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    Help with birthplace, please

    William Charles Lewin's place of birth is recorded on the registration of the death of his young daughter Evelyn Annie Lewin.

    Where do you reckon it was????? I'm totally stumped on this (apart from the "England" bit!)

    https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JD6F-RJX

    I'm hoping pob will help identify him in census 1901 and earlier.

    Thanks,

    Jay
    Janet in Yorkshire



    Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

    #2
    Can't decode father's p.o.b. (Besslook??) but mother's looks like Munsley - perhaps a phonetic rendering of Mundesley, Norfolk or maybe Mursley, Buckinghamshire. Any help?
    Last edited by Uncle John; 07-08-15, 14:28.
    Uncle John

    Comment


      #3
      There are a few ancestry trees that gives his birth as 21/1/1877 in Bisbrooke, near Uppingham in Rutland - no proper source for the birth though, but the place name fits (sort of) so must be worth investigation.
      Last edited by AntonyM; 07-08-15, 14:47.
      I am a professional researcher, and ex- deputy registrar, based in Buckinghamshire - please contact me for any help/advice or research via PM or my website www.chalfontresearch.co.uk
      Follow me on Twittter @ChalfontR

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by AntonyM View Post
        There are a few ancestry trees that gives his birth as 21/1/1877 in Bisbrooke, near Uppingham in Rutland - no proper source for the birth though, but the place name fits (sort of) so must be worth investigation.
        Sorry - date should read 21/11/1877
        I am a professional researcher, and ex- deputy registrar, based in Buckinghamshire - please contact me for any help/advice or research via PM or my website www.chalfontresearch.co.uk
        Follow me on Twittter @ChalfontR

        Comment


          #5
          The mother's (Anna Maria Lwein nee Coleman's birthplace was Trunch, Norfolk according to censuses. In 1911 she is with her parents and three of her children (husband not there) at 7 Victoria Cottages, Mundesley, Norfolk.
          Anna Maria had been married 6 years and had 3 children, all living.
          Anna Maria's father was also born Trunch and her mother Northrepps, Norfolk.
          The eldest two children were born Collingwood, Ontario, Canada - Alice Lavinia Lewin (aged 4) and Stephen Charles Coleman Lewin (aged 2)
          The youngest Noel James Lewin (8 months old) was born in Mundesley, Norfolk.

          Anna Maria and the children went back to Canada in 1912 from Liverpool on the 'Victorian' arriving 4 October . According to the passenger list, all of them are Methodists. If you could find the Methodist marriage register that should give you more on her husband. I've not had a Methodist register entry but I believe they are quite detailed in comparison to C of E ones.

          Will see if I dig up something on her husband as he's the one with the more illegible birthplace.
          Last edited by GallowayLass; 07-08-15, 15:34.

          Comment


            #6
            Thank you all for your replies.

            I know where Anna Maria, her parents, siblings and children were born, so please don't anyone waste their precious time searching for her or her family. It's the pob & possible dob of the husband that I'm unusure of.
            Bissbrooke sounds very feasible - off to chase that lead up now. (I'd seen it as Bisslook, which got me nowhere!)
            A previous thread of mine has been resurrected recently, which made me look again at one of my twigs (Anna Maria.)

            http://www.familytreeforum.com/showt...ailings-please

            Thanks all -
            Jay
            Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 07-08-15, 15:40.
            Janet in Yorkshire



            Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

            Comment


              #7
              I reckon the place must be Bisbrooke, Rutland. According to trees on ancestry he remarried after Anna Maria died. Here's the marriage. The date of birth is different but I'd guess he was trying to shave a bit off! The birthplace of Glaston is les than a mile NE of Bisbrooke.

              ~Name: Charles Lewin
              Age: 40
              Birth Date: abt 1884
              Birth Place: Glaston, England
              Marriage Date: 6 May 1924
              Marriage County or District: Simcoe
              Father: Daniel Lewin
              Mother: Edith Bryan
              Spouse: Frances Myrtle Robinson
              Spouse's Age: 21
              Spouse Birth Date: abt 1903
              Spouse Birth Place: Collingwood, Ontario
              Spouse Father: John Robinson
              Spouse Mother: Francis Wright Jessop
              Registration district: Simcoe

              Comment


                #8
                Hmmm - have looked at the Ancestry tree. I do know that MY William Charles Lewin was in Ontario, where all but one of his children were born.
                The birth of son Stephen Charles Colman Lewin was registered in Canada in 1908 and records the parents as William Charles Lewin & Anna Maria Colman. married at Mundesley 2 Mar 1905. (There is a corresponding GRO marriage index entry.) Anna Maria Lewin died in Ontario in 1920 and her death registration records he father as having been Stephen Colman.
                The couple's last child was born in 1919 and died in 1920 - this is the record which has the place of birth for William as in #1.

                As always, there seems to have been more than one William Charles Lewin, and I think the tree(s) on Ancestry may have confused two different men. As I do not have the marriage cert for Anna Maria, and the details are not online, I have no means of knowing the marital status of William - he could have had a previous marriage, but I don't think he could have managed to sire two families on two continents in the same time span.

                Jay
                Janet in Yorkshire



                Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Janet in Yorkshire View Post
                  Thank you all for your replies.

                  I know where Anna Maria, her parents, siblings and children were born, so please don't anyone waste their precious time searching for her or her family. It's the pob & possible dob of the husband that I'm unusure of.

                  Jay
                  But I didn't - so needed that info to try to find them together so I knew I'd go the correct man as there seems to be uncertainty over his full name. I'm finding William Charles, William, Charles and Charles William depending on when exactly he was born.
                  I've not found a marriage for Edith Bryan and Daniel Lewin on familysearch nor a baptism for Daniel - likely they were Methodists too???

                  Comment


                    #10
                    If the 2nd marriage is correct, using the parents to confirm, here's what should be the correct person in 1881 census.

                    ~Name: Charles Lewin
                    Age: 3
                    Estimated birth year: abt 1878
                    Relationship to Head: Son (Child)
                    Father: Daniel Lewin
                    Mother: Edith Lewin
                    Gender: Male
                    Where born: Bisbrook, Rutland, England
                    Civil Parish: Glaston
                    County/Island: Rutland
                    Country: England
                    Education:
                    Occupation: Scholar
                    Registration district: Uppingham
                    ED, institution, or vessel: 7
                    Piece: 3190
                    Folio: 103
                    Page Number: 35
                    Household Members: Name Age
                    Daniel Lewin 53
                    Edith Lewin 35
                    Bob Lewin 13
                    Daniel Lewin 9
                    Thomas Lewin 7
                    Edith Lewin 6
                    Charles Lewin 3
                    Annie Lewin 1
                    Henry Lewin

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Interesting find, GallowayLass - I'll investigate a bit further. However, I think there may have also been a Charles Lewin in Simcoe County and other Lewins too. As WC Lewin is a "married in" I haven't dwelt on him too much because it is his wife and children I share blood with.
                      However, I did try to find him in 1911 Canada census and thought I might have found him (complete with children who were recorded in Mundesley in 1911!) but it turned out to be the wrong man.
                      I will put this to my new found contact on his return to my other thread next week.

                      I did wonder if William already had Lewin relatives in Canada, which prompted him to go shortly after marriage, hoping to find a "better" life for them.

                      Jay
                      Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 07-08-15, 16:19.
                      Janet in Yorkshire



                      Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Here's the best match I can see in GRO index. The 1Q of 1878 is a bit late for the birthdate in 1877 in the trees but maybe they are a year out?

                        ~Name: Charles Lewin
                        Registration Year: 1878
                        Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
                        Registration district: Uppingham
                        Inferred County: Rutland
                        Volume: 7a
                        Page: 339

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Same boy in 1891

                          ~Name: Charles Lewin
                          Age: 13
                          Estimated birth year: abt 1878
                          Relation: Son (Child)
                          Father's name: Daniel Lewin
                          Mother's name: Edith Lewin
                          Gender: Male
                          Where born: Glaston, Rutland, England
                          Civil Parish: Glaston
                          Ecclesiastical parish: St Andrew
                          Town: Glaston
                          County/Island: Rutland
                          Country: England
                          Street address:
                          Occupation:
                          Condition as to marriage:
                          Education:
                          Employment status:
                          Registration district: Uppingham
                          ED, institution, or vessel: 7
                          Piece: 2551
                          Folio: 82
                          Page Number: 23
                          Household Members: Name Age
                          Daniel Lewin 64
                          Edith Lewin 46
                          Daniel Lewin 19
                          Charles Lewin 13
                          Annie Lewin 11
                          Rose Lewin 9
                          Avnol Lewin 7
                          Arthur Lewin 4
                          Last edited by GallowayLass; 07-08-15, 16:23.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I can't see him on the 1901 census living in either Rutland or Norfolk. There were 2 Anna Maria Coleman who married in 1905 in Norfolk. The one that should be right is 1st quarter Erpingham but her husband is shown as William Charles Lewin.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by GallowayLass View Post
                              I can't see him on the 1901 census living in either Rutland or Norfolk. There were 2 Anna Maria Coleman who married in 1905 in Norfolk. The one that should be right is 1st quarter Erpingham but her husband is shown as William Charles Lewin.
                              All the "official" documentation I've found for my man, from his marriage onwards, records him as William Charles, including an emigration card for his son Stephen in 1924(?) detailing his father as Wm C. (I can accept him being known in the parental home before his marriage by his middle name.)

                              This is the 1911 Canadian census return I found:
                              http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca...e002020718.jpg

                              All born Ontario
                              two children in the family, both with the name of a child of WC & Anna; But Anna M & their THREE children were in England in 1911
                              The dob given for Alice June 1906, Stephen March 1908, Annie August 1887, Charles May 1876.
                              Anna Maria born 1883, Alice Lavinia Sept 1806, & Stephen October 1908 William Charles unknown
                              All Methodists.

                              I can't access 1921 Canada census - it needs a sub to Ancestry worldwide - would love to know how WC & his enlarged family are recorded .

                              Jay
                              Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 07-08-15, 17:44.
                              Janet in Yorkshire



                              Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Married Jan 1925 Alice Lewin Gray (her birth registration has an addendum that she was adopted by Mr John Gray) daughter of Anna Marie Colman & Chas W Lewin. bride's father born England

                                There is also this Canadian birth reg
                                https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VNLJ-GGV
                                and this 1881 Canada census return
                                https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MVDN-SCL

                                Jay
                                Janet in Yorkshire



                                Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Would need to read this a bit more Jay but think these maybe the 1921 census. Alice appears to be out of the family 'inmate' but working as a school matron. Have saved if you need them

                                  1921 Canadian Census

                                  Charles aged 38 can't read Occupation Widower Immigrated 1913
                                  Steven aged 12 born England
                                  Newell aged 10 ?? Name
                                  Moris aged 6 ?? Name
                                  Daniel aged 4

                                  Hume Street, Ward 3

                                  1921 Canadian Census

                                  Alice born 1906 Ontario Inmate/Assistant/Matron - looks like a School
                                  Father born in England
                                  Rel Anglican

                                  Simcoe South, Ontario

                                  http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/89...c=&pid=2463830

                                  http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/89...l=ReturnRecord

                                  Vera
                                  Last edited by vera2013; 07-08-15, 19:46.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Janet in Yorkshire View Post
                                    This is the 1911 Canadian census return I found:
                                    http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca...e002020718.jpg

                                    I can't access 1921 Canada census - it needs a sub to Ancestry worldwide - would love to know how WC & his enlarged family are recorded .

                                    Jay
                                    Where did you get this 1911 census from? I've been trawling ancestry for hours now and hadn't found it. Even putting in the exact moth and year of the children's births as on the census page, I still get no results. What did you enter to bring this item up?

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by GallowayLass View Post
                                      I can't see him on the 1901 census living in either Rutland or Norfolk. There were 2 Anna Maria Coleman who married in 1905 in Norfolk. The one that should be right is 1st quarter Erpingham but her husband is shown as William Charles Lewin.
                                      There is an army record for a Charles Lewin born Brisbrook 1877, who served in the Lincolnshire regiment. He served in India Oct 1898 until March 1903.
                                      There is a signature on his enlistment form (1895) but I don;t have a later one to compare it with.

                                      Jay
                                      Janet in Yorkshire



                                      Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        In the 1921 census found by Vera, Newell is Noel James, the child on the 1991 England census that was born in Norfolk.

                                        Comment

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