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My Bates family tree

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  • My Bates family tree

    I have misplaced information about my American grandfather. I know the following: he was born Feb 3, 1895 in Traverse City, Grand Traverse Co., Michigan, USA & married April 17, 1920 in Highland Park, Wayne Co., Michigan. I am trying to find his death record for 1954. I believe he died in West Virginia. familysearch.org does not have the record. I would also like to know how to search US death records for free.

    There were two families named Bates that settled in Traverse City, Michigan in the 1800s. Frederick William's grandfather was named Thomas Bates, not to be confused with the one with the same name who was born in the state of New York. Our Thomas was born in England but I don't currently know where or when. Frederick's father was Thomas C. Bates. I know little about him. The line is as follows: Thomas, Thomas C., Frederick William, Robert William, then me.

    Frederick Wm. was married to Ruth Permilly Dalzell, a descendant of the Dalzells of Armagh County, Ulster. Our Dalzells settled in Pennsylvania about 1700. Her grandfather was Lt. Major John Dalzell of Ohio, Ohio 5th Cavlary, (Union side) in the Civil War.
    Amelia

    My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

  • #2
    West Virginia Death Index

    William Fredrick Bates
    Born about 1895

    Died 10 December 1953
    Cabell Co, W Virginia

    Aged 58

    Father Thomas Bates
    Mother Josephine Allgaier

    FHL film no 559884

    Vera
    Last edited by vera2013; 22-04-18, 23:43.

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    • #3
      WV historic records are also available for free online. Choose your man from this list - I think there are two records for him:



      click on the item that you want, then click "View the record image" in the upper left hand corner.
      -or- just click on the index's file size, right column and it will take you directly to the image...
      Last edited by PhotoFamily; 23-04-18, 03:04.

      Comment


      • #4
        accessing US records for free...
        well, you can sign up for two weeks initial membership on ancestry for free - be sure to cancel before the two weeks are up
        familysearch.org is free, but you do need to register (free)
        your local family history center will have free access to many subscription websites, including Ancestry, fold3, MyHeritage, NewspaperArchives, New England (ugh, can't remember what they call themselves now), and more
        your local public library will often have free access to ancestry (but not as extensive access as the one at an FHC)
        google will often turn up records (like obits!) without charge - but it's very limited and area specific
        many public libraries and genealogy societies in the region where your ancestor lived will provide free or low cost look ups.

        the reference section here may provide more location-specific resources.

        wiki.familysearch.org also provides information about local resources.

        Did your CivWar ancestor or his widow apply for a CW Pension? The indexes are definitely on Ancestry, and I think on FS also. Records are starting to be scanned - otherwise, you have to get them retrieved from NARA in Washington DC. FS's wiki has good info about retrieval from NARA.

        Comment


        • #5
          And, like Canada, there is no one central location to store death records in the US.

          SSDI (Social Security Death Index) is often used as a substitute, and the index is on Ancestry and FS. Really nice - ancestry now has an index/transcription of SS application info. SS started in 1932, and enrollment was not for everyone at that time. In fact, it's still not mandatory, but life would be nigh impossible without it.

          Grave stones (try Findagrave or BillionGraves or ??) and obits are sometimes a substitute for DC info.

          Otherwise, you need to work state by state and sometimes county by county to find a DC. And privacy moratoriums make DC retrieval difficult - Privacy laws vary by state. You'll see on the WV site that they hold records for 50 years post death. Some states are the same, a few are pretty short.
          Last edited by PhotoFamily; 23-04-18, 03:21.

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          • #6
            Thank you for the information.

            Originally posted by vera2013 View Post
            West Virginia Death Index

            William Fredrick Bates
            Born about 1895

            Died 10 December 1953
            Cabell Co, W Virginia

            Aged 58

            Father Thomas Bates
            Mother Josephine Allgaier

            FHL film no 559884

            Vera
            I thank you for the information. It turns out that last night I found where I had recorded the information, next to a map of West Virginia in my old set of World Book Encyclopedias which I had turned to to try to see if I would recognize the name of the town where he died. From some other source I had learned that he died in Barboursville. Everything else in your record is exactly the same as mine.

            Now I am stuck trying to find out information about William's in-laws. Also I had forgotten that he was William Frederick & not Frederick William. He was always called Bill, just like my British-born grandfather.

            His wife was Ruth Permelia Dalzell - she was called Permilly. I know her birth date - July 17th, 1892, they were married April 17th, 1920 & she died December 20, 1928. I am having difficulty finding anything about her parents:

            John Dalzell Jr. He was probably born c. 1865-70 in Leelanau Co., Michigan s/o Lt. Major John Dalzell who was granted the land there after the American Civil War.

            His father, the Major, was probably born circa 1835. He became a Captain of one cavalry unit in Ohio, then at the end of the war when most of his men had died (many died of stupid things like dysentary & not in battle) he was made a major of the Ohio 5th Cavalry. I'm looking for his dates too. I have forgotten his wife's name.

            John Dalzell Jr. married Lucy Addie Mae Tuller. She was born c. 1870 in Rice Lake, Wisconsin. She had a sister Florence who married a brother of John Jr.
            Amelia

            My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

            Comment


            • #7
              Thank you, I will try this link.

              The ancestry.com option is not feasible for me & I do all my research online and do not have easy access to a family history center. Google is not as helpful as they once were for genealogy. I would like to look more into Civil War records.
              Amelia

              My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

              Comment


              • #8
                The reply (with quotes) I sent was incomplete. It will be updated soon. Thank you for your help.
                Amelia

                My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

                Comment


                • #9
                  There is a tree on Family Search which gives details of John Dalzell Jnr. It is well sourced. According to the marriage record which includes the image, John Jr was born in Lima, Ohio

                  Marriage Elmwood, Leelanau Co, Michigan
                  18 Dec 1888

                  John Jr Dalzell, Farmer
                  Born Lima, Ohio 1858, aged 30
                  Father John Dalzell
                  Mother Elizabeth Grove

                  Married

                  Lucy Addie May Fuller, Domestic Helper born Wisconsin 1870 aged 18
                  Father C P Fuller
                  Mother Minnie Doan

                  As Photofamily has said you will need to register.

                  Vera

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    On Ancestry death cert

                    Traverse City Hospital

                    Informant State Hospital Records

                    John Dalzell, Elmwood , Leelanau Co

                    Died 13/01/1930 Aged 72

                    Divorced

                    Born 16th May 1857 Ohio

                    Farmer

                    Father John Dalzell b Penn
                    Mother maiden name Grove

                    Buried Oakwood, Traverse City 21/01/1930

                    Cause of death bronco-pneumonia. Contributing factor Gangrene.

                    Vera
                    Last edited by vera2013; 24-04-18, 07:58.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thank you for the information. The actual family name is Tuller but it is easy to confuse a T & an F from old handwritten documents. Lucy's mother's actual name was Amelia. She may have used a nickname. I knew that John Jr.'s father was born in Lima, Ohio, but I did not realize that he had family living there when he went off to war in 1861. This is new information for which I am grateful. I had assumed that he had married after the war & married & had kids later in Michigan.
                      Amelia

                      My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I think the 1857 birth date is probably more accurate as it includes a month & date. I had not realized he died a rather gruesome death! I know the father (The Civil War officer) had been born in Pennsyvania. If my memory can be trusted, his mother's name was Margaret Glass. The first record of a Dalzell arrival in Pennsyvania is about 1700. THanks again!
                        Amelia

                        My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by zoomer View Post

                          There were two families named Bates that settled in Traverse City, Michigan in the 1800s. Frederick William's grandfather was named Thomas Bates, not to be confused with the one with the same name who was born in the state of New York. Our Thomas was born in England but I don't currently know where or when. Frederick's father was Thomas C. Bates. I know little about him. The line is as follows: Thomas, Thomas C., Frederick William, Robert William, then me.
                          I have to correct my original BATES post. My great-grandfather's full name was Thomas C. Hopkins BATES, son of Susan HOPKINS (d/o Robert HOPKINS) and he was the father of Frederick William. Thomas BATES was not the grandfather of Frederick William, who went by the name, Bill.

                          Thomas C. was conceived and born well before Susan married Thomas BATES who was not his biological father. I don't know what the initial C. stands for. Susan was a teenager when she gave birth.

                          DNA testing didn't give me enough information to determine who his biological father was which is frustrating. My father's father's line is unknown.

                          I learned this from a distant cousin who is also a genealogist. She is related to Susan's mother whose name was HOLDSWORTH. Her mother was from Yorkshire. If memory serves me, her first name was Susannah.

                          Amelia

                          My avatar is my grandfather William as a baby. His origins are shrouded in mystery.....

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            lovely to see you zoomer
                            Julie
                            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                            .......I find dead people

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Do you know roughly when Thomas C. Hopkins Bates was born??

                              It should be possible to find what the C stands for using the free sites Freebmd and GRO if he was born after September 1837.

                              You have to sign up to use GRO, but it is free to use.
                              My grandmother, on the beach, South Bay, Scarborough, undated photo (poss. 1929 or 1930)

                              Researching Cadd, Schofield, Cottrell in Lancashire, Buckinghamshire; Taylor, Park in Westmorland; Hayhurst in Yorkshire, Westmorland, Lancashire; Hughes, Roberts in Wales.

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