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Still Missing Two Mitchell Deaths - probably in workhouses

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    Still Missing Two Mitchell Deaths - probably in workhouses

    I'll make separate posts for each of them.

    I am still missing the death of John Bidgood Mitchell, born St Luke's, 1803, probably died between 1881 & 1887. He was in the 1871 census in Stoke Kensington/Finsbury with his wife, Anne. She's in the 1881 with her son, Samuel, in MEOT. She died in 1887, a widow.

    Initially it was assume that John had died in 1875 - I bought that cert: it's not him. Then I realized that Anne was not a widow in 1881.

    So I suspect John was in a workhouse in 1881, and died there, but can't spot a likely registration. Lorraine, can you work any magic?

    This was the original thread:
    http://www.familytreeforum.com/showt...-John-Mitchell

    Thank you!
    ------------------------------------------------------
    My Families
    London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

    #2
    William Mitchell, Tinman, buried in 8 Jan 1840 (mis-transcribed on ancestry as 1839) in St Luke, address "Workhouse". I think the workhouse records are not on ancestry.

    He, too was subject of a previous thread. Certs in the appropriate time frame were not he.
    http://www.familytreeforum.com/showt...itchell-Tinman
    ------------------------------------------------------
    My Families
    London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

    Comment


      #3
      the only john mitchell entry so far is entry dated 1876 and discharge 1896 ......am searching for exact entry but it may take a while.

      There are a few mitchell entries and they state that the alias ANSELL is used, before i discount them. does the name mean anything to you ????
      Lorraine

      Comment


        #4
        what about William Mitchell Sep 1837 St Pancras 1 259 or are you saying the one buried in 1840 is him ?
        Last edited by Val wish Id never started; 04-02-13, 20:04.


        Val

        Comment


          #5
          Lorraine - haven't seen any Ansells in my research. Don't know where the Bidgood came from either?

          Val - haven't checked out the 1837 record, but the 1840 works well - he had been living in St Luke, his wife died in the St Luke Workhouse, and she was there in the 1841. THe age in the 1840 burial also works well. Unfortunately, it doesn't include occupation. And I'd like a record that includes his birth place (sigh) which a workhouse record might have.
          ------------------------------------------------------
          My Families
          London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

          Comment


            #6
            have you tried looking at FreeBMD Sarah?

            you can specify the search in years so from march q 1881 to dec q 1887 and then choose London & Middlesex along with John Mitchell you will get quite a lot of results, but you should get an age too, which might help narrow it down.

            http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
            Julie
            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

            .......I find dead people

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by PhotoFamily View Post
              William Mitchell, Tinman, buried in 8 Jan 1840 (mis-transcribed on ancestry as 1839) in St Luke, address "Workhouse". I think the workhouse records are not on ancestry.

              He, too was subject of a previous thread. Certs in the appropriate time frame were not he.
              http://www.familytreeforum.com/showt...itchell-Tinman
              Have you eliminated this one?
              FreeBMD Death Index:
              William Mitchell
              Jan-Feb-Mar 1840
              St George Southwark
              Volume 4, Page 308
              Elaine







              Comment


                #8
                Oh, yeah, bought that cert - not him. Can't lay my hands on it at this moment.

                There was a great thread a while ago, that was jokingly listing all the ways records our ancestors made records difficult to find. I think one was that the registrar didn't submit quarterly, but bunched them all together for several years. Or just plain not filing, or not under the correct name. And the early days of registration had some wrinkles to smooth out.
                ------------------------------------------------------
                My Families
                London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                Comment


                  #9
                  i have an uncle who was buried in the 1840's without a death cert. it would have helped 100% identify him. i had to settle with the address, which was the same as his brother a few years later.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Darksecretz View Post
                    have you tried looking at FreeBMD Sarah?

                    you can specify the search in years so from march q 1881 to dec q 1887 and then choose London & Middlesex along with John Mitchell you will get quite a lot of results, but you should get an age too, which might help narrow it down.

                    http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
                    It's been a while since I looked.
                    There's one John Mitchell, born 1803 (right year), who died in Middlesex between 4Q 1880 and 4Q 1887: John Francis Mitchell - not him.

                    Wrong ages:
                    Sep 1882 : Mitchell John 77 Islington 1b 193 ==> 1805
                    Dec 1885 : MITCHELL John 77 Kensington 1a 72 ==> 1808
                    Dec 1881 : MITCHELL John 80 Islington 1b 208 ==> 1801
                    Altho the two in Islington are only slightly off.

                    And that's assuming that the enumerator was correct in 1881: if his wife was really widowed in 1881 (not married, as reported), then I have to go back to his last sighting, which I think was in 1874ish.

                    I'm not sure about certificate roulette!

                    Just checked his DOB again - it was recorded with the baptism.

                    If he were living in Stoke Kensington, and born in St Luke, and entered a workhouse after 1871, any guesses where he would have gone?
                    Last edited by PhotoFamily; 06-02-13, 04:49.
                    ------------------------------------------------------
                    My Families
                    London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Nope my Geog of London is pretty poor.. sorry..

                      re the death though, the info was only as good as the person giving it though!.. [I mean they might have to guess his age].. he must be hiding with my Mary Ann, as I can't find a death for her either!!..
                      Julie
                      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                      .......I find dead people

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Darksecretz View Post
                        re the death though, the info was only as good as the person giving it though!.. [I mean they might have to guess his age].. he must be hiding with my Mary Ann, as I can't find a death for her either!!..
                        Yes, that's another reason why I wonder abt a workhouse - they might have messed up his name as well as age. That & common names make the search difficult
                        ------------------------------------------------------
                        My Families
                        London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by PhotoFamily View Post
                          It's been a while since I looked.
                          There's one John Mitchell, born 1803 (right year), who died in Middlesex between 4Q 1880 and 4Q 1887: John Francis Mitchell - not him.

                          Wrong ages:
                          Sep 1882 : Mitchell John 77 Islington 1b 193 ==> 1805
                          Dec 1885 : MITCHELL John 77 Kensington 1a 72 ==> 1808
                          Dec 1881 : MITCHELL John 80 Islington 1b 208 ==> 1801
                          Altho the two in Islington are only slightly off.

                          And that's assuming that the enumerator was correct in 1881: if his wife was really widowed in 1881 (not married, as reported), then I have to go back to his last sighting, which I think was in 1874ish.

                          I'm not sure about certificate roulette!

                          Just checked his DOB again - it was recorded with the baptism.

                          If he were living in Stoke Kensington, and born in St Luke, and entered a workhouse after 1871, any guesses where he would have gone?
                          I take it you mean living in stoke newington ? he could have gone to any of them to be honest, city road, waterloo road or because at that time stokey was part of finsbury st luke which is now islington but was once part of holborn - i am still trawling each one of them for you.
                          Lorraine

                          Comment


                            #14
                            being as anne and samuel were living in MEOT, i am 3 quarters through the mile end old and new town records, painfully they are not in any sort of order but will get there.

                            The london workhouses are a bit of a pain to work out because the areas change halfway through some some st lukes records go to holborn city road, some go to bethnal green and some revert back to finsbury st luke which gets put under islington

                            good job i know these areas very very well, back then and today.......nothings changed much lol
                            Lorraine

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I know its a hunch but because ann and sanuel were living in MEOT i wouldnt rule out that this is john

                              http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...DDeath&indiv=1


                              the mile end infirmary records dont start till 1882
                              Last edited by loltel; 06-02-13, 16:02.
                              Lorraine

                              Comment


                                #16
                                off on a tangent again...... on daughter esther marriage, her abode is 19 burdett road, which opposite mile end park, on the 1881 anna and samuel are in canal road these addresses are about 2 minutes walk apart

                                I would almost bet that john is the death in mile end above and he is probably buried in bow cemetery (tower hamlets)at the side of the park
                                Lorraine

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by loltel View Post
                                  I take it you mean living in stoke newington ?
                                  Oops, yes - the enumerator's handwriting is not well-formed when wren writing the Township name... and I don't know the area's georgraphy.
                                  Originally posted by loltel View Post
                                  he could have gone to any of them to be honest, city road, waterloo road or because at that time stokey was part of finsbury st luke which is now islington but was once part of holborn - i am still trawling each one of them for you.
                                  ooo, and you know the districts of the time! love it!
                                  ------------------------------------------------------
                                  My Families
                                  London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by loltel View Post
                                    some revert back to finsbury st luke which gets put under islington....
                                    Some of those closer deaths are in islington district?

                                    Originally posted by loltel View Post
                                    I know its a hunch but because ann and sanuel were living in MEOT i wouldnt rule out that this is john

                                    http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...DDeath&indiv=1


                                    the mile end infirmary records dont start till 1882
                                    .... I would almost bet that john is the death in mile end above and he is probably buried in bow cemetery (tower hamlets)at the side of the park
                                    That's a big age jump... for 9 & 1/4... I'll think about it.

                                    Do you know if ancestry has ALL the london/middlesex workhouse records?

                                    Lorraine, thank you so much for all your work. You've given me much to think about and work on.
                                    ------------------------------------------------------
                                    My Families
                                    London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      not sure about London/Middlesex WH records but I do know that not ALL records from workhouses did survive... very frustrating for those that do have relatives in there and wish to find out more.
                                      Julie
                                      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                      .......I find dead people

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        No not all the workhouse/infirmary records are on ancestry, I have many many records of my lot from trawlling the LMA and getting copies etc and they are not on there yet, and to be honest the way there are listed on ancestry is very confusing if you dont know the specific boroughs - they should list the individual wh/Inf by name as a starting index, then the borough they appear in.
                                        I have looked at records from whitechapel WH which they have under stepney but for the dates they have should be under holborn.

                                        rant over......carry on people :D
                                        Lorraine

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