Joseph Charles Fricker

[zoomer]

I have added the wills to each person as I've found them Amelia - you can click on them to open up the transcription and then the image.

Where do I find these wills? Are they with the family tree on ancestry? I noticed that you know the date and place of death for JLF, but I was not sure where you got the information. I trust that it is accurate information, as you say you posted the wills, but I am just wondering why there was no official death record to be found in the usual places. Not that it really matters if I have access to the wills, once I figure out how to do that. My mind is not as sharp as usual for reasons I don't wish to share publicly. I need to have things spelled out in detail for now. I should have completely recovered my faculties before Christmas.

[zoomer]

Thanks again Kat. Someone's added Felix!

OC

Wasn't me. I'm not even sure if I could figure out how to do so.

[zoomer]

Zoomer, Kat gave you the exact date of death on post 337 for Joshua Leslie Field.

OC

Yes, I was aware of that and happy to have the information. I wasn't sure if I might need additional info for a search the probate records. I have never searched a probate record in my life and may need my half-cousin's help to do so. I did find a birth record for JLF and the town of birth was different from what was on the tree so I changed it. Probably there was a village near a town that would explain the discrepancies. Now I don't recall what Kat had originally put - I should have written it down!

[Olde Crone Holden]

Zoomer

JLF's death is there on Freebmd, June q 1954 Joshua L Field 97 Cuckfield 5h 172.


Kat got the exact date of death from the probate record, see post 337.

OC

[Olde Crone Holden]

Zoomer, it occurs to me that you will need to buy the marriage certificate for Charles Edward Saunders and Terence Elsie Hedges in order to take their tree back further as there are simply too many Charles Edward Saunders to choose from- and not one Terence Elsie Hedges, lol.

OC

[Katarzyna]

Do you think this maybe Terence Elsie Hedges?
1911

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=2352&h=51531747&tid=154932941&pid=172049266663&hid=1042252795179&usePUB=true&_phsrc=hzz219&_phstart=default&usePUBJs=true

Joseph Hedges 40
Catherine Hedges 35
Lilian May Hedges 14
Alfred William Hedges 12
Elsie Hedges 8 b Newhaven, Sussex
Harold Lenord Hedges 3

24 Ship Street Shoreham By Sea

Name: Elsie Hedges
Registration Year: 1902
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Volume: 2b Page: 177
Registration district: Newhaven
Inferred County:Sussex

[Katarzyna]

Where do I find these wills? Are they with the family tree on ancestry? I noticed that you know the date and place of death for JLF, but I was not sure where you got the information. I trust that it is accurate information, as you say you posted the wills, but I am just wondering why there was no official death record to be found in the usual places. Not that it really matters if I have access to the wills, once I figure out how to do that. My mind is not as sharp as usual for reasons I don't wish to share publicly. I need to have things spelled out in detail for now. I should have completely recovered my faculties before Christmas.

Hi Amelia,
When you open up the tree are you seeing this?

Capture 1.JPG

If so click on one of the icons - I have circled Telford Charles Field. A pop up box will appear so click on PROFILE. You should then see this:

Capture 2.JPG

To see the will - Click on View then on View Image.

You need to practise navigating around. You can click on the censuses etc listed above the will and open up them up to view. Click on the icons next to the parents or siblings on the right hand side to open them up. I have changed your status so you can move around and view everything but you can't add or delete so you don't need to worry about making a mistake.
Let me know if you can't work it out.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Kat

(Post 406)

Yes, looks like a good possibility but of course only the cert will tell. Up to Zoomer to decide if she wants to get it, or perhaps her dna contact might have it already.

OC

[zoomer]

Zoomer

JLF's death is there on Freebmd, June q 1954 Joshua L Field 97 Cuckfield 5h 172.


Kat got the exact date of death from the probate record, see post 337.

OC

Okay. Thank you.

[zoomer]

Hi Amelia,
When you open up the tree are you seeing this?

[ATTACH=CONFIG]19358[/ATTACH]

If so click on one of the icons - I have circled Telford Charles Field. A pop up box will appear so click on PROFILE. You should then see this:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]19359[/ATTACH]

To see the will - Click on View then on View Image.

You need to practise navigating around. You can click on the censuses etc listed above the will and open up them up to view. Click on the icons next to the parents or siblings on the right hand side to open them up. I have changed your status so you can move around and view everything but you can't add or delete so you don't need to worry about making a mistake.
Let me know if you can't work it out.

Thanks again, Kat!

[zoomer]

Zoomer, it occurs to me that you will need to buy the marriage certificate for Charles Edward Saunders and Terence Elsie Hedges in order to take their tree back further as there are simply too many Charles Edward Saunders to choose from- and not one Terence Elsie Hedges, lol.

OC

Okay. I will first see what results my own DNA test produces to see if the name SAUNDERS shows up again. I'm not sure how anyone with this name connects in any way to the FIELD family. I think, based on what I know, that there are 3 possibilities: 1) A young woman named Saunders, yet unknown, worked for someone in the Field family and became pregnant. 2) A woman who was biologically a Saunders but due to illegitimacy or some tragedy was raised as a Cooper from birth, and she became pregnant by Joshua or Kenneth or another Field brother (grandsons of Joshua Field I) 3) My half-cousin has some unknown Saunders ancestor related only to her that she never knew about, though I think she knows the family tree branches of her other 3 grandparents well enough that this is unlikely. I trust her judgement on this.

Until I have more information from my own DNA test (let's hope!) I will not be purchasing any marriage records. I don't see how C.E. Saunders & Terence Elsie Hedges connect to the Field family in any way unless someone can explain how it is possible. I will be presently suprised if I learn more than the names of some long lost Bates cousins in the USA from my DNA results. The ones I'm descended from left England in the mid-19th century. It would be hard to know which Thomas Bates of that period was my g-g-grandfather as it is such a common name and I don,t even know the county he came from.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Zoomer

It is because we cannot yet see any connection between the Field family and the Saunders family that you would need to purchase certificates to go back further to see where the connection might be. But of course, that is up to you and if you would rather wait until your own dna results are through then that is fine. We will still be here!

OC

[zoomer]

Zoomer

It is because we cannot yet see any connection between the Field family and the Saunders family that you would need to purchase certificates to go back further to see where the connection might be. But of course, that is up to you and if you would rather wait until your own dna results are through then that is fine. We will still be here!

OC

Okay. I could ask my half-cousin what she thinks about purchasing marriage certificates. Do you know how much they cost? I imagine that she too may want to wait for my DNA results first, but I could ask her.

[zoomer]

Zoomer

It is because we cannot yet see any connection between the Field family and the Saunders family that you would need to purchase certificates to go back further to see where the connection might be. But of course, that is up to you and if you would rather wait until your own dna results are through then that is fine. We will still be here!

OC

By the way, did you or anyone find any COOPER domestic employee connected in any way to the FIELD family? I ask because of the possibility that a young woman domestic named Cooper could have been adopted and was biologically a Saunders - her family could have lived further away and not have been connected to the FIELD family. I recall that my half-cousin told me that she was in touch with someone related to a Saunders who had lived on the Isle of Wight, where William is first known to have lived (in Cowes). But she never heard back from them. What is someone named SAUNDERS gave birth there and the baby was adopted by a gardener's family named COOPER on the mainland? Or anyone in domestic service as the legend of the gardener's daughter may not be reliable. The IOW connection makes me think that the SAUNDERS name is not very likely to be a missing branch on my half-cousin's tree that is related to one of her other 3 grandparents.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Zoomer

Just because your dna does not match with any Coopers doesn't mean a thing other than the relevant Coopers have not had their dna tested.

We have not gone back far enough on the Saunders side to see if there were any Coopers involved - the mother of William would have been born before about 1880 ish and we have only got back to 1901. Saunders married Coopers but that was well into the 20th century.

The Field/Noble family employed gardeners at Selby House but unless we can get access to the journals it's unlikely we will ever find out what they were called.

OC

[Olde Crone Holden]

Sorry, didn't answer your question about marriage certs. They are £6 for an online uncertified copy from the gro site.

OC

[Katarzyna]

oops OC! Marriage certs are only available as a postal copy from the GRO which cost £9.25. Birth and Death certs cost £6 for a pdf downloaded cert if available. Births 1837 - 1917 and deaths 1837 - 1957

[Olde Crone Holden]

Ooh, sorry! Don't know where my brain went then!

OC

[zoomer]

Zoomer

Just because your dna does not match with any Coopers doesn't mean a thing other than the relevant Coopers have not had their dna tested.

We have not gone back far enough on the Saunders side to see if there were any Coopers involved - the mother of William would have been born before about 1880 ish and we have only got back to 1901. Saunders married Coopers but that was well into the 20th century.

The Field/Noble family employed gardeners at Selby House but unless we can get access to the journals it's unlikely we will ever find out what they were called.

OC

Thank you, OC, for filling in some of the blanks. I'm geting a more complete understanding of all the possibilities. I just hope my DNA reslts give me some new piece of info about William's mother, whatever her name might have been.

[zoomer]

I have drawn up a tree on Ancestry . If anyone wants to look - pm me an email address or Ancestry username

I have been looking at the tree in more detail. I am amazed that Emma Jessie Evans, b 1889, wife of Joshua Field II (1828-1904) was able give birth to 12 children!! But she has no death date. Is it absolutely certain that she had all 12 children? Could there possibly have been a 2nd wife? I hope I can find out the year, at lest, of her death. Also I note that her mother-in-law was Matilda Evans (1796-1874) and I wonder if Emma and Matilda were not too closely related cousins with the same last name, or if it is merely coincidental that they share the name EVANS.