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    Catholic Records

    Just read on another message board that

    the Vatican has banned the LDS from filming catholic records.



    Researching Irish families: FARMER, McBRIDE McQUADE, McQUAID, KIRK, SANDS/SANAHAN (Cork), BARR,

    #2
    JBee

    The Catholic church has NEVER allowed the LDS to film Catholic records, so this is very old news indeed!

    OC

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      #3
      Yes I thought that too but I think its been reiterated by the Vatican recently.

      Hower I have found a rellies baptism at St Mary's RC Church Bishopwearmouth in 1837 on the LDS site - so there are some exceptions to the rule!!!



      Researching Irish families: FARMER, McBRIDE McQUADE, McQUAID, KIRK, SANDS/SANAHAN (Cork), BARR,

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        #4
        I have found a few Irish catholic records on the LDS site. My grandmother's brother is on and I saw the original record at the library in Dublin
        PAT

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          #5
          There are some Catholic records, including baptisms, on the LDS taken from the Publications of the Catholic Record Society. Many of the names in these are in "Latin" and so don't show up using the English spelling of the names.
          Gillian
          User page: http://www.familytreeforum.com/wiki/...ustGillian-117

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            #6
            Originally posted by JBee View Post
            Yes I thought that too but I think its been reiterated by the Vatican recently.

            Hower I have found a rellies baptism at St Mary's RC Church Bishopwearmouth in 1837 on the LDS site - so there are some exceptions to the rule!!!
            See IGI Batch C064581 (film 0593801), which consists of baptism records from about 15 different churches, mostly Durham, some Dorset and one in Notts. There's a reference against the film "RG4 1494".

            All but one of mine that got married did so in the Register Office. The one that married in St. Mary's in 1863 is not on the IGI.
            Uncle John

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              #7
              RG4 (RG = registrar general) is Tne National Archives collection of non-conformist (ie not the established C of E) records, including Catholic, baptist, Quaker etc.
              ~ with love from Little Nell~
              Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                #8
                Yes, some did slip through the net, but not many.

                SOMEONE, however, did some clandestine filming at the Records Office and others did transcripts from registers deposited at the Records Office in error!

                Do be careful to track the exact source on the IGI - some of these so-called extracts are not, they are transcripts.

                OC

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                  #9
                  Um, OC, on a technical point...

                  If the records are at TNA or as it was PRO, don't they own the copyright? could they not have given permission to LDS, regardless of Catholic church, or am I talking nonsense as usual?
                  ~ with love from Little Nell~
                  Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                    #10
                    My g.grandparent's marriage and the birth/christening of most of their children in Rathmore, co Kerry was on the IGI.....it was an breakthrough for me back in the early 1990s

                    Beverley



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                      #11
                      Some RC records have been filmed which aren't on the IGI. I've had the Drogheda RC microfilm on loan at my LDS centre.

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                        #12
                        So either it was done secretly or with the approval/connivance of the relevant priest?!
                        ~ with love from Little Nell~
                        Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                          #13
                          I can sort of understand why the Roman Catholic Church takes this stance, after all, if I understand it correctly, the reason the LDS gathers these records is not to facilitate general geneaological research but to facilitate their own members in 're-baptising' these Catholics into their own creed, after death, which I can quite understand them not being terribly happy about!

                          That said the RC records of the village in Ireland my ancestors came from, was filmed by them somehow, as a gentleman I'm in contact with has them on loan from LDS and is transcribing them.

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                            #14
                            Of the few hundred Irish ancestors that I have traced, only four are on the IGI so not many slip through the net! Two of those are incorrect! Tipperary is one county that you will not find any, as Bishop is even anti allowing anyone to look at the registers in Dublin, never mind them being on the IGI!!

                            That said I have seen many on the IGI of all Irish counties for records 1864 onwards but I doubt that many people know of Irish records on IGI for those pre 1860? For those who have seen records on the IGI what years are on there? It would be easy for LDS to film records because these records are in Dublin National Library on microfilm, although all original Catholic Church records are still with Catholic Churches all over the country.

                            I did read somewhere that only 20% of Irish Records have been filmed by IGI which is why I am always warning people to be careful of the Irish IGI as it is such poor coverage.

                            Janet
                            Last edited by Janet; 18-05-08, 17:48.

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                              #15
                              Well, the LDS has filmed thousands of films which aren't transcribed onto the IGI because transcription depends wholly on volunteers, nothing to do with them being Catholic records.

                              Nell, if TNA own the copyright of a particular film then they are unlikely to make it availalbe for filming by the LDS I would have thought, partly from a financial point of view and partly out of sensitivity for the stance of the RC church.

                              The fact that some Catholic records have been filmed/transcribed by the LDS is down to luck or subterfuge, I think.

                              I have to say that whilst Richard's explanation is undoubtedly true, the few times I have applied directly to the Priest for information from a register, I have either been completely ignored, or quoted a ridiculously high fee. The attitude appears to be one of "Mind your own business, this information belongs to the church and no-one else".

                              OC

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                                #16
                                Janet, you can look at the Hugh Wallis site to see which Irish records are on the IGI:

                                Counties in Ireland

                                and on the LDS site to see which have been microfilmed:

                                Place search page

                                Irish Ancestors also shows what registers are available for each county, where they are, and which have been filmed by the LDS:

                                Irish Ancestors /Counties

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                                  #17
                                  Mary

                                  Two townlands only in Tipperary, I suspect they are Protestant records, and all 1860 onwards in Cork except for two townlands is the reason I wrote the above. Most other records in other counties also appear to be post 1860 and you only have to look at the number of townlands in all the counties to see how poor the coverage is. It certainly looks like only 20% to me.

                                  For example I input Rahelty, a townland of Eliogarty Barony in Tipperary and all I got was film for 1901 and 1911 Census. Very little use to me when many of my ancestors are from here back in the 1790's!! However I will say that LDS often do offer other historical information on their films and there is quite a bit on Thurles Tipperary if people want more info on an area so that is also worth checking out. I do happen to belong to both Tipperary Historical Society and Cork Genealogical Society, so I get the history of the areas that way.

                                  J Bee

                                  This was in the Catholic press only last week, but is reiteration as RC have never allowed filming of RC records. It is to do with the sealing of all souls into the mormon faith, but I have always felt that though the Mormons may think they can do this, it is unrealistic to think it is really possible to change someone's religion after death. Unless the person concerned has actually agreed to change, it is just not feasible. Whatever happened to free will? So I am very unsure why the Catholic Church should suddenly announced this.

                                  Janet
                                  Last edited by Janet; 18-05-08, 18:34.

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                                    #18
                                    In fairness to the RC church, I feel I should point out that Quakers and Jews take the same attitude to having their registers filmed, or even available for viewing.

                                    This attitude possibly reflects the historical prejudices against these three groups and the persecution they suffered.

                                    OC

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                                      #19
                                      "The fact that some Catholic records have been filmed/transcribed by the LDS is down to luck or subterfuge, I think."

                                      I'm not going to name names, and will be very careful not to say anything potentially libelous here, but a certain researcher who put years of effort and his own time and money into transcribing records of the French London Huguenot churches, told me they went to absolutely ridiculous lengths to get hold of his records, some of them bordering on the bizarre. His experience of them and their 'methods' and determination bordering on obsession, to obtain data when they decide they want it, left him from someone indiferent to them, to totally anti as a result.

                                      To balance that though, every LDS church member I have personally ever met was the model of politeness, and the IGI is undoubtedly a fantastic resource for us family history types, that I've used extensively and am greatful for, whatever it's purpose, but from what I was told..well just glad I don't have info they 'want'!

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                                        #20
                                        Richard

                                        I have heard similar stories!

                                        I agree that every LDS member I have met has been a model of politeness and rectitude, but I am amused by the constant gentle reminder that "it would be nice if you deposited a copy of your research with us" every time I visit my LDS centre - which is very frequently!

                                        OC

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