeping up on your tax payments, you were eligible to vote? Which if he were not working, and relying on an annuity (whether it was his or Anne's), it might have been more and more difficult to keep up with.

[vera2013]

[QUOTE=PhotoFamily;n1329397]

The DC for John Mitchell who died in Islington "City of London Union Workhouse" has a DOD of 17 Oct 1881.



Thanks for Summary Carolyn

Not able to include your post PhotoFamily. Getting error 're URL

That's interesting did not see that 1881 Islington GRO. Will check out Workhouse record.

There are two St Luke's in London. One Che!sea/Kensington. One the City.

Vera

[cbcarolyn]

a shame he didn't use his middle name more often, that would have been very useful. I was hoping to find him on a few more elec reg, just to see that he was 'alive', Like you say maybe he had no money so was not on there.

these are the ones I found

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/1795/images/40020_636672_1594-00053?pId=277717815

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/1795/images/40020_636672_1597-00250?pId=205031004

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/1795/images/40020_635001_1563-00196?pId=295299251

I can only find these using the census addresses, Name too common to know if he is any other John Mitchell, he is not on the 187os in Edward Lane I have found George Kennedy next door on there, so found the right reg and no Mitchell. But he could have moved on as Ann at Canal Road, old Mile End Town.

[vera2013]

I think the 1881 Islington GRO may not be your man. A Probate Record on Ancestry has a John Mitchell dying Dec 1881. However could be some other clues on BC to at least dismiss it. Likewise 1882 Islington.
EDIT. Correction this Probate relates to an 1881 December quarter Pancras reg





vera

[vera2013]

I'm getting in a right muddle here. Getting errors when trying to post

[vera2013]

On Ancestry

City of London Workhouse - Homerton Workhouse

Mitchell, John aged 80
Looks like 5 Beech Street
Widower
Labourer
Not able bodied
Admitted 5 Oct 1881. Died 17 Oct 1881

Vera

[PhotoFamily]

at the library and picked up Samuel's Chelsea record - definitely him - a painter. I assume that he would have no further record as he "can do little"

Well, I suppose the man he who died from head injury in 1879 could be mine, but I would need the Coroner's Inquest to stand a chance of being certain

[vera2013]

at the library and picked up Samuel's Chelsea record - definitely him - a painter. I assume that he would have no further record as he "can do little"

Well, I suppose the man he who died from head injury in 1879 could be mine, but I would need the Coroner's Inquest to stand a chance of being certain

Saw a couple of records FMP and Fold 3 via Ancestry. Nothing additional to help pin point Father John

The John Mitchell who died at 46 Grosvenor Street in 1879 could be a possibility altho dob incorrect. If he died at home maybe in electoral rolls. Otherwise National Archives have a file

Coroner's Inquests. Police reporting to Coroner sudden deaths which require Inquest
1879-1880
Ref HO45/9588/89990
Not digitised

Vera

[PhotoFamily]

Vera & Carolyn -
Thank you for all your diligence and sharing your knowledge and expertise. I still think that sometimes they just don't want to be found.

[vera2013]

Earliest I can see a John Mitchell living at 46 Grosvenor Street on ER is 1877 but no other member at the same address to confirm.your John.

Vera

[cbcarolyn]

found John on census 1871 at 46 Grosvenor street - born in Lancashire 1795, a police pensioner

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageview...ue&pId=5231680

with wife Isabella

so he is not your man

[cbcarolyn]

I do know the St Marylebone cemetery had many 'londoners' buried there, not sure it was just Westminster, or those north of the river, trying to find some info on it. It was jut up the road from my Nans, when we drove past it always knew we were nearly there, it is huge. miles by miles.

I think they are indexed on deceased on line, as we found my cousins sister there.