Help with sailings, please

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Anna Maria Colman mar William Charles Lewin Mar qtr 1905, in Norfolk.

1911 census, Anna Maria Lewin (born 1883 inTrunch Nfk) is in Mundesley at the home of her parents, with her 3 children - Alice Lavinia Lewin b 1907 Collingwood Ontario Canada; Stephen Charles Colman Lewin b 1908 Collingwood Ontario & Noel b Sep qtr 1910 Mundesley.
Anna Maria's husband is not present.

On FMP I have found a Sep 1912 Liverpool to Quebec sailing for Mrs Lewin (wife, 29 yrs) & the three children.
I have also found a Nov 1910 Liverpool to Quebec sailing for William Lewin, joiner, SINGLE, 33 yrs, who I believe to be Anna Maria's husband.

IF the first 2 children were born in Ontario, can anybody find the return to England of Anna Maria, William, Alice & Stephen?
Also an earlier journey to Canada by William & Anna Maria, before the children were born?

Jay

[Elaine ..Spain]

Anna, Alice and Stephen are shown on the Incoming Passenger Lists on Ancestry:

Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960
Anna Lewin
Port of Departure Montréal
Arrival Date - 3 Jun 1910, Liverpool
Ship Name: Victorian

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Thankyou, Elaine - that would seem to confirm Canada as birth place of both Alice & Stephen.

Jay

[Christine in Herts]

May I recommend that you got to http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/d...5-100.01-e.php and look at page 29 of the 45 images for

Ship:
VICTORIAN

Shipping Line:
Allan Line Steamship Co.

Departure Port and Date (yyyy/mm/dd):
Liverpool, England - 1912-09-27

Port and Date of Arrival:
Montreal, Que. - [1912-10]
Quebec, Que. - 1912-10-04

Reference:
RG 76

Microfilm:
T-4792

Christine

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Thankyou for your help Christine.

I'm still struggling to find Anna Maria's first trip to Canada between her wedding in 1905 and the birth of Alice in 1907.

ETA - I've just found a WC Lewin & Mrs Lewin sailing Liverpool to Portland on the Vancouver in Mar 1905 -age would be right for Anna Maria.
Can anyone see a corresponding USA arrival or a border crossing, please?

Jay

[Christine in Herts]

Anna Maria Colman mar William Charles Lewin Mar qtr 1905, in Norfolk.

<snip>

On FMP I have found a Sep 1912 Liverpool to Quebec sailing for Mrs Lewin (wife, 29 yrs) & the three children.
I have also found a Nov 1910 Liverpool to Quebec sailing for William Lewin, joiner, SINGLE, 33 yrs, who I believe to be Anna Maria's husband.

<snip>

Jay

The FMP designation "single" can be misleading in this context. In some cases - and this is one - the column header is actually "Single, or unaccompanied by husband or wife".

Christine

[Janet in Yorkshire]

That's an interesting bit of information, Christine. Thankyou again.

Jay

[Blewin]

Good evening..,
Your posting came up in a Google Inquiry on my grandfather's name William Charles Lewin. My grandmother was Anna Maria Colman. My father was Noel James Lewin.
Were you looking for additional information for a family tree? Anna had 2 additional children after my father. Should additional information on my family be of interest to you please let me know. I have details that may fill in some gaps

Regards,

Bill.

Pickering Ontario.

Anna Maria Colman mar William Charles Lewin Mar qtr 1905, in Norfolk.

1911 census, Anna Maria Lewin (born 1883 inTrunch Nfk) is in Mundesley at the home of her parents, with her 3 children - Alice Lavinia Lewin b 1907 Collingwood Ontario Canada; Stephen Charles Colman Lewin b 1908 Collingwood Ontario & Noel b Sep qtr 1910 Mundesley.
Anna Maria's husband is not present.

On FMP I have found a Sep 1912 Liverpool to Quebec sailing for Mrs Lewin (wife, 29 yrs) & the three children.
I have also found a Nov 1910 Liverpool to Quebec sailing for William Lewin, joiner, SINGLE, 33 yrs, who I believe to be Anna Maria's husband.

IF the first 2 children were born in Ontario, can anybody find the return to England of Anna Maria, William, Alice & Stephen?
Also an earlier journey to Canada by William & Anna Maria, before the children were born?

Jay

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Hello Bill,

What a lovely surprise to see this old thread resurrected and to read your post.
At the time of starting the thread, I was trying to tidy up some of my Colman loose ends and take forward members of my extended Colman family, of whom Anna Maria was one.
My connection to your family is that Anna Maria's grandmother, Rebecca Colman (1828-1912), was a younger sister of my gt-gt grandmother Susan Colman (1816-1886.) I do have a record that Anna Maria died in hospital on 2 Aug 1920, the cause of death being pulmonary TB.
I would be delighted to exchange further details of the Colman family with you, and to fill in some of the gaps in the Canada connection. I have to go out shortly, but will be back online this evening. This site does have a private messaging system, through which I can contact you, but I think you will only be able to respond once you have made ten posts, so nine more to go!

Thank you so much for adding to the thread.

Jay

[jules of the desert]

Oh Janet, that's fantastic after all this time.

Jxx

[Christine in Herts]

Welcome to FTF, Bill! Even more welcome when you turn up bearing gifts of new information!

If you explore the site, you'll find that there's quite a lot going on and there are a lot of friendly helpful folk here. Please also double-check the T&Cs so that you don't fall foul of them while being enthusiastic in your own quest or in helping other people with theirs.

Christine

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Hi again, Bill.
I've had time to dig out my notes and these are the children I have for Anna Maria and William Charles: Alice,(12 Sep 1906) Stephen CC (12 Oct 1908) both born Ontario, Noel James born Mundesley 1910 and then Evelyn Ann (1919 -1920 born Ontario.) So I am not the least bit surprised that there was another child between Noel & Evelyn.

Jay

[Blewin]

Hi Jay..,
Thank you for responding to my post. Anna Maria had 2 more children after my father Noel. There was Maurice and Dan. I met my uncle Maurice when I was young. He became a police officer in Collingwood. Dan died as a child. My father said that Dan contracted TB from his mother. As you may know, Collingwood was a major ship building town at one point in the past. That is most likely the reason that my grandparents moved there from England. Both my father and his brother Stephen work for the merchant marine fleet sailing the great lakes. I was told that Stephen worked mainly in the U.S. My father joined the Navy during WWII and was stationed in Nova Scotia. After that he settled in Toronto and worked for the Ontario Gov't until he retired. After Anna Maria died Alice was sent to live with another family while the boys stayed with their father. I believe that Alice married into the Mills family.

The vital dates for my father Noel James Lewin are: August 13, 1910 to June 27, 1984.

I have a family picture taken during their return to England of Anna Maria, Stephen, Alice and my father along with another woman I assume was Anna's mother. There was no man in the picture which I have assumed to mean that Anna's father was deceased. I will find the picture and scan it and send it to you.

I was told that Anna's father was a church minister. I would appreciate it if you could confirm that and provide any name, dates you may have found for him in your research.

Regards,


Bill.

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Thanks for all that information, Bill, which was very welcome.
I have a record that Anna's father (Stephen Colman) died in Q4 (Oct/Nov/Dec) 1911 at the age of 60 years, but do not have details of his burial to back up this information - images of the Mundesley parish records are not on familysearch.org. So, as it seems Anna and the children did not sail back until September 1912, then it could well be that the lady in the photo is Anna's widowed mother. Perhaps the photo was taken as a keepsake before Anna's return home to Canada?

With regards to her father having been a church minister, I don't know! However, I have not been able to locate a C of E baptism record for Anna, or her siblings; so in the light of your query, I am now wondering if the family were Methodists, possibly Primitive Methodists - I am told that as a rule of thumb, farmers and tradesmen tended to worship at the Wesleyan Methodist chapel, whilst their employees attended the Primitive Methodist chapel. I think most villages had chapels for each. IF that was the case, then Stephen could well have been a lay preacher at the village chapel. (I remember from childhood elderly residents of my village telling their memories of the long services at the PM chapel, with several local preachers all giving a sermon in the same service, accompanied by foot stamping and much calling out from the congregation!)

I will post some information on Stephen below. I've not included census references, but your local library will probably have free access to Ancestry worldwide, so that you can access the relevant images for yourself, should you so wish.

Jay

[Janet in Yorkshire]

1911 census recorded Anna Maria Lewin & her 3 children in the Norfolk village of Mundesley, with her parents, Stephen Colman (59 yrs, born Trunch, coal carter) & his wife Mary Elizabeth (59 yrs, born North Repps) Stephen & Mary E had been married for 31 yrs & had had 3 children.

1901 census – the family was in Mundesley. Anna Maria 18 yrs, Alice E 17 yrs & George S 15 yrs. All 3 children born in the neighbouring village of Trunch.

1891 – the family lived in Chapel Street, Trunch, where Stephen was employed as a cellar man at the Trunch brewery. 1881 Stephen & Mary E lived in Trunch – he was a brewer’s labourer.

12 June 1879 married at North Repps - Stephen Colman 28 yrs labourer of Trunch & Mary Elizabeth Cooper. Note: no father is given for Stephen and one of the witnesses was Henry Colman, a younger brother of Stephen.

Image of the North Repps marriage register

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-13196-25789-79?cc=1416598&wc=92BR-7MF:29887601,29373001,29404201

Jay

[Janet in Yorkshire]

1871 census Trunch – Stephen lived in Back Street, with his unmarried mother Rebecca & 4 younger siblings

1861 census in Trunch with mother & 4 siblings – aged 9, he was a farmer’s boy.

Here is an online transcription of Stephen’s baptism entry (I viewed the original parish register 20+ years ago and made my own transcription of the event)

http://www.freereg.org.uk/cgi/SearchResults.pl?RecordType=Baptisms&RecordID=6453137&v=MTQzODg1NTkyMDpjZmU0YmFhMTRjZDg3ZTNjY2FhZTkwN2YwNTk4YTI4NDljYTQxMjk0

Rebecca Colman had 9 children, but never married.
Many years ago, I was in contact with one of her descendants. She told me that it was alleged in the family that all the children had the same father, an itinerant tinker who wended his way around the country on an annual route, staying with Rebecca whenever he was in the neighbourhood of her village.

Jay

[Blewin]

Thanks Jay. You have opened up a whole new view of my family tree. I was not aware of Anna having Evelyn Ann. Also thank you for filling out the details for Anna's parents and siblings and further back in the past. I have often though that Anna's father would not have been C of E. Could the Brethren movement have been prevalent in that area at that time?

I will be away for a few days. I'll try to find and scan the photograph when I get back on the weekend.

Regards,

Bill.

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Hi Bill - enjoy your break.
Catch up with you on your return.
Do you have clues that Stephen and/or family were Brethren? I'm sure there were some assemblies of Brethren (Plymouth/Exclusive & perhaps Inclusive too) throughout Norfolk, but they would not have had halls/meeting rooms in every village. People would have travelled from their village to the nearest central meeting point.
If you have reason to think the family were non-C of E and non-Methodist, then this is something that can, perhaps, be investigated further.

Jay

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Here is an image of Alice's birth registration

https://familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3Alewin~%20%2Bfather_givenname%3Awilliam~%20%2Bmother_givenname%3Aanna~%20%2Bmother_surname%3Acolman~

At the bottom there is an addendum - Alice Lewin Gray, adopted by John Gray.
In the UK we would not be allowed access to this information as details of legal adoptions are held by the registrar general and not disclosed to anyone, other than the adoptee IF requested and the proper channels are used.

Our lucky day! - Stephen's birth registration gives place & date of marriage of William & Anna Maria

https://familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3Alewin~%20%2Bfather_givenname%3Awilliam~%20%2Bmother_givenname%3Aanna~%20%2Bmother_surname%3Acolman~

Jay

[Blewin]

Good evening Jay..,

I spent about a day going through my file on family items to find the picture of Anna Maria, Alice, Stephen and Noel. I was fortunate that it was still in fair condition with some cracks visible in several places. On the back of the photo there is a date written of June 1912. The photo appears to be developed on a post card so I assume there was more than one copy. I've scanned the front and back and will attempt to include them in this message. If I can't attach the pictures I will have to think of some other way to send them.

I just tried to attached the photo but it asked for a URL. I will look for site to upload the photo.

Also, I just want to clarify that it was my girlfriend Arna (also a Family Tree Forum site member) who originally found your posting. She has trained as a genealogist and was kind enough to take time away from her own family tree search to look for my family members. I would never have found your posting without her help.

Regards,

Bill.