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    which wife is the correct one?

    hi,

    myself and 2 other people all researching the same line but via a different connecting child have hit a brick wall (very hard i may add) and we are all confused and none of us can make sense of it.

    between the 3 of us we have 3 different wives (a combination of all 3 i may add), and between the 3 wives they have combined the children. It's not a simple task of buy the marriage cert as we are talking 1830's in Ireland!!!

    so i will start with husband - Thomas Jackson b1805 ireland (i know he is correct as listed on my 2nd gg marriage cert). and i also have his will which lists other children of which names match the children's names of my 2nd gg - she named them after her siblings.

    wife number 1 - Catherine Giddes/Geddes b1805 ireland. Was possibly married before and maiden name was McKeane as i have found a marriage for catherine McKeane to Thomas jackson in 1838. again not sure on this. This lady was found 1. via other ancestry trees and 2. via a record on familysearch. I found her on the family search after i had been given her name as a possible wife years ago. linked to her are 10 children - andrew (1825-), william (1828-), John (1833-), James (1835-1882), robert (1835-), Joseph (1836-1911), Francis (1838-1876), Hugh (1840-1909), Juliana (julia anna) (1841-), Margaret (1841-)

    wife number 2 - Lucy Foly/Foley b1819 ireland. this lady i found on familysearch and also baptism records on ancestry. linked to her are 6 children - Mary Jane (1843-1921) my 2x gg, Gardiner (1849-1913), Eliza (1851-), james (1858-1881), Thomas (1861-), Anne (1864-). i have baptism records for 5/6 named here, i had this lady as wife before getting other info.

    wife numer 3 - Margaret ? (?ledbeter as found marriage record of this name) b1804 ireland. this lady's death cert links her as gardiner is listed as informant. linked to her are the following children - Margaret b1841, francis b bef 1842, mary jane b abt 1846 (my 2nd gg), juliana b?, john b?, james b?, joseph b?, gardiner b1849

    as above wife 3 has a mixture of wife 1 and 2 children, but no new ones.

    if anyone has any ideas as to which wife is likely to be the right one or how i can find out please let me know as i have no idea, but would like to.
    **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

    https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

    #2
    Have you searched for the baptisms of the known children, including your 3xG Grandmother? Some idea if which part of Ireland might also help.

    Comment


      #3
      no idea which of them is 3rd gg. 2nd gg mary jane has a baptism and mother is lucy and i have 4/5 of the siblings linked to lucy as i put. they are from BARNAMAGHERY, kilmore, down area.
      **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

      https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

      Comment


        #4
        Sorry, I hit the 3 instead of the 2! I'm also going either mad or blind, as I didn't notice all the information on the children when I read it first time.

        I'm still confused though, as you say Mary Jane 'links' to both Lucy & Margaret, but as her baptism has Lucy as the mother then how does she 'link' to Margaret?

        I think to get any meaningful help you need to be a bit clearer.

        When/where did Thomas die? Who exactly does he name in his will as being his children, and does he name a wife?

        Comment


          #5
          what i mean by shes linked to both wifes - is there is a mary jane linked to lucy that i found and a mary jane linked to margaret that 1 of the other ladies has found. Gardener and juliana are not common names but are listed with multiple.

          thomas died in barnemargery - his will lists 8 children but no mention of a wife. 1876 The Will of Thomas Jackson late of Barnemaghery County Down Farmer deceased who died 31 December 1876 at same place was proved at Belfast by the oaths of John Coulter of Killinchy Woods (Derryboy) Farmer and William Campbell senior of Barnemaghery (Saintfield) Bailiff both in same County the Executors. NOTE: Parish of Kilmore; son Gardner JACKSON; son Francis JACKSON’s wife is a tenant; daughter Margaret M’CONNELL; daughter Mary Jane LECKY; daughter Juliana SMYTHE; other 3 sons: John JACKSON; James JACKSON; Joseph JACKSON. Effects under £300.WITNESSES: John HAMILTON & Agnes COULTER. Parish of either Kilmore in Barony of Castlereagh Upper.

          so from will i am inclined to think that margaret is wife as its same named children
          Last edited by yummy-mummy-amy; 14-02-20, 18:55.
          **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

          https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

          Comment


            #6
            Sorry, I really don't mean to be difficult, but 'linked' isn't a genealogical term so I don't know what you mean. 'Linked' in what way? Do you have baptisms showing them as Margaret's children?

            Also, in this sentence, multiple what?
            Gardener and juliana are not common names but are listed with multiple.
            I'll use the will as the starting point & try and look more closely at the weekend.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by teasie View Post
              Sorry, I really don't mean to be difficult, but 'linked' isn't a genealogical term so I don't know what you mean. 'Linked' in what way? Do you have baptisms showing them as Margaret's children?

              Also, in this sentence, multiple what?

              I'll use the will as the starting point & try and look more closely at the weekend.
              hi,
              i'm not taking you as being difficult, i appreciate you trying to help me with it, i will explain below in hope it clears things up.

              there is a mary jane with a mother of lucy and a mary jane with mother of margaret therefore "linked to them". as for the multiple it didnt add mothers eg lucy, catherine and margaret.

              until 2days ago i didnt even know of margaret, i was trying to find out which of lucy or catherine was the definate wife. therefore i have nothing on margaret as a mother except for what the 3rd lady has as info. i dont have any baptisms linked to catherine either as possible mother, only lucy.
              **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

              https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

              Comment


                #8
                Amy, by "linked to" are you referring to a woman and her presumed children on an Ancestry tree? So, someone's idea of a family tree, which may or may not be right, depending on what (if any) documentation and records they have consulted? I'm assuming the tree doesn't have any specific references re the time and place of marriages, or baptisms of the different children?

                Jay
                Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 15-02-20, 10:18.
                Janet in Yorkshire



                Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Janet in Yorkshire View Post
                  Amy, by "linked to" are you referring to a woman and her presumed children on an Ancestry tree? So, someone's idea of a family tree, which may or may not be right, depending on what (if any) documentation and records they have consulted? I'm assuming the tree doesn't have any specific references re the time and place of marriages, or baptisms of the different children?

                  Jay
                  as per orignal message there are 3 of us researching the same line and we have all got a different wife for the man thomas, as far as i can see the only documents or sources between us are thomas's will which names children, margarets death cert that names 1 of the children as informant and baptism records for lucy as mother. nothing that is definate on anything.

                  i found the baptisms with lucy as mother and also a record on family search. a lady in usa who ive been in contcact with for many years had catherine as mother (info via ancestry but no records). lady from few days ago had the margaret and her death cert. We all have the same will for thomas and the same children (plus or minus a few). the information we all have has been shared between us but very little evidence
                  **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

                  https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Hi,

                    It doesn't help you at all, but I had a similar-ish mystery in my husband's tree. Scottish and English birth and marriage certificates. The information was so confusing, I even told my father in law that his grandmother that he remembered (Scottish), may not have been his father's mother. The problem was, his father had one child with a first wife and then seemed to have taken up with a Scottish "wife". I've still never managed to find a marriage for them, so suspect it never happened. All the children, from second on, had a mixture of first wife and second wife listed as mother on the birth certificate. This was further complicated by differing mother's named on the marriage certificates.

                    Only years later, with the lovely help of people on here (over about 34 pages!) did we work out that the first wife had gone to America, and remarried, when the first child was little and therefore all of the remaining children must have been from the second "wife".

                    I think I'm trying to say that records and certificates aren't always necessarily true. There is no way to explain this - the closest someone got was that he was asked to name his wife, rather than the child's mother, when registering the birth and he told the truth. Maybe sometimes he was asked that and sometimes he was asked the name of the mother. Then he'd give his Scottish "wife's" name.

                    I hope yours is easier to unravel!
                    :D Charney Jo

                    Comment


                      #11
                      You mention that Gardiner was the informant on Margaret's death certificate. Presumably she is named as wife/widow of Thomas, and is Gardiner's relationship to her given?

                      I note that in the 1911 census Margaret McConnell is said to have been born in England, but without knowing who she married I haven't located her in 1901.

                      They were Prestbyterian, which may limit the availability of records.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I don't know what records you've got, but Ive just done a search on Emerald Ancestors and several of the names you mention have come up, all in Down. I don't have a sub, but from the free index:

                        1840 Margaret Jackson
                        1842 Mary Jane Jackson
                        1844 John Hamilton Jackson (you mentioned a John Hamilton as a witness to Thomas's will)
                        1846 Julia Jackson
                        1849 Gardiner Jackson

                        If nobody has the baptism details already then unless the information is free elsewhere it's probably worth the £9.99 for a months access, although I think its transcriptions only.

                        There was also a Hamilton Jackson b1865, and from Ancestry his parents are James Jackson & Ellen Wilson.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by teasie View Post
                          I don't know what records you've got, but Ive just done a search on Emerald Ancestors and several of the names you mention have come up, all in Down. I don't have a sub, but from the free index:

                          1840 Margaret Jackson
                          1842 Mary Jane Jackson
                          1844 John Hamilton Jackson (you mentioned a John Hamilton as a witness to Thomas's will)
                          1846 Julia Jackson
                          1849 Gardiner Jackson

                          If nobody has the baptism details already then unless the information is free elsewhere it's probably worth the £9.99 for a months access, although I think its transcriptions only.

                          There was also a Hamilton Jackson b1865, and from Ancestry his parents are James Jackson & Ellen Wilson.
                          hi teasie,
                          thank you for this info. I dont have emerald ancestors sub but may have to get one.

                          Margaret - married william Mcconnell in may 1867 in Belfast, she is with william in 1901 listed as congregationalist religion.
                          john hamilton jackson - i didn't put john jackson son and john hamilton as the same person - i took hamilton as a surname
                          juliana - is listed as julia and juliana
                          **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

                          https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by yummy-mummy-amy View Post
                            hi teasie,
                            i didn't put john jackson son and john hamilton as the same person - i took hamilton as a surname
                            Yes, I think Hamilton is a surname and that John Hamilton Jackson is named for John Hamilton, who was the witness.

                            Griffiths Valuation has a John Hamilton in Barnamaghery at the same time as Thomas Jackson.

                            Comment

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