Ada Harrison - an impenetrable brick wall

[Karamazov]

Maria S de Harrison crossing the border into Texas. If you arrow to the previous card, you'll find Consuela

http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=MexBorder&h=267196&ti=0&indiv=try&gss=pt&ssrc=pt_t84780279_p48504445037_kpidz0q3d48504445037z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid

And here's the marriage record!

http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?ssrc=pt_t84780279_p48504115172_kpidz0q3d48504115172z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid_m1&srchb=r&gss=angs-g&rank=1&tid=84780279&pid=48504115172&gpid=&gsfn=richard+Maynard&gsln=Harrison&msbdy=1888&msddy=1957&msbpn__ftp=Homestead%2c+Allegheny%2c+Pennsylvania%2c+USA&_82004030__ftp=Los+Angeles%2c+Los+Angeles%2c+California%2c+USA&cp=15&cpxt=1&msrpn__ftp=Tottenham%2c+Middlesex%2c+England&msrpn1__ftp=Robstown%2c+Texas%2c+USA&msrpn2__ftp=Weslaco%2c+Texas&msrpn3__ftp=Robstown%2c+Nueces%2c+Texas%2c+USA&msfng=Maynard&msfns=Harrison&msmng=Ada&msmns=Godwin&msbng0=William&msbns0=Harrison&mssng0=Maria+%28Harrison%29&mssns0=S&mscng0=Consuela&mscns0=Harrison&mscng1=Ada&mscns1=Harrison&_83004003-n_xcl=f&MSAV=1&pcat=ROOT_CATEGORY&h=86240&db=MexCivRegMarTM&indiv=1&ml_rpos=1

Is your Ancestry sub active? If not, only send a PM

Photofamily
You can't leave it at that for those of us without ancestry subs! Itching to know what you've found - can you post a brief summary here?
Thanks,
Christine

[Elaine]

Just found that Ada PhotoFamily

[PhotoFamily]

Well, there seems to be some conflicting info. That tree states that she married Holbeck in 1944 - which would not match up with the info from Richard's death in 1951? But that configuration (birth year, MMN,and her own first and last name, and POB) seem to indicate a strong match?

[PhotoFamily]

Just found that Ada PhotoFamily

Ooops, sorry.

I can try a loose translation of the marriage record, but I believe he states again that he was born in Newbury, Berkshire.

Name: Ricardo Harrison
Gender: Hombre (Male)
Age: 21
Birth Year: abt 1892
Registration or Marriage Date: 6 jun. 1913
Registration or Marriage Place: Tampico, Tamaulipas, México (Mexico)
Spouse: Maria Segura
Spouse Gender: Mujer (Female)
Spouse Age: 22
Father: Ricardo Harrison
Mother: Adie Godwin de Harrison

[Elaine]

Oooops! Just saved a cross post!

[PhotoFamily]

very loose translation of the first part:

In Paso de Dona Cecilia, ?Jurisdiction of Tampico of .. at 5:30 PM on the day 6 or June 19??, before me, Pablo ???, Judge of the Civil Estate, ??? in the house ??? that is the home of Sr Luciano Vernandez, companion of Mr. Ricardo Harrison and Miss Maria Segura, …… marriage that they have <lots of stuff I don’t understand> that he is single, age 25 years, head of <?> of Yunfrania del Aguila, originally of Newbury, England, son of Mr. Richardo Harrison, married , ??? of some years of age, employed, and Ada Godwin of Harrison <i.e., her husband’s surname>, of 42 years, originally of London. and the second … of Mexico City, DF, daughter of Don Juan Segura, widower, of 57 years, and Dona Felicitas Gutierrez de Segura, privada <I guess, meaning deceased?>.

[Elaine]

And a son ?

Tamaulipas, Mexico, Civil Registration Births, 1860-1930

Name: Vicente Harrison
Gender: Hombre (Male)
Birth Date: 5 abr. 1914 (5 Apr 1914)
Birth Registration Place: Tampico de Tamaulipas, Tamaulipas, México (Mexico)
Registration Date: 16 may. 1914
Father: Maria Segura De Harrison
Mother: Maria Segura

[Karamazov]

OK, I'm comfortable using Ada's name again:

Name: Ada Mae Holbeck
[Ada Mae Harrison]
Social Security #: 565282900
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 29 Jul 1921
Birth Place: Texas
Death Date: 15 Feb 1981
Death Place: Los Angeles
Mother's Maiden Name: Segura
Father's Surname: Harrison

and she's in a family tree:

http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/12875362/person/-56307228

but as a side branch

I'd found that death and the associated marriage earlier today and had a strong hunch about it, which is why I was asking RoseR earlier if she had Ada and Consuela's mother's maiden name and an exact DOB for Ada.

I'd found that she married John J Holbeck 9 Aug 1944 in LA. Image here:

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1961-29941-1091-35?cc=1804002&wc=96PL-6TL:147454701

My hesitation about just sending it out into the ether earlier today was
1. I didn't want to start a possible wild goose chase and
2. I could not account for her being Maudsley in 1951. I couldn't find an Ada Harrison/Holbeck marriage to a Maudsley, plus her death was registered in the name Holbeck, implying there was not a divorce.
So another puzzle...but glad that my hunch turned out to be correct.

I really will have to get another ancestry sub at some point...it's just too frustrating not being able to view the finds!
Does the ancestry tree you mentioned indicate that she had any children? If so, they might be able to solve the mystery of what happened to Ada senior...

Christine

PS Richard seems to alter his DOB from time to time - 7 March 1889 according to the 1917 WW1 draft (I assume this is the correct one as it correlates more closely with his age 13 in 1901 census when he is with his father and younger brother in London, 7 Mar 1891 according to death record, and circa 1892 according to the 1913 marriage record - I wonder why?

[PhotoFamily]

Yes, and the subsequent death in May.

The birth record names the grandparents - "William Harrison and Ida Harrison"

Oh, my - I need to go looking for a couple of Mexico births for my own tree

[PhotoFamily]

Does the ancestry tree you mentioned indicate that she had any children? If so, they might be able to solve the mystery of what happened to Ada senior...

Christine

No. Ada is married to one of the main tree's side branches, and no parents are listed for her, and she and John Joseph Holbeck are not listed with children.

But it's gotta be her? Not only is her father's name correct, but so is his POB

[Elaine]

Death is a bit easier to translate

http://search.ancestry.co.uk//cgi-bin/sse.dll?gss=angs-g&new=1&rank=1&msfng=ricardo&msfns=harrison&msmng=maria+&msmns=segura&cp=0&catbucket=rstp&MSAV=1&uidh=euf&pcat=ROOT_CATEGORY&h=651933&db=MexCivRegDeaTM&indiv=1&ml_rpos=2

Tamaulipas, Mexico, Civil Registration Deaths, 1860-1987

Name: Vicente Harrison
Gender: Hombre (Male)
Age: 1/12
Birth Year: abt 1914
Death Registration Date: 17 may. 1914
Death Registration Place: Tampico, Tamaulipas, México (Mexico)
Father: Maynard Harrison
Mother: Maria Segura

You can browse through the death indexes here for anyone without anc*

https://familysearch.org/search/image/index#uri=https%3A%2F%2Ffamilysearch.org%2Frecapi%2Fsord%2Fwaypoint%2FMD5F-8M3%3A203414801%3Fcc%3D1916237

[Karamazov]

But it's gotta be her? Not only is her father's name correct, but so is his POB

Yep, gotta be!

[JudithM]

Ahem. It occurs to me that we don't know for certain that AH has died, and she's within the 100 yr moratorium on using the names of Living Persons. Moderators, you may wish to clean up some posts?

There's a travel record of an AM traveling from Mexico City to San Antonio, but gives no indication of age, so I think it's of little use:

http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?gss=angs-g&new=1&rank=1&gsfn=Ada&gsfn_x=1&gsln=Maudsley&gsln_x=0&MSAV=1&msbdy=1921&msbpn__ftp=Texas&msrpn__ftp=Weslaco%2c+Texas&msrpn1__ftp=Robstown%2c+Nueces%2c+Texas%2c+USA&msfng=richard+Maynard&msfns=Harrison&mssns0=Maudsley&_83004003-n_xcl=m&cp=0&catbucket=rst&uidh=dzh&ssrc=pt_t84780279_p48504117071_kpidz0q3d48504117071z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid_m1&pcat=ROOT_CATEGORY&h=802791&recoff=8+10&db=gpl&indiv=1&ml_rpos=1

RoseR, if you were very lucky, the DC might tell you the undertaker/mortuary that buried the remains? You could try googling it, and seeing if it still exists. That's worked out for me (one time!) - and the funeral home was able to give me the obit.

I edited earlier posts to remove name of possibly living younger daughter. Sorry if this then confuses the issue following subsequent finding of possible death for this daughter.

[RoseR]

Wow, I don't know where to start or what to say, you've all done so much since I shut down last night. Thank you so much. I think you can see what a problem this has been.

The discovery of the marriage is amazing. I have no access to Ancestry, except the UK version through my cousin. The birth and death of a son is also news to me. What looks like the marriage and death of daughter Ada is also something I never expected, although I wondered if perhaps she was still alive.

To go through the questions and remarks: When Ada senior crossed the border to Texas with Richard in 1930 both girls were with him. I have nothing on C after then.

Richard certainly wasn't born in Newberry (sic). As to his claim to have served as a private in the infantry in England for 3 years, that's less easy to prove either way. I've checked the military records but some of them lack information to enable to prove if he did or not.

I have no idea when he crossed the Atlantic again. The outbound passenger lists at that time have very little information and I don't know where he would have been heading.

The draft card from 1917 is the first documented evidence I have that he's on the other side of the Atlantic. By then he's in Texas, but he had to have been in Mexico at least since 1913, from the marriage document. I see on that he'd been tampering with his DOB again. He seems to have done that on several occasions. I'm not at all sure why. He also says his father's name is Ricardo (Richard) when it fact it was Maynard.

As to the son Vicente, I know nothing of him.

The Ada Mae Holbeck is a turn up for the books. It certainly looks like the correct person. Her father is shown as RMH and he was born in Pennsylvania. The age is also about right. This then throws into question the name of Maudsley. I'd of course looked for a Harrison/Maudsley marriage and found nothing. As her death was registered under the name Holbeck it doesn't look as though she divorced or remarried. All I can think is that I was given incorrect information by the cemetery when I enquired who'd signed the papers for Richard's interment.

You've certainly given me a lot to work on and I would never have found this by myself. Thank you.

[Elaine]

This is interesting

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=38512599

2 marriages for John...mentions Magdalen Zak-

[PhotoFamily]

If you look at the findagrave memorial page for John - but also his sibs (I looked at Nancy & Dorothea's) a findagrave user either created the page, or has left a virtual flower. And it's not like they're all in one cemetery or county - he's creating memorial pages for gravestones halfway across the US. I think it might be worth contacting him to see what he knows of JJ and Ada.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=mr&GRid=17927552&MRid=46865877&

His bio sounds like he might be willing to help

[RoseR]

It's interesting that John Holbeck married again after Ada's death. There's only 6 years between her death and his. I will contact the man who put the details on findagrave to see if he has anything else. It would have been nice if Ada and John had children, but I guess that was too much to hope.

I'm still getting my head round the marriage, as I was sure her married name was Maudsley. But the details certainly fit, although I have nothing else which shows her middle name of Mae.

I'm also very grateful for the marriage record for Richard and Maria and the birth/death details for their son. I would have had no way of finding this and would certainly not have been able to translate it if I did.

None of this leads me to the place and date of death of Ada senior, but it's given me so much information which I didn't have before. I'm so pleased I decided to ask for help with this one. I'd been beating my head on that brick wall for so long.