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Is this one for jeremy kyle?

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  • Is this one for jeremy kyle?

    I totally at odds with this particular problem. Help is needed to sort this out. I started to look into my grt. uncles wife's family. Albert Sidney Lane married Margaret Ellen Chown on Sept14th 1914 at the Parish Church in Blandford Forum, he was 21 she was 19. I have a photo of them taken either before their wedding or just after. He was in in uniform he was in the Dorsetshire regiment. In 1916 he was killed on the Somme 1st July and is buried in France. Her father is named as Henry Chown. When I started this search in 2009 I printed of an IGI for Margaret Ellen b.01/01/1895 and shows her father as Henry John Chown and mother Rose Margaret Brickell and she was born in Berwick St. John Wiltshire which is just on the border with Dorset. I found Rose Brickell was born in 1867 Enmore Green Dorset which is near Shaftsbury. I was looking for Margaret Ellen's birth on FBMD just to confirm a date and there isn't a record for her, well there is in a way I found one in Devon. After more digging I found that Rose Brickell had married in 1885 to Alfred Toogood in Tisbury (Wiltshire) Mar.qtr.5a 291. I found Rose and husband Alfred Toogood on the 1891 census, living in Enmore Green Shaftsbury with 2 young children, Walter b.1888 in Tisbury and Louisa b.1891 Shaftsbury. I was also looking for Henry Chown from Woodcutts Dorset. In 1901 he is living in Tidsbury, Tollard Royal with wife Rose( I assume she is using the name Chown) b.Shaftsbury daughter Ellen b. Newport Monmouthshire, dau. Jane 9months born in West Dean Salisbury Wiltshire. I then looked for Margaret Ellen with the surname Toogood and found a birth for Mar.qtr.1897 Bedwelty Monmouthshire 11a 105. Meanwhile, I was looking for a marriage for Henry Chown and Rose, I found it in the end, Sep. qtr. 1899 Rose Margaret Toogood and Henry Chown, New Forest 2b 1487. I have looked for a death for Alfred Toogood, but up until now have not found one. Now onto the 1911 census for Henry Chown from Woodcutts Dorset. Wife Rose from Shaftsbury, dau. Nellie Chown ( could be Ellen ?) aged 15 born Newport Monmouthshire, dau. Jennie Chown aged 11 b. West Dean Wiltshire. They have been married for 11 years and the younger children must definitely be Henry's. So the problem I have is this, was Rose Margaret Bickell Toogood Chown having an affair with Henry while her husband was alive? Is that why it was so long before they married? What happened to the two children she had with Alfred Toogood? What happened to Alfred Toogood?
    I need a lie down!
    Vonny

  • #2
    Oooh and it just gets better


    Publication Western Gazette

    Publication date Friday 26 June 1896

    Do you have access to the papers as it's quite a long article....Chown included, just let me know if not
    Last edited by Elaine; 06-02-14, 20:19.
    Elaine

    Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

    http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
    http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Have you come across this one?

      England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2007
      Name: Walter J Toogood
      Birth Date: abt 1888
      Date of Registration: Jun 1966
      Age at Death: 78
      Registration District: Forest of Dean
      Inferred County: Gloucestershire
      7b/371

      and there's a link to probate



      I thought his middle name was Joseph looking at BMD's

      England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations)
      Name: Walter Joseph Toogood
      Probate Date: 30 Jun 1966
      Death Date: 3 Jun 1966
      Death Place: Gloucestershire, England
      Registry: Gloucestershire, England

      Always unsure posing with 1911

      Discover your family history. Explore the world’s largest collection of free family trees, genealogy records and resources.


      Walter Toogood from Wiltshire in Wales
      Last edited by Elaine; 06-02-14, 20:54.
      Elaine

      Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

      http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
      http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

      Comment


      • #4
        So I looked again for a Walter and found one in Wales, father Alfred, all Abertillery, in Monmothshire c1867. Couldn't see another Walter that was a match, as ever got to run this one by you ... check this out



        Alfred Toogood 34 travelling showman
        Harriet Toogood 32
        Walter Toogood 13
        Ernest Toogood 5

        bit of a gap for children I thought in my defence;D
        Last edited by Elaine; 06-02-14, 21:14.
        Elaine

        Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

        http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
        http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

        Comment


        • #5
          Oh Elaine, I am just so intrigued by your information. Firstly, Western Gazette, will I find it on FMP or on Ancestry? I will check out the family search one. Fancy finding Walter deceased as an elderly man. I wonder what happened to him as a child? Right must get looking at the link you have given me please let me know where to find this newspaper please.
          Vonny

          Comment


          • #6
            I think Louisa is a servant Surrey 1911 as from Shaftesbury, just wondered about this

            Louisa M Toogood married Sidney J Morris 1912 Surrey can't see any records online so just a guess
            Elaine

            Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

            http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
            http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

            Comment


            • #7
              Can you give me a link for the western gazette article? I don't understand the search criteria on FMP for British Newspapers - well I understand it but not sure what to put in the boxes. I have downloaded the 1901 for Alfred Toogood in Abertillery. It looks as if the family has split and the boy has gone with his father because the year of birth for Walter is spot on. The little boy Ernest is obviously from this second marriage so that would account for the gap.
              Vonny

              Comment


              • #8
                Pop in a search for Alfred Toogood, exact year and once it's searched, scroll down the left hand side to Western Gazette, have downloaded it if you want me to send it
                Elaine

                Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  There is a Louisa Toogood in Wiltshire born Shaftesbury

                  1901 Census
                  TOOGOOD, Louisa
                  TISBURY, Wiltshire
                  RG13 piece 1960 folio 30 page 20
                  Elaine

                  Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                  http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                  http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Got to the stone throwing yet!!!
                    Elaine

                    Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                    http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                    http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yes!!! Well I never! What a carry on. So, Rose would be pregnant with Margaret Ellen at this time with her b.1897? With Alfred being a travelling showman they probably were in Wales when she was born, so after her birth there must have been a big falling out. Would they have been divorced or would they both just commit bigamy?
                      By the way, I see you are searching for Hunt family- my husband's family are Hunt from the North East. Any use?
                      Vonny

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hunt's are Leicester but I think there are some 1920's plus for Cheshire. Got a branch or two in America as well.

                        I can see an Ernest Toogood birth in Pontypridd but he seem to die next quarter, can't see a marriage or an Alfred after 1901. Nice how Mr Chown gave evidence!
                        Last edited by Elaine; 06-02-14, 22:27.
                        Elaine

                        Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                        http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                        http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Got him, from Shaftesbury and in Wales with Harriet and dau Caravan William Street Cwm Mon, showman

                          Discover your family history. Explore the world’s largest collection of free family trees, genealogy records and resources.


                          says he's been married 3yrs

                          TOOGOOD Harriet Pontypridd Glamorganshire 1907 Oct-Nov-Dec
                          Last edited by Elaine; 06-02-14, 22:55.
                          Elaine

                          Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                          http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                          http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I must admit not a very savoury character Mr Toogood. I checked out another article about him this time for poaching, police said about him and his pal that the pair were well known poachers and had many times been previously convicted. He was also in front of the parish council in 1895 for living in unsanitary conditions but the visiting ladies had said the children looked healthy enough. More hot water for him when he was accused of not helping to upkeep his elderly parents who were living on 4s. a week parish relief, he said he paid the rent on their cottage of £4 a year. Oh dear what can you say?
                            Vonny

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Many thanks Elaine for helping me stitch this story together. After the incident in 1896 at some point Toogood went on the jaunt to Wales to establish himself as a travelling showman and taking his family with him. Perhaps he knew that his wife and Henry Chown were having an affair and wanted to distance her from him. She was already pregnant then (was this Henry Chown's child?) Margaret Ellen was born in the Mar.qtr.1897 in Wales. It must have been there that Rose and Toogood parted she taking her daughter's with her, Louisa and of course the new baby back to Shaftsbury where Rose had her family plus Henry Chown to return to. Walter stayed with his father as you found out. Rose returned to her lover and by winter 1899 was pregnant again but this definitely was Henry Chown's child. Jane Chown was born Sep.qtr. 1900 and by 1901 we find them established as a family unit. The losers in this tale are the first 2 children, Walter and Louisa. Louisa was found in 1901 farmed out and was with a family in Donhead Tisbury Wilts. I wonder why her mother didn't keep her ? So, part of this story is now complete. If DNA were available then it might have proved who really was the father of Margaret Ellen Toogood Chown! Now I will start on the next part, Henry Chown himself.
                              Have a good day!
                              Vonny

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Hi Did you get Any further with investigating Henry Chown?

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