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    Alfred John Blackhall, Henley, Oxfordshire

    I too have an enquiry on a relative , born 1904 at Henley Oxfordshire , an Alfred John Blackall , I have no details on any ancestral family , as he was an orphan......would anyone have any records for him ? blackhall-genealogy.org.uk/orphans/ENGLAND_ORPHANS_REMAINDER.html

    #2
    Gwyn

    You must have his mother's name from his birth certificate though. What is it please?

    OC

    Comment


      #3
      The link you gave Gwyn doesnt work.
      Kat
      My avatar is my Great Grandmother, Cassandra Elizabeth Palmer 1861 to 1940

      Comment


        #4
        I assume he is the boarder here:
        https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interacti...QaAidAEALw_wcBName:

        Alfred John BlackallAge in 1911: 6
        Estimated birth year: abt 1905
        Relation to Head: Boarder
        Birth Place: Henley On Thames, Oxfordshire, England
        Civil Parish: Chilton
        County/Island: Suffolk
        Country: England
        Street address: Nr Waldingfield, White House, Chilton, Sudbury, Suffolk

        Are there records on why he was placed there, were there any connections with Suffolk? I guess they were just 'foster' parents as there is another boarder with them. (both ages mistranscribed on Ancestry)

        Charles Thomas Wootten 54
        Kate Levina Wootten 56
        Alfred John Blackall 6
        Frederick William Gisbern 6
        Carolyn
        Family Tree site

        Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
        Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

        Comment


          #5
          this is the link
          http://www.blackhall-genealogy.org.u...REMAINDER.html
          Carolyn
          Family Tree site

          Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
          Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

          Comment


            #6
            Blackall Alfred John no MMN
            Henley3a1006
            Jun 1904
            Last edited by Katarzyna; 08-10-19, 23:25.
            Kat
            My avatar is my Great Grandmother, Cassandra Elizabeth Palmer 1861 to 1940

            Comment


              #7
              How sure are you that Alfred was born 1904. Do you have later records of him apart from the link you gave.
              It's just that I have just seen this which seems odd???

              Alfred John Blackall
              14
              abt 1897
              Inmate
              Male
              Henley, Oxfordshire, England
              Chelmsford
              Essex
              England
              The Essex Industrial School And Home For Destitute Boy's, Rainford Road, Chemsford
              school Part Time
              Chelmsford

              BLACKALL, ALFRED JOHN mmn CLEMENTS
              GRO Reference: 1897 J Quarter in HENLEY IN THE COUNTIES OF OXFORD AND BUCKINGHAM Volume 03A Page 804
              Edit: he is with his parents and siblings on 1901 census in Henley.
              Last edited by Katarzyna; 08-10-19, 23:38.
              Kat
              My avatar is my Great Grandmother, Cassandra Elizabeth Palmer 1861 to 1940

              Comment


                #8
                the site that the list is on says:
                "Clarification on the use of the term 'orphans', I had an e-mail from a rather irate/upset fellow family researcher stating that his/her relation was not an orphan as she knew who the parents were I only use this term as they are people I know about but I do not know enough about them to include them in my family file.

                There are two tables for Blackhalls/Blackalls in England.
                The first covers Northumberland & Durham,as I have found that most of these originate from Scotland.
                The second covers the remainder of the English counties.
                (the counties are named using the standard Chapman codes)

                If anyone can fill in the blanks for any of the people listed please contact me"

                I note that there is an NG on the entry, but have been unable to find what it means.

                His parents may not be dead, although the fact that he is on his own in Suffolk is not looking to good,

                Have you got the birth certificate or even a marriage certificate that might give more clues on his parents?

                There is an Alice Blackall that died in (late) 1911 in Henley, she could have been unable to look after the child before her death
                Name: Alice Blackall
                Estimated birth year: abt 1886
                Registration Year: 1911
                Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
                Age at Death: 25
                Registration district: Henley
                Inferred County: Oxfordshire
                Volume: 3a
                Page: 1015
                Carolyn
                Family Tree site

                Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                Comment


                  #9
                  That list looks more like a One Name Study

                  From Post #6:

                  Blackall Alfred John (no mother's maiden name)
                  Henley 3a 1006
                  Jun 1904

                  You need to buy this birth certificate from GRO - you only need to register once.

                  https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/c...ates/Login.asp
                  Kat
                  My avatar is my Great Grandmother, Cassandra Elizabeth Palmer 1861 to 1940

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
                    Gwyn

                    You must have his mother's name from his birth certificate though. What is it please?

                    OC
                    as yet I have no birth certificate, and understand it was NG - not given , according to an orphan list ....see below

                    http://blackhall-genealogy.org.uk/or...REMAINDER.html

                    do you think I should order one ,

                    Comment


                      #11
                      His mother's name will definitely be on his birth certificate even if his father's name isn't. How sure are you that this is your relative, before you order the certificate?

                      OC

                      Comment


                        #12
                        sorry no bc as yet ... see thread below ... do have marriage and death details .... on my tree ... but no certs .

                        Comment


                          #13
                          only answer is to order a bc to finf mother's name if given /

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re post#7

                            Ephraim Blackhall married Mary Clements.
                            sept qtr 1871 Cookham

                            They had a son Alfred John Blackall b1897 Henley
                            BUT also another son:

                            BLACKALL, EPHRAIM WALTER mmn CLEMENTS
                            GRO Reference: 1872 S Quarter in COOKHAM Volume 02C Page 409

                            He married Alice Lloyd in 1906

                            Ephraim and Alice marriage.jpg
                            Mary dies late 1911 as Carolyn noted.

                            1911 census shows Ephraim Walter and Alice with 2 children born after marriage (Blackalls) and another child, Marie Lloyd:
                            https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bi...try&h=51704997

                            LLOYD, MARIE -
                            GRO Reference: 1905 M Quarter in HENLEY IN THE COUNTIES OF OXFORD AND BUCKINGHAM Volume 03A Page 1014
                            So Marie (a Lloyd) 1905 born after Alfred (a Blackall) 1904. Seems odd I know, one would expect Marie to have been named a Blackall too but I'm sure it all ties in somewhere!
                            It is obvious that something occurred that put BOTH the Alfred John's into institutions. (Uncle and perhaps nephew?)

                            Alfred John Blackall b 1897 is with his parents here in 1901:
                            https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bi...&rhSource=6598
                            Last edited by Jill on the A272; 11-10-19, 22:06. Reason: name corrected to Alice
                            Kat
                            My avatar is my Great Grandmother, Cassandra Elizabeth Palmer 1861 to 1940

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I did have a search around the newspapers, I will have another look later, I had found a couple about non attendance of school Alfred in post 7

                              didn't think they were much help, they have other articles 'problems' documented before 1900.
                              Henley & South Oxford Standard 11 June 1909.JPG

                              Henley & South Oxford Standard 24 April 1908.JPG
                              Carolyn
                              Family Tree site

                              Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                              Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Post #13 - the only time a mother's name would not be on a birth certificate would be if the child was a foundling. I can't think of any other reason, so you need that birth certificate.

                                As Kat points out, the Blackall site is a One Name Study and the "orphan list" is just a list that the compiler has made of Blackalls for whom he needs parents names. It doesn't mean they are orphans.

                                OC

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post
                                  I did have a search around the newspapers, I will have another look later, I had found a couple about non attendance of school Alfred in post 7

                                  didn't think they were much help, they have other articles 'problems' documented before 1900.
                                  [ATTACH=CONFIG]20300[/ATTACH]

                                  [ATTACH=CONFIG]20301[/ATTACH]
                                  This is in 1908 and is probably why Alfred John was sent to The Essex Industrial School And Home For Destitute Boy's, Rainford Road, Chemsford as shown in Post #7 I should think - bit of a tearaway!

                                  I have asked for Mary in this passage from post 14 to be changed to ALICE; (I have had Mary this and Mary that all day on postings - feeling confused)
                                  1911 census shows Ephraim Walter and Mary with 2 children born after marriage (Blackalls) and another child, Marie Lloyd:
                                  https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bi...try&h=51704997
                                  Kat
                                  My avatar is my Great Grandmother, Cassandra Elizabeth Palmer 1861 to 1940

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Another here:
                                    Henley & South Oxford Standard 23 September 1910.JPG
                                    Ephraim and his daughter Mrs Susan Tombe

                                    The Blackalls feature heavily in the paper!
                                    Last edited by cbcarolyn; 11-10-19, 22:11.
                                    Carolyn
                                    Family Tree site

                                    Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                                    Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      an article about Alice, certainly looks like she was unable to care for her family
                                      Henley & South Oxford Standard 07 April 1911b.png
                                      Carolyn
                                      Family Tree site

                                      Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                                      Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        just realised that is the elder Ephraim, as there is another similar one in the Henley & South Oxford Standard 21 July 1911 stating she is living at her sons, and he is still not providing maintenance.

                                        she left with a salvation army officer, would they be involved with placing children in homes?
                                        Last edited by cbcarolyn; 11-10-19, 23:21.
                                        Carolyn
                                        Family Tree site

                                        Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                                        Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                                        Comment

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