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  • #21
    1891 census:

    Name Age

    Joseph G Hole 36, head
    Emma J Hole 37, wife

    Children:
    Joseph Geo Hole 13
    Louisa E Hole 13
    Annie E Hole 10
    Alice H Hole 9
    Charlotte A Hole 7
    Margaret L Hole 6
    Frederick Chas Hole 5
    Alfred J Hole 4
    Dorothy M Hole 2
    Edward T Hole 8 months

    Father Joseph is a police constable, and they're living at Caldwell Cott., Chobham, Surrey.

    Class: RG12; Piece: 554; Folio 119; Page 3
    Last edited by Mary from Italy; 10-03-08, 11:07.

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    • #22
      In 1901 Dorothy's still at home with her parents and some of her siblings, and Alice is a housemaid in the home of a university professor.

      That narrows down Dorothy's emigration at least to 1901-1909.

      Comment


      • #23
        I think Harry died in Muswellbrook in 1955, son of Harry William and Sophia Ann Green, which matches the following 1881 census entry:


        Name Age

        Harry Green 30, head
        Ann Sophia Green 31, wife

        Children:
        Harry Green 8
        George Green 7
        Frederick Green 1

        Father Harry is a coach maker, and they're living at 1 House 3 Court, Buckingham Street, Birmingham.

        Class: RG11; Piece: 2992; Folio: 31; Page: 6
        Last edited by Mary from Italy; 10-03-08, 11:07.

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        • #24
          That still leaves the mystery of why Victor has the surname Green and says Harry jr's his brother, when his mother's Alice Terry née Hole. Does your father have any idea of what the explanation might be?

          Libby, I seem to remember the NSW Federation Disc goes up to 1918, which would include Victor's birth. Would Peter be able to access it at a library in Victoria?
          Last edited by Mary from Italy; 10-03-08, 11:18.

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          • #25
            No sign of Harry and his family on the 1891 English census, and it looks as though they sailed to Sydney on the Aberdeen in 1886:

            State Records NSW - Online search
            Last edited by Mary from Italy; 10-03-08, 13:03.

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            • #26
              Possible emigration details for Alice and Dorothy (these passengers travelled as unassisted immigrants to Victoria):

              MISS DOROTHY HOLE, aged 19, FEB 1908, MARATHON
              MISS A H HOLE, aged 26, JAN 1909, PERICLES

              Index to Unassisted Inward Passenger Lists to Victoria 1852-1923

              They travelled on different ships for some reason, and there was no-one else called Hole travelling with either of them.

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by Harrys mum View Post
                Pete,

                Can't find Dorothy's birth in Qld, NSW,Tas,WA. Vic only goes to 1888 on the CD I have.

                I'd buy the marriage cert for Harry and Dorothy. Do you know how to do that online?

                That will give you:
                Age of both
                Place of birth of both
                Parents of both (including mother's maiden name)
                Both fathers' occupations.

                When you have that you'll know where to start looking for births. Somritmes that cert will get you back a fair way.
                If I've understood correctly, that's a NSW event?

                In that case, you can save some money (if you aren't trying to prove anything for legal purposes) by getting a transcription done, instead of buying a cert. NSW has a list of authorised transcribers.
                NSW Registry of Births Deaths & Marriages
                I used Marilyn Rowan - web address Birth Death and Marriage Certificates and Records Transcription Agent - and was very happy with the outcome.

                NSW Registry of Births Deaths & Marriages
                explains about ordering actual certs online (cheaper than other means).

                Christine
                __________________________________________________ _______________________________________
                In this context, I'm researching:
                Thomas Waldren CHRISTMAS and descendants (mainly QLD); SCANTLEBURY, ROWE, CAMERON (mainly TAS) - these are sidelines, so I'm not chasing these.
                AND, separately, for another tree:
                FRIEDMAN/FREEMAN, COHEN, MARKS, JONES (mainly NSW and VIC)
                Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

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                • #28
                  Gee, you have been busy while I've slept.LOL.

                  Christine...........you can save money buying the transcription. I'm not sure of the cost now. The cert is $26 if ordered online....$33 if not.
                  I prefer the certs for direct line as I have that actual certificate. I've never bought a transcription but have been given a few. Not all of them have all the info. Some have not got the mother's name and maiden name on marriage certs.
                  That may have been just the ones I have and that might not be on those particular certs either.
                  If the info is the same, then go for the transcription and you can afford more.

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                  • #29
                    Transcriptions should have exactly the same information as a cert. They cost about AUS $15 now.

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                    • #30
                      Thanks Mary..........

                      I haven't seen the NSW Federation disc. but I'd say any of the Family History groups or council library would have it.

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                      • #31
                        hi

                        no i dont know how to do this at all to buy the marriage papers

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                        • #32
                          Christine explains in post 27 how to get a transcription from an authorised agent, which is the cheapest way.

                          If you prefer to have an actual certificate, search for the marriage here:

                          NSW Registry of Births, Deaths and Marriages - Historical Index Search

                          and click on "Buy now" when you find it.

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                          • #33
                            Dorothy M Hole was born in england. Where did u get the death date of Victor Noel Green?

                            where do u search for the information

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                            • #34
                              Harry William Green b 1872 and Dorothy M Hole 1889 where do u search in england then it is a free service

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                              • #35
                                what is the NSW BDM site ?? love to get the death papers of victor raykoolstra54@optusnet.com.au

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                                • #36
                                  no sorry he doesnt remember much at all my fathers father divorced and remarried

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                                  • #37
                                    Hi Peter.

                                    Here is the NSW BDM site. You just click whether you want births and deaths or marriages, then add what you know. If nothing comes up, take some of your info out and try again. It is fairly sensitive to spelling and dates.


                                    NSW Registry of Births Deaths & Marriages


                                    Also up the top of this forum you will see "The WIKI" Click on that and have a look around. If you get stuck, put up a new thread with WIKI in the title and someone will walk you through it. IT has a lot of links to Australian sites. If you can, try to come on the site either late at night or early morning as most here are in UK so are sleeping now.

                                    Just yell if you get stuck.

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                                    • #38
                                      Originally posted by Peter Green View Post
                                      Harry William Green b 1872 and Dorothy M Hole 1889 where do u search in england then it is a free service
                                      Hi Peter,

                                      If you read through the thread from the beginning you'll see that we've given all the references you need to search for the various births, marriages and deaths. Just click on the links you're interested in (the words underlined in blue).

                                      NSW Births, Marriages and Deaths

                                      As Libby said, you can search for them free here:

                                      NSW Registry of Births, Deaths and Marriages - Historical Index Search

                                      We've explained earlier in the thread how to get a certificate. Australian certificates contain a lot more information than English ones; death certificates in particular are a mine of information.


                                      English Births, Marriages and Deaths

                                      It's free to search for them at this site:

                                      FreeBMD - Search

                                      which goes up to about 1920.

                                      That's where I found the births of Harry, Dorothy and Alice that I gave you earlier in the thread.

                                      If you want more information than the brief details given on that site, you have to buy the certificate, which will cost £7 if you order it online from the official GRO site:

                                      Registration Services - Certificate Ordering Service

                                      This site explains what information you'll find on English certificates:

                                      Birth Certificate Tutorials


                                      English censuses

                                      You'll be able to trace your family back a lot further and get some interesting information by searching the English censuses. I gave you some information from the 1891 and 1901 censuses earlier in the thread.

                                      You can search the 1881 census free here:

                                      FamilySearch.org - Search

                                      but for other censuses you'll need a subscription to Ancestry. It's quite expensive (about £70 a year), but well worth it if you decide you want to research your family history seriously. You can get a 14-day free trial; you have to give your credit card details, but if you cancel before the 14 days are up, no money is taken from your card.

                                      The Australian subscription gives you access to the English censuses and BMDs and some Australian electoral rolls and emigration information:

                                      Genealogy, Family Trees and Family History Records online - Ancestry.com.au
                                      Last edited by Mary from Italy; 11-03-08, 07:39.

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                                      • #39
                                        Do you know anything about Alice's husband Roland Elwood Terry? He's a bit mysterious. His army service record's online (it looks as though he had some impressive tattoos ):

                                        RecordSearch - National Archives of Australia

                                        but the only other reference I can find to him is in the NSW marriage index when he married Alice.

                                        He said in his service record that he was aged 44 and born in Harrogate, England. I can't find any trace of a birth for him in England under that name. He also says he was in the Grenadier Guards and Gordon Highlanders, which are Scottish regiments, but I can't see a birth for him in Scotland either.

                                        I can't see him on the Australian electoral rolls; the NSW electoral rolls are online for 1930 and 1936, and Alice Terry is there, but not Roland.

                                        I don't have a subscription that gives me full details of the electoral rolls; if anyone has the Ancestry World or Australian sub it might be interesting to see who Alice was living with.

                                        It looks as though Roland either died (but I haven't found a death for him in NSW or England) or moved to another Australian state (not all of them have complete BMD records online), or possibly went under another name at some point.
                                        Last edited by Mary from Italy; 11-03-08, 07:45.

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                                        • #40
                                          problem is i am on disabilty dont have a gredit card. Harry William Green b 1851 married Sophia Ann how do i find out her surname she was born in 1850

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