Attempting to find the father of Harold Arran

[Devoninheaven]

Hi, Harold J Arran was my grandfather. I am trying to trace his family to build up a family tree to show our young son. I can trace his mother Norah Arran through the ages fine, but the father is another story... She was unmarried at the time she had my grandfather - I have hopefully uploaded a snippet of his birth certificate. I am reasonably confident that because she was unmarried that the father stated on the birth certificate is false (also can't find any record of Abel Blyth Arran ever existing). To add a little weight the birth was registered in Wandsworth, but Norah was registered to vote nr Chelmsford Essex between 1921 and 1924 and was head of house in 1921 again in Essex. She later married Frederick Walter Abrahams in 1925. Fredrick Abrahams subsequently passed away in 1951. Then in 1955 she travelled back to Wandsworth with a Charles Allan Gray to make a Statutory Declaration to remove the original father's details. Therefore I was wondering would it be reasonable that Charles Gray was my Great Grandfather? If that is reasonable how would I go about tracking him down using only his name - there seemed to be a lot of Charles Gray's in the late 1800s? Any thoughts gratefully received 😀.

[Anne in Carlisle]

Have you found my one name study tree called ' Arrand (Arran, Harrand) Study'? My granny was an Arrand and almost everyone with these three names are related to each other, descended from a marriage in Kippax, Yorkshire in 1640. My study tree set out to show this.

I guess you probably already know about Norah and her children, none of whom were born while Norah was married. She must have been a strong person to keep them with her in those days. I was intrigued by her story when I researched her and full of admiration for her determination.

Unfortunately you can't assume anything about your grandfather's father. The event with the birth certificate which you describe might mean Charles Gray was the father but it could mean he was just a friend supporting her at the register office.

Have you done a DNA test? With a bit of luck I think this could be a help in working out your great grandfather, although it does need other people from his family to have tested. If the test results lead back to a Gray family you would have the start for finding Charles Gray, if not you can start looking elsewhere.

Anne

[Anne in Carlisle]

Looking at FreeBMD specifically for any Charles Allan (Allen) Gray there are only two born in the time frame for Harold's birth father. Charles Allen, 1882 Gainsborough and Charles Allan, 1890 Caistor. However finding them still does not prove one of them is the father. Only DNA can do that.

Anne

[cbcarolyn]

Have you found any wills? you could get lucky and someone mentions them in their death, depends if the family knew of/ever acknowledge the father. They are only £1.50.

[cbcarolyn]

did Norah just take on the surname Arran from Flint? no marriage?

you say "Then in 1955 she travelled back to Wandsworth with a Charles Allan Gray" from where? I am finding them in Saffron Walden, which is not that close to Chelmsford. Where has this information come from?

[Anne in Carlisle]

did Norah just take on the surname Arran from Flint? no marriage?

you say "Then in 1955 she travelled back to Wandsworth with a Charles Allan Gray" from where? I am finding them in Saffron Walden, which is not that close to Chelmsford. Where has this information come from?

Norah's maiden name was Arran (derived from Arrand in a previous generation). Her MOTHER's maiden name was Flint. Have a look at my tree called ' Arrand (Arran, Harrand) Study'. The alteration to her son Harold's birth certificate was done in 1955, although Harold was born in 1923! I did send for all Norah's children's birth certificates and they are on the tree.

Anne

[Devoninheaven]

Thanks Anne, I have indeed found your family tree 😀. The stumbling block continues to be the father. I could go down the DNA route and possibly persuade my father to take it to help narrow the genetics - may have to go down this route if nothing else works out. I'll have a look at the two Charles Allan Grays you found and see if any of them may have been in Essex around the 1921 census. I know it is a bit of a stretch but for me the timing is odd, why way some 30 or so years to make the alteration to remove the father's details. Her husband had "just" died in 1951 and her son, Harold, had married my grandmother, Pamela, in 1952. These events do make me question whether she had a change of heart and wanted to correct things for him - grant you that is a bit of a jump but why bring what on the face of it seems a random stranger to quite an important event if he wasn't in some way closely involved. Incidentally, Harold's two sets of older twins did not have any changes to their birth certificates - no statutory declarations.

Thank you Carolyn, that is a good idea about her Will - hadn't thought about that - still a relative newbie. Just done a search on the government website but alas there are no records of her 😞. I had assumed as is more than likely today, she would have to travel back to the birth registration district to make the change, i.e. she couldn't make a change to a Wandsworth birth certificate in Chelmsford and would therefore need to travel back to speak to the superintendent registrar?

[Anne in Carlisle]

We have a member of this Forum who used to be a Registrar. Maybe he will be able to comment on the extraordinary nature of the time lapse of the certificate change in your first post. AntonyM ??

Anne

[AntonyM]

The first thing to check would be what father's details did Harold give (if any) when he married in 1952 - whatever it was, that may have been the catalyst for getting the record "straight".

There is no time limit on making a correction - as long as there is someone (usually two people) who are qualified and able to give the information. It doesn't necessarily mean that Charles Allan GRAY was the father of the child. Indeed, if he was his name could have been added to the record by doing a re-registration and I can't see that there was one done at the time.

So it appears she was lying when she registered the birth, and presenting herself as a married woman, using her own family names of Arran and Flint. But, when creating such a lie, it is common for some of the information to be taken from truth, rather than completely invented. So where does Abel Blyth (Arran) the timber merchant's clerk come from - it's an odd name to just pluck out of thin air ?

A quick search finds that a man called Abel BLYTHE married in Chelmsford, Essex in 1923 and that he died there in 1968 aged 77 ( so born c1891). On the 1939 register Abel BLYTHE is living in Chelmsford with a date of birth of 20th Feb 1891 and he is employed as a timber merchants manager ..... what a coincidence, given the occupation on the birth entry !

I'd be investigating him quite closely - .I think you will find he was born in Waterloo, Lancashire, nr Liverpool.

Happy New Year



( Harold's birth place, 54 Leigham Court Road in Wandsworth, was I believe a mother and baby home run by the "Mission of Hope")

[Anne in Carlisle]

Thanks very much Antony. I knew you were the one to ask!
Anne

[Devoninheaven]

Wow Anthony, what an amazing insight! I had never once considered such a possibility and had assumed that it had all been made up - you know what they say about assumptions.

It has opened up an avenue I hadn't considered and ever so grateful for your well thought points, definitely seems to be a lot of coincidences. Genuinely felt like I had met a brick wall but this opens up something new to investigate.

Thank you so very much, and Happy New Year 😀

[AntonyM]

Just one more suggestion - if that is the right Abel BLYTHE, then when he died in 1968 he left a will. I'd be checking that to see if Harold got a mention ?

[Devoninheaven]

Thanks again Antony. Ordered a copy of the marriage certificate so will see what it says - interestingly this was 3 years before the change in his birth certificate.

Just on the Will front. I have checked the .gov.uk website and can see the probate and the sum of £13,016 left. Although noting that his wife (they had no children) outlived him, how do you actual find/view an old Will, had thought it might be via the .gov.uk website but that doesn't seem to provide the necessary details.

[Anne in Carlisle]

You have to buy the will from the Gov website but it is only £1.50. The site can be annoyingly glitchy so don't give up. Also the email with the full will doesn't get delivered immediately. Patience required! Hope it is worth it!
Anne

[Darksecretz]

Devoninheaven here's the link for the probate page. Good luck!

https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/

[cbcarolyn]

As usual the website is not finding it, you just need to continue on and complete all the details, and it will just add to the basket and you can order it.

[Devoninheaven]

Thank you both, had gotten as far as viewing the image on the website but had thought that ordering something would just give me same information. But have persisted and ordered a copy so fingers crossed. Thank you everyone for your patience and help - greatly appreciated. 🤗

[webwiz]

It is another tribute to this forum that a newby can get a solution to a vexing problem so quickly.

[Devoninheaven]

Thanks again everyone for being so helpful.

I have in the background been actioning a number of possibilities. Having hoped the marriage certificate would confirm a few things turns out it has raised more questions, the certificate cites a different father to the birth. I suspect that she had to tweak the name as her actual husband who had died the year previous had the surname Abrahams which would stood out on the paperwork so she possibility modified the name and kept her maiden name. I have tried to jot everything down on a timeline (hopefully attached). I do still struggle to wonder why a 71 year old would suddenly feel the urge to change her son's birth certificate unless the marriage of her son a few years prior triggered something that the 2 weren't aligned and it needed to be corrected. I suspect this is about as far as it can go without some form of DNA test and hope that it might uncover the route, would people agree?

[Anne in Carlisle]

The timeline looks to be a good summary. I'm curious to know what father's name Harold put on his marriage certificate? Perhaps the difference between the fathers on his birth and marriage certificates was causing some friction if your grandmother saw them both? It would certainly raise eyebrows!
Anne