Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Help with TNA? *sobs copiously*

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Help with TNA? *sobs copiously*

    I am trying to discover for which time frames the TNA hold individuals army service documents?

    I have someone on my tree who was in the army in 1758 and also in 1778, so presumably for the time in between also. I would like to get his army record, but am guessing he came out of the service too early for his record to show in "The Catalogue" under Dept Code WO? All I could find to tell me what is held under that ref was this:

    WO War Office (including service records and regimental war diaries), 1568-1996

    Which isn't much help at all!!

    #2
    All surviving service papers for those discharged 1760-1854 are indexed by name on the National Archives Catalogue. You need to put his name into the search and search reference WO97
    The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
    Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

    Comment


      #3
      I couldn't find anything that way, so I tried searching for WO97 with no name, and only 15 hits came up. Am I doing something wrong?

      Comment


        #4
        You can't search WO97 without a name - there has to be something in that box. For example, I've just put "Smith" in, and just searched WO97, and there were over 2400! You need to go to "search the Catalogue", then put the name into the box which says "word or phrase". Don't put anything in the date boxes, then put WO97 in the "Department or series code" box. Hope this helps!
        The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
        Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

        Comment


          #5
          Hmmmmmm.....looks as if his service record hasn't survived then :(

          Thanks all for your help.

          Comment


            #6
            Even if his service record hasn't survived, he will be mentioned in other records, such as muster rolls, which will tell you where he was serving over his whole Army career, and will give details of any misdemeanours, promotions etc. You would have to know which regiment he was in, though.
            The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
            Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

            Comment


              #7
              They might need a special book for his misdemeanours! lol

              I know he was in the 14th Regiment of Foot in 1778. Would that be enough?

              Comment


                #8
                Yes, that's all you need to know. You wouldn't be able to get the info online, though. It would mean going there, or getting someone to go for you.
                The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
                Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

                Comment


                  #9
                  Thanks for that ......

                  I think I'd have to get someone more experienced than me to sort it out......I'd probably need to be there for days!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    It's quite a long job for anyone, to go through muster rolls!!!
                    The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
                    Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I'd better see the original record stating his regiment before I start then!

                      Wouldn't it be awful if he turned out to be in the 4th or 17th foot and I had searched the 14th!!!!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        For example, I've just put "Smith" in, and just searched WO97, and there were over 2400!
                        Thanks, Ann - I'd already tried that, but got no hits at all.

                        You need to go to "search the Catalogue", then put the name into the box which says "word or phrase". Don't put anything in the date boxes, then put WO97 in the "Department or series code" box.
                        Ah, that's what I was doing wrong, thanks. I was searching from here:

                        Search the archives | Search the archives

                        which I thought was a global search for the whole National Archives site.
                        Last edited by Mary from Italy; 27-12-07, 22:28.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Merry I shouldn't worry about not finding his papers listed on the search engine too much.

                          Out of interest, I just went to TNA catalogue and searched for my great granddads's papers and I KNOW they are held at Kew, I've been down there and searched them out myself - copies of which I have in my hand (well - not literally) and I cannot get them listed on their search engine.

                          It may be if someone's going they could do a manual search for you - because they are alphabetical they are VERY Easy to find (in person that is!!!).

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Merry....................you could always get my new best friend, Kevin, to have a look.

                            He found my missing William............and is very cheap.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Merry,

                              They are NOT all listed on the TNA site. I have been to Kew TNA and researched my army pensioner who joined the army in 1851 and went through the Crimea War and on to the Indian Mutiny and Mauritius as well as Ireland. He married in Ireland and had one child there. I have been through all the musters and found out his entire army career at TNA. I have his Crimea Medal Awards and his pension details and he is NOT listed on the TNA site.

                              What is very important for researching soldiers pre about 1860 is to know the regiment in which they served. Pre a certain date and certainly back in the 1700's you will need to know the regiment before going any further. I have wasted much time at TNA looking for early 1800 soldiers not knowing the regiment, and it was a fruitless task. You can often get marriage/baptism details, which will usually give you the regiment, by looking at the Regimental Indexes on Findmypast. These Indexes go back to the late 1700's.

                              Have you tried researching the Militia Lists? These Militia Lists were more important back in the 1700's where every ablebodied man in the country age 18 to 45 had to join and serve. Some counties do their own lists and many have survived. I have a book of Militia Lists for Northamptonshire 1777 and this has been very helpful to me for finding many people. TNA also have Militia Lists and these are worth researching, as often men went into the army having served in the Militia first. Can you get your man into a famous battle eg The Battle of Waterloo which was 1815, and possibly a bit late for you but maybe try googling for battles in the 1770's and see what comes up and see if you can find any info that way.

                              As a matter of interest, it took my OH and myself two whole days at Kew to research the whole of my army person's career and that included researching all the musters. These are a bit tricky to start with as you find yourself searching the whole regiment but then you start to realise that the regiment split into detachments which went to various parts of the world. I found my man in Ireland so I stayed with that battallion until he set sail for Farnborough. He was mentioned in most of the musters. I collected 15 A4 sheets of army minutiae which was wonderful. It included his pay increases, when he had children, their exact ages to the day and so much more. The Crimean War History was really fascinating.

                              You could also download a leaflet from TNA catalogue on army in the 1700's/early 1800's and that will give you many tips on where to go next. There are many army leaflets so make sure you download the one that is suitable for you.

                              If the work took my OH and myself two days then one researcher could take up to 3/4 days to do the work, and would charge a lot for two to three days at about £20 per hour! Would you be sure he would have done the work properly, as I know the Musters can be tedious.

                              Janet
                              Last edited by Janet; 28-12-07, 10:18.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Thanks for that Janet.

                                There's no way I could go to Kew for one day never mind more, so I would have to have someone else do the work for me.

                                The trouble is, the person I am interested in isn't even my relative and I don't know whether anything that I find about him with regard to his army service will be of any use to me (feeling the Christmas pinch - I don't know if I can afford to find these records on a hunch!). His marriage into my family caused "waves" for about 50 years though, so he is quite an important character, despite not being related!

                                I know so little about him. I know his name, when and to whom he married (at the third attempt!), that he had three sons within the next 8 years (don't know exactly when or at all where, but do probably have their names). I don't know when or where he was born or when or where he died nor what happened to his wife and children. There was another marriage between his son or grandson and a cousin on my tree but I don't know when or where or to which cousin!

                                This bit of my tree is like a fishing net!! lolol Loads of holes!

                                Sorry, I'm rambling!

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Oooh, I ve just found a couple of entries in the London Gazette (why didn't I think to look there before?? :()

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Merry,

                                    The London Gazette entries should give you a regiment. I thought that you could only get Boer War, W War 1 and W War 2 through the London Gazette online?

                                    Was he married whilst in the army and have you got his Marriage Cert? Were his children baptised whilst he was in the army? Have you got any certs for the children?

                                    Janet
                                    Last edited by Janet; 28-12-07, 13:51.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Oh, all right! I give up....I wasn't going to post this!!

                                      Name Robert MCCREARY (McCrery, M'Crery, MacCrery, MacCreary etc etc etc!!)

                                      Born....no idea

                                      Married Susannah MAYNARD at St Paul's Bedford in 1759.
                                      Banns register gives Robert's occ as soldier.
                                      Wedding had been stopped twice in 1757 and 1758 by Susannah's father

                                      In 1766 Susannah's father died. She was left various sums in his will but all were conditional that she not live with her "present husband". In the will it also stated that Susannah had three sons all aged under 14 and they are the children of "her present husband". Susannah's surname is not mentioned, whilst the surnames of all the other married daughters are!!

                                      A family tree written in 1906 gives the children of Robert and Susannah as Robert, William and David (no dates or places). This tree has proved correct as far as I have been able to verify.

                                      1778 Rt Mc Crery, sergeant in 14th Regiment of Foot, was involved in an assault case following a recruitment drive at Bletsoe, Beds.

                                      1779 Promoted to Quartermaster (14th Foot)

                                      1780 Promoted to Ensign (14th Foot)

                                      1803 Susannah's younger brother (my 3xg-grandfather) has an illegal marriage to his dec'd wife's niece a long way from home at St George Bloomsbury. One of the witnesses was Robert McCrery of Orange St, Bloomsbury. He could be father or son (I feel he is the son). As could the following:

                                      1814 Sun Fire Poilcy re Robert McCrery of 2 Orange St Bloomsbury, tinman

                                      1815 will proved for Robert McCrery of Orange St Bloomsbury (no occ given). Widow Mary. Mentions two sons, Robert and William.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Janet View Post
                                        Merry,

                                        I thought that you could only get Boer War, W War 1 and W War 2 through the London Gazette online?
                                        Janet, I used this link:

                                        Home

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X