maria butler / new clues

[Tilly Mint]

Worthy Butler married a Ann Kettle in 1842.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGZZ-4FX

Am I on the right track here lol.......

[Katarzyna]

Yes Post #28 - Vera gave David's death information but where did you get the brother's name Worthy from?

[Tilly Mint]

I have now found that David Butler was buries at St Thomas Carlton 29th aug 1866 and that he had a brother called Worthy and they used Worthy as a middle name for one of their children

Gloryer mentions him here.

Found this... http://genealogybutler.com/Butler.html

[gloryer]

thank you Tilly,
Kat
Emily and David appear to have come from Colerne,Wiltshire. It is next to Box. David was baptised in an independent chapel in Colerne in 1824,so his parents were non-conformist. He also had an older brother called Worthy which is a middle name used by Emily and himself for their son Henry,twin brother of Robert Reuben and born in Woolwich in 1863. Emily was baptised in Colerne parish church in 1833. They appear to have married in 1857 in the Lewisham registration district and David died in the Greenwich district in 1866 and was buried in St Thomas's,Charlton,on 29 Aug.
Emily may well have remarried as she was only 36 when David died but there are no obvious candidates so it may take a while to discover. In 1851,David was a lodger in the home of Emily's older brother William and his wife in Colerne?

[Katarzyna]

It's a pity we are unable to find David with his wife and family on the only census on which they were together - 1861 census. This would hopefully have given Davids POB and occupation to track him further backwards. Unfortunately 1861 Piece 407 Kent, Greenwich, Woolwich Arsenal, Woolwich is Missing.

However, the birth registrations and the baptisms of the twins Robert Reuben and Henry Worthy Butler to David and Emily does point to the possibility that David and Worthy are brothers but of course they could be cousins?? You would need the marriage certs to help prove the relationships.
Marriages Sep 1857
Butler David Lewisham 1d 821
Tanner Emily Lewisham 1d 821

Marriages Jun 1842
BUTLER Worthy Chippenham 8 443
KETTLE Ann Chippenham 8 443

I cannot find a birth registration for William Butler/Tanner - the "brother" of Maria. He was born, as Vera says, 6 years before the marriage of David and Emily and may not even be a Butler himself.

[gloryer]

Worthy Butler married a Ann Kettle in 1842.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGZZ-4FX

Am I on the right track here lol.......

Yes you are on the right track but its really Davids wife Emily Tanner that is my interest, this is leading up anothe branch...lol

[gloryer]

It's a pity we are unable to find David with his wife and family on the only census on which they were together - 1861 census. This would hopefully have given Davids POB and occupation to track him further backwards. Unfortunately 1861 Piece 407 Kent, Greenwich, Woolwich Arsenal, Woolwich is Missing.



I cannot find a birth registration for William Butler/Tanner - the "brother" of Maria. He was born, as Vera says, 6 years before the marriage of David and Emily and may not even be a Butler himself.

I am assuming if he is brother to Charles then he is brother to Maria and that they share the same mother..... Emily Tanner.

[Tilly Mint]

Look at this link...Interesting....

https://www.british-genealogy.com/archive/index.php/t-25546.html

[Katarzyna]

There is this birth Reg though that might be worth getting. It would have the address where born which might be helpful.
TANNER, WILLIAM mmn TANNER
GRO Reference: 1850 S Quarter in CHIPPENHAM Volume 08 Page 300

[Katarzyna]

I am assuming if he is brother to Charles then he is brother to Maria and that they share the same mother..... Emily Tanner.

MMM. You have to be careful with assumptions!! Quoting from one of your previous posts on your other thread."She (Maria) was baptised before she left the school and on the baptism and her marriage quotes her father as William."
It could be she was confused and gave her brother's name as her father as she had lived with him for a short while.

Just playing devil's advocate here Gloryer - it can be so easy to go down the wrong route not having the full evidence.

[gloryer]

There is this birth Reg though that might be worth getting. It would have the address where born which might be helpful.
TANNER, WILLIAM mmn TANNER
GRO Reference: 1850 S Quarter in CHIPPENHAM Volume 08 Page 300

oooh thanks for that Kat, I know shouldnt assume anything really

[Elaine]

Have you got this now, same parents as for David

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N55J-GR4

England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Worthy Butler
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 03 Jun 1816
Christening Date (Original): 03 JUN 1816
Christening Place: COLERNE,WILTSHIRE,ENGLAND
Father's Name: John Butler
Mother's Name: Susannah

from the marriage Kat listed

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NXM7-G7Y

England Marriages, 1538–1973
Name: Worthy Butler
Birth Date: 1817
Age: 25
Spouse's Name: Ann Kettle
Spouse's Birth Date: 1816
Spouse's Age: 26
Event Date: 1842
Event Place: Colerne, Wiltshire, England
Father's Name: John Butler
Spouse's Father's Name: Stephen Kettle

1851 John

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGZZ-RXY

[Elaine]

1841

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M735-9BN

[Tilly Mint]

Hiya Elaine, I posted a tree for the Butlers on a previous post, I thought it may be worth making contact with the tree owner, they may have new info and not updated for a while.....

http://genealogybutler.com/Butler.html

[Elaine]

Worthy's marriage is online

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=FhD7563&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&db=WiltshireMarriage&gss=angs-d&new=1&rank=1&gsfn=ann&gsfn_x=0&gsln=kettle&gsln_x=0&MSAV=1&uidh=m6m&pcat=34&fh=0&h=900854624&recoff=&ml_rpos=1

father John Butler carpenter

[Elaine]

Sorry Tilly, drove me nuts looking for the children, left it a while and saw the new bits, my apologies

[gloryer]

Hiya Elaine, I posted a tree for the Butlers on a previous post, I thought it may be worth making contact with the tree owner, they may have new info and not updated for a while.....

http://genealogybutler.com/Butler.html

I did make contact and got a speedy reply, unfortunaately she knows nothing apart from David died of Cholera.
But hey its nice to get a speedy reply.

[gloryer]

I have ordered the pdf for the birth of william tanner, never used the pdf service before so will be interesting to see how that works out.

[Elaine]

I've only ordered one PDF and it came quite quickly. Had a bit of trouble finding where to download it at first but got there in the end.

[gloryer]

There is this birth Reg though that might be worth getting. It would have the address where born which might be helpful.
TANNER, WILLIAM mmn TANNER
GRO Reference: 1850 S Quarter in CHIPPENHAM Volume 08 Page 300

just got the PDF and thats not him!!.