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Marriage Robert Hamilton to Lettice Jacob

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  • Marriage Robert Hamilton to Lettice Jacob

    Greetings everyone from New Zealand. I have just joined the forum but have been researching my family since 2003. On my mother's side I have a brick-wall with my G Grandfather Robert Hamilton. He first appears in the 1891 census in Leyland Lancashire married to Lettice Hamilton (nee Jacob). I knew her maiden name from my mother. Also listed are Mary, Ada and my grandfather William. The Mary should be May as Ada and she were twins. Robert, Lettice and William appear on the 1901 census in Denholme, Yorkshire. However I cannot find a marriage for Robert and Lettice. I have searched Find my Past, Ancestry, Forces records and Indian Army records. Robert was born according to the 1901 census in Roscommon, Ireland. Lettice was born in Llangyfelach, Glamorgan according to the 1861 census. I have the birth certificates for my grandfather and his two sisters.

    If I can find the marriage for Robert and Lettice I should be able to get his fathers name and hence make some progress. I would be grateful for any suggestions and help. It is also possible that Robert was born in Scotland as I was told by mother that his father moved to Ireland from Scotland to be a farmer. If Robert was very young he may have thought he was born in Ireland and not Scotland.

    Regards Teachchem

  • #2
    They might have married in Scotland or Ireland. Neither of these are in the usual search places online.
    Anne

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    • #3
      Hello Anne, thanks for that confirmation. I don't have a lot to proceed on and my mother nor her siblings ever knew their grandparents as they were both deceased before their parents were married.

      I appreciate you looking.

      David

      Comment


      • #4
        May and Ada are indeed twins, mmn Jacob. (Lancsbmd 1886).

        I'm not seeing a marriage either. Where was the first child born please?

        OC

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
          May and Ada are indeed twins, mmn Jacob. (Lancsbmd 1886).

          I'm not seeing a marriage either. Where was the first child born please?

          OC
          William (3rd child, not first) was born Chorley according to 1891 census, confirmed by Chorley births Jan-Mar 1889 8e544.

          No luck in finding a marriage in England or Wales, even searching in the broadest possible terms without surnames for any Roberts marrying Lettices! Nothing coming up in Ireland either.

          David - have you been able to track Lettice after 1861 to get an idea of her movements which might then help to narrow down a possible place of marriage?

          Christine
          Researching:
          HOEY (Fermanagh, other Ulster counties and Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada) BANNIGAN and FOX (Ballyshannon, Donegal, Ireland and Portland, Maine, USA) REYNOLDS, McSHEA, PATTERSON and GOAN (Corker and Creevy, Ballyshannon, Donegal, Ireland) DYER (Belfast and Ballymacarrett) SLEVIN and TIMONEY (Fermanagh) BARNETT (Ballagh, Tyrone and Strangford, Down)

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          • #6
            I also tried Letitia and Letty.

            OC

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            • #7
              Just thought I try to find Lettice Jacob before 1891.

              No births in Wales for that year but there is a Letticia Jacob in England here in 1851 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...&rhSource=7572

              Margaret
              Last edited by margaretmarch; 18-07-15, 13:13.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
                May and Ada are indeed twins, mmn Jacob. (Lancsbmd 1886).

                I'm not seeing a marriage either. Where was the first child born please?

                OC
                The twins are the first born - interestingly on the census one is shown born Hasleden and the other Chorley!

                I think the birth cert for one of the twins is needed to see if there is another surname for Lettice as she seems as illusive as Robert.

                I notice for Robert's entry on the census his first name has been overwritten on another which I can't make out. I'll see if I can snip it ans put it on for others to have a stab at it.

                Margaret

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                • #9
                  Here's a snip of the entry for the family in 1891.Robert Hamilton snip.jpg

                  Hope it is big enough.
                  Margaret

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by margaretmarch View Post
                    The twins are the first born - interestingly on the census one is shown born Hasleden and the other Chorley!

                    I think the birth cert for one of the twins is needed to see if there is another surname for Lettice as she seems as illusive as Robert.

                    Margaret
                    Yes, twins being born approximately 15 miles apart according to the 1891 census record threw me at first but they were both registered - as Ada and May respectively - Jan-Mar 1886 Haslingden 8e 145

                    David mentions that he has the birth certs for all three children plus info re Lettice's maiden name from his mother - but perhaps it is worth double checking Lettice's maiden name on all three certs just in case his mother "misremembered" or there are variant spellings we may not have thought of...
                    As you say, Lettice is proving pretty elusive too!

                    Christine
                    Last edited by Karamazov; 18-07-15, 14:03.
                    Researching:
                    HOEY (Fermanagh, other Ulster counties and Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada) BANNIGAN and FOX (Ballyshannon, Donegal, Ireland and Portland, Maine, USA) REYNOLDS, McSHEA, PATTERSON and GOAN (Corker and Creevy, Ballyshannon, Donegal, Ireland) DYER (Belfast and Ballymacarrett) SLEVIN and TIMONEY (Fermanagh) BARNETT (Ballagh, Tyrone and Strangford, Down)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It is hardly important, but William's birth is registered with mmn as JacobS. (Lancsbmd).

                      I have checked for a marriage to Jacobs!

                      OC

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If this is the family in 1861

                        I can't find them in 1851.

                        Looks to me as if William probably married twice.

                        Jay
                        Janet in Yorkshire



                        Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Ada's baptism is here




                          is it a private baptism? Notes as p
                          Last edited by Elaine; 18-07-15, 21:22.
                          Elaine

                          Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                          http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                          http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

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                          • #14
                            .Thank you everyone who have replied to my message. Your efforts are very much appreciated. Hopefully here are some answers.
                            Both Ada and May Hamilton's births were registered at Haslingden, May was born at 2.15am and Ada at 3.15am 24th Jan 1886. The registration date was15 March 1886 and the informant was Lettice Hamilton. On the certificates her maiden name is Jacob. I actually met my Great Aunt Ada when I was young. William was born 4 Jan 1889 and registered on 16 March at Chorley. They were living at the Chorley work house at the time and Robert Hamilton's occupation was Soap Boiler on all the birth certificates.

                            The 1861 census is the first census that I could find Lettice in. Her father William was a Sawyer on the Dinevor estate and he married three times. Lettice's mother Mary Jacob died 7 Dec 1855 aged 34. The death certificate says consumption which I believe from my mother was brought on trying to save animals in floods near Llandilo.

                            A contact in Wales found a 1851 census record for a William Jones's family which includes a Lettice Jones and other names from the 1861 census and all have ages about right. We wondered if there had been a mistake in transcription. Reference is H.O. 107/2465 page 44, not that it helps at all.

                            William Jacob's second marriage was to Elizabeth Jones on 2 Feb 1858 at the Tabernacle Chapel Llandilo.

                            Lettice also appears in the 1871 census as a servant in Christchurch, Newport and possibly visiting her sister Elizabeth in the 1881 census in Kensington, Chelsea.

                            I have a fair amount of information about the Jacob part of my ancestry but virtually nothing about Hamilton.

                            I hope this gives a clearer picture of where I am at and I am very grateful for your comments and suggestions.

                            David

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Elaine, thank you for link to Ada's baptism. I do not know if it was a private and if it was I don't know the reason. However I would have expected twins to be baptised at the same time and there is no record for May Hamilton. The name May is interesting because my mother's middle name was May.

                              Thanks again David

                              Comment


                              • #16


                                Was looking at that 1851 Jones census and thought it a possibility also. Not much help of course as can't see that it is an obvious mistranscription although the enumerator did get William's occupation wrong.
                                Ann could have been already out of house by 1861, Elizabeth there in 1861, Many possible Mary's as DS and there is a death reg for a Rachael in Llandilofawr for 1852.

                                Still not seeing a marriage for Lettice to Robert Hamilton. She would have been 35 years at the time of the twins birth so wonder if she was previously married.

                                Vera
                                Last edited by vera2013; 19-07-15, 05:06.

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                                • #17
                                  I know it was unlikely but I looked on Scotlands People for a marriage just in case. No sign there I'm afraid either.
                                  Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

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                                  • #18
                                    Ada's baptism is a bit odd. The birth date is wrong (transcription error?) and she was almost three years old when baptised - why her and not May as well?

                                    OC

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                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
                                      Ada's baptism is a bit odd. The birth date is wrong (transcription error?) and she was almost three years old when baptised - why her and not May as well?

                                      OC
                                      Would it have cost a lot to have a baptism? If so maybe Ada was ill and a baptism was thought necessary if there was a possibility of her dying, whereas maybe May was not.

                                      Looking at the birth information it strikes me that an hour between twin being born was an unusual delay - am I right? If so Ada would have possibly been a sickly child.

                                      Margaret

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        There's a member on ancestry who amended the 1871 census record for Lettice from Letticia the username is x5girl and one of the research names listed is Jacob.

                                        Have you been in touch to see what they have?

                                        Margaret

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