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Photographs, fashion and family links in Canterbury.

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    Photographs, fashion and family links in Canterbury.

    I'm very excited about a new discovery and therefore a new line of research so I thought I'd share it with you.

    My husband's family are from Canterbury and his gt grandfather was a tobacconist and tea dealer in the town over several decades in the late 1800s. I have researched them a bit but not in great depth - they are the family in this thread https://www.familytreeforum.com/foru...tra-grandchild

    Having written up their story I put them aside and got on with my own family research but I wanted to re-visit it because we have a very old leather bound album with about 40-50 photographs of family members. Wouldn't it be great to work out who they are?!

    So for xmas I got Jayne Shrimpton's book on Fashion and Family History and I sat down armed with that and the fashion gallery on here to start putting approximate dates to the photos. Before that though I had a look at the backs of a couple of them and got the photographer's name C M Drayson of Canterbury. I googled that and it took me to the Historic Canterbury website http://www.machadoink.com/ I have used this before in my previous research and for anyone who has Canterbury ancestors it is an absolute treasure trove of information and pictures.

    As well as letting me know the dates that Drayson was working as a photographer, there was a little bit of biographical information about him and one of the facts was that prior to becoming a photographer he was a tea dealer and tobacconist. Bells started to ring! Loudly! Surely the two families - my Barbers and the Draysons must have known of each other. Then another distant bell started to jingle... have I heard the Drayson name before? ... off to my family tree and yes, sure enough Lizzie Drayson was living with the Barber family in the 1891 census and was listed as a cousin! Result!

    So now I have another huge line of fresh research to follow up to see how the two families are connected. (Saving this for a rainy day so please don't post any discoveries on here ) And it certainly explains why the Barbers had such an extensive collection of family photos - they were related to the local photographer! I just wish someone had written some names on the backs.

    There's always something new to learn, isn't there?

    Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

    #2
    A few of the ladies have very distinctive black adornments on their dresses but I have not been able to find any similar images to date them. Any thoughts?

    IMG_1510.jpg IMG_1517.jpg IMG_1534.jpg

    They might all be the same person? I haven't studied their faces yet as I've been concentrating on the fashion dates.
    Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

    Comment


      #3
      How wonderful to have been able to make that connection, and to give you another branch of your OH's family to mine.

      I have photos of my late 2nd cousin's mother's family from Notts/Derbyshire and I've just been researching an album which belonged to OH's grandfather's mistress, I have identified some people but they are not really of any interest to me.

      Comment


        #4
        I have 2 albums, no idea who most of them are! I have scanned them back and front, always hoping that one day a relative will pop up with some similar ones!

        Did you find the book worth getting?
        Carolyn
        Family Tree site

        Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
        Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

        Comment


          #5
          Initially I was a bit disappointed because the words : pictures ratio is a bit high. I was hoping to be able to flick through decades of images to match up my photos but there is a lot of text which I have only very briefly looked at but I think it might be quite interesting if I knuckle down and read it!

          I'll let you know.....
          Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

          Comment


            #6
            I think I would expect more pictures. I do think some of the photos are really hard as they are staged so much, and not their normal clothes/scenery. I don't have many that are not in a studio.
            Carolyn
            Family Tree site

            Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
            Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

            Comment


              #7
              Also, I read somewhere that if the clothes are their own, they may be 10 or more years out of fashion because people had a set of 'best' clothes which they kept for many years (I know the feeling ). Or if they don’t own 'best clothes' they might be wearing clothes provided by the photography studio.
              Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

              Comment


                #8
                Gardengirl What a wonderful thing to have. I had no photos at all of my father’s side apart from his parents in adulthood. Then some years ago, a cousin sent me a disc with loads on that his mother had had in her house. She was Daddy’s eldest sibling and Gran had gone to live with her a few years after she was widowed. I now knew what my direct line paternal GT grandparents looked like plus my 2x GGF on the male side but nothing at all for Gran’s side. There were quite a few unknown people amongst them so I photocopied them and sent them down to a relative in Kidsgrove, Staffordshire whose father has always broken his journey north in his lorry at our house. He didn’t know much but passed them to a sister and I was stunned to discover that one of them showed my GGrandparents Harrison and another two were my Gran’s mother and some children and her father in a long straight tailcoat style suit sitting in a huge chair. It was a great day when that letter arrived! I can see now where Gran got her looks from.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Gardengirl My g'g'grandfather and g'g'g'grandfather were photographers in Devon. I've had some luck identifying people in their photos by connecting with cousins.
                  Yes, most of the photos were taken in a studio. Cameras weren't very portable, the lighting was carefully set up, and the subject had to hold still. Photographers had "sitting books" but few of those survive.

                  I've seen a photo of a photographer's studio from that era. It was pretty cool.

                  Great finds - and good luck with your research!
                  ------------------------------------------------------
                  My Families
                  London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                  Comment


                    #10
                    PhotoFamily some of my photos were taken in Devon
                    https://familytree.chatandthat.co.uk...ls.php?album=3
                    Carolyn
                    Family Tree site

                    Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                    Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                    Comment


                      #11
                      It's always worth asking cousins if they have any old pics or recognise yours.....i got into contact with the families of my gran's cousins years ago. All the first cousins were dead, gran being the youngest in that generation, but they all sent photo's of her grandparents we had never seen before. She was thrilled. And so were they, as we could name them! They then knew which side was shared and which was the opposite.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post
                        Very interesting - you have quite a collection! But the closest geographically to mine would be Exeter, I think. And my g'g'grandfather did try to make a go of it in Bristol, but soon immigrated to the US. I think it was a tough living to make, probably with plenty of competition.
                        ------------------------------------------------------
                        My Families
                        London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I'd be interested in your thoughts on this one. I think it's a boy from the hair style and boots. When I zoomed in I was intrigued by the object on the table. Any suggestions about what it is and what it might signify?

                          IMG_1518 (3).jpg

                          IMG_1518 (2).jpg

                          Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

                          Comment


                            #14
                            First thought before I saw the enlargement was a Glengarry type hat, but in the close up it looks more solid.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Even if you figure out what it is, it's unlikely that you can determine whether it is a photo studio prop or actually part of the apparel for the portrait subject. Even prop clothing was part of the studio.

                              That aside - have you scanned at the highest DPI that you can? These old photos had very solid inking, and it has amazed me how much detail can be derived zooming in on a high density scan.
                              ------------------------------------------------------
                              My Families
                              London-area Coverly Family Finder DNA Project

                              Comment


                                #16
                                I agree that you often can’t tell which objects belong to the subject of the photo but I feel that something like that was put there for a reason. I wondered if it was to signify a dead father, someone to be proud of killed in a war maybe, but it is very solid looking for a hat.

                                At the moment these are just photos taken with my phone because it will be quite a job to take each one out of the album to scan them properly. They are a very tight fit in the cardboard holders, a few are already a bit torn and I don’t want to do any more damage.
                                Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  This is a slight tangent, a common feature of my researching, but whilst looking for information about Victorian fashions I came across this website about the Adventures of Kate Tattersall. I had never heard of her but the website has lots of background information about Victorian life in the Articles section which includes some information about clothing, fashions, make up and much much more. Interesting background reading.

                                  http://www.katetattersall.com/category/kate-articles/
                                  Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Further musings on this album and the people in it lead me to printing out close ups of all of the faces to see if any are the same person more than once, or whether there were any obvious family likenesses. So now I have 47 A5 sheets to play happy families with!

                                    My first thought was to sort them into children, older generation, men and women. Some of the men had a kind of familial look and one particularly handsome one stood out as being different (and I thought he looked a bit familiar to me maybe?).

                                    Amongst the pictures of women was one who I think is wearing a wedding dress and this led me to wonder if it might be her album, or her mother's. I had been thinking along the male line, that the album came from the Barber family, but actually I think the women were more likely to compile and keep an album of family photos. And in this case DRAYSON, the photographer's name, is also the maiden name of John BARBER's mother in law.

                                    My next thought was to compare images that I know are John BARBER and his wife Eiza nee CRISP with the images that caught my eye in the album and this is where I would like your thoughts. I know it is too easy to convince yourself of something that you really want to be true.

                                    So are these the same people?

                                    First is John and Eliza at their Golden wedding 1935. Second is John and Eliza with their children c1905

                                    IMG_2273.jpg IMG_2274.jpg

                                    And these are the two from the album that I think might also be John and Eliza ?

                                    IMG_1509 crop.jpgIMG_1539 crop.jpg

                                    And this is their son Reginald who I think looks like the man in the album.

                                    reg.JPG

                                    Or am I just imagining?
                                    Attached Files
                                    Main research interests.. CAESAR (Surrey and London), GOODALL (London), SKITTERALL, WOODWARD (Middlesex and London), BARBER (Canterbury, Kent), DRAYSON (Canterbury, Kent), CRISP (Kent) and CHEESEMAN (Kent).

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Am I imagining things but is there not a tool somewhere that looks for the “same” faces and also at different ages in photos? MyHeritage is ringing a vague bell but not at all certain.

                                      UPDATE I think this is what I was thinking of

                                      https://www.familytreemagazine.com/w...ompare-a-face/

                                      FURTHER UPDATE
                                      Here’s another one that I have just found. Item 5 in the list.

                                      https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/3-fasc...-search-faces/

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        I think the older photos are another couple, the young man's hair has receded more than John's in 1905.

                                        Comment

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