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Service Record for The Royal Engineers 1891? finding Richard Kean b Manchester 1860

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  • Originally posted by Holly View Post

    Do you mean a Death for Mary Agnes, born December 1881, daughter of Richard and Mary Ann Kean?

    Holly.
    sorry no meant the mother - crossed wires! I did find a Mary Agnes in the institution as an adult, did you have that? will look again not sure if ages matched now, was on FMP
    Carolyn
    Family Tree site

    Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
    Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

    Comment


    • No I haven’t got that Carolyn.

      My Subs have expired now on FMP, otherwise I’d report that image problem to them. However, as I’ve just renewed with Ancestry, I’ll stick with them for now.

      Thanks for the help,
      Holly.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Holly View Post
        No I haven’t got that Carolyn.

        My Subs have expired now on FMP, otherwise I’d report that image problem to them. However, as I’ve just renewed with Ancestry, I’ll stick with them for now.

        Thanks for the help,
        Holly.
        wrong age for Mary Agnes, so false alarm.
        Carolyn
        Family Tree site

        Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
        Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

        Comment


        • That’s good! That family were becoming quite tragic:-(

          I’ve filled out an Enquiry Form on The National Archives Site, explaining the problem with the 3rd Page of Richard Kean’s Forms, and so will await their reply.

          Holly.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post
            I think Catherine married?

            ​​​​​​28 Jun 1911 • Watertown, Middlesex, Massachusetts, USA Herbert Johnson, does have father as Richard.

            the Mary death was posted earlier on in the thread.
            Following Carolyn's lead

            https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bi...=successSource

            On Ancestry this looks like Kate travelling to Masacheusetts Her nearest relative in country from whence she came is Mary Ann Gregory who Ancestry links to Mary Ann Kean sister of Richard Kean Jnr.

            This looks like her in 1910 arriving 1910 working as a Servant

            https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageview...e&pId=11212454

            Cant see her after her marriage to Herbert Johnson. There is a couple in New Jersey but she is a Catherine H and arrived 1914.

            Vera

            Comment


            • Many thanks Vera.

              William Henry Gregory, of 33 Primrose Hill, Hulme, was one of the Witnesses to the Marriage of Richard Kean and Mary Ann Young on the 18th September 1880.

              There’s a Gregory Tree on Ancestry that has Keans on too... Related by Marriage?

              Holly.

              Comment


              • I don't have WW ancestry have to use library, is still available at home - now until December yay.

                Some of your DNA links are in USA, so maybe her children? Guess not as easy as that!

                So at that time her father was 'dead' to her then if sister nearest relative?
                Last edited by cbcarolyn; 05-09-20, 17:24.
                Carolyn
                Family Tree site

                Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                Comment


                • I did start looking at siblings, this is them in 1911
                  https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tr...15398088/facts
                  Carolyn
                  Family Tree site

                  Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                  Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                  Comment


                  • I did also return to looking into the soldier that was with the Keans on the 1881 census George Mackey, didn't get far have to say, just probably found him at school! Just seems to be an odd visitor.

                    Carolyn
                    Family Tree site

                    Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                    Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                    Comment


                    • Both Verne Kean and David Glass have Public Trees on Ancestry.

                      I’ve been trying to find the Gregory Tree, I know I have a DNA match to someone who has a Tree with them on...

                      Holly.

                      Comment


                      • this is the public tree for Verne
                        https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tr...yview?dtid=100 can't see any of the people we have found yet!


                        Last edited by cbcarolyn; 05-09-20, 19:32.
                        Carolyn
                        Family Tree site

                        Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                        Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                        Comment


                        • Like most people, he’s concentrated on his direct line.

                          Also, he hasn’t ordered Certs, just taken from Ancestry...

                          Comment


                          • https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageview...ce&pId=8827814

                            Massacheusetts Marriage Records 1840 - 1915 Watertown

                            1911

                            June 28 Watertown Herbert Johnson, 22, lst marriage, Clerk,, b Lancs England f Richard, m Nancy Pickup

                            Catherine Kean, 26,,, lst marriage, Lady's Maid, b Lancs, England, f Richard, m Mary Ann Young

                            1910 to Mass, Catherine was heading for friend Maggie O'Brien, Providence. The record also says last permanent residence for Catherine was ??Waterford.


                            I can see Herbert and Catherine outwards from UK to USA in 1913. Trying to find inward to see who they were visiting.

                            Vera

                            Comment


                            • Yes,that’s definitely the right person Vera.

                              The Parents names are right .

                              Holly.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by vera2013 View Post
                                https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageview...ce&pId=8827814

                                Massacheusetts Marriage Records 1840 - 1915 Watertown

                                1911

                                June 28 Watertown Herbert Johnson, 22, lst marriage, Clerk,, b Lancs England f Richard, m Nancy Pickup

                                Catherine Kean, 26,,, lst marriage, Lady's Maid, b Lancs, England, f Richard, m Mary Ann Young
                                US death certs often have names of both of the deceased's parents and often their origins.

                                I seem to remember that FamilySearch is a good source of Massachusett's transcribed certs.

                                FS also has US census thru 1940

                                They could easily have made it into Social Security times, and have entries in the social security Death Index. Really lucky if their application has been transcribed - it would have parents' names and POBs, also. Ancestry has those transcriptions.

                                Finally - Watertown may be small enough that an obit in the local paper might have lots of info if they died there.

                                Here's an index to Watertown BMD records:


                                Unfortunately, not in a single database ?

                                Comment


                                • Please post your reply from TNA, Holly, about obtaining copies of the records
                                  The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
                                  Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

                                  Comment


                                  • Many thanks Photo Family, - I’ll see what else I can find on Ancestry.

                                    Will do annswabey, - they warn on the Site that things are taking much longer than usual, due to Covid restrictions.

                                    Holly.

                                    Comment


                                    • I’ve been having problems with some of the American Records, and so I asked on another Forum, and sadly, someone found a Death Entry:

                                      CATHERINE JOHNSON 1913-04-24 NEW HAVEN

                                      Herbert Johnson appears to have Married Minnie Tucker, and they had a long marriage in Massachusetts.

                                      And so I’m back to square one with Richard Kean, - and all I can do is wait for a reply from The National Archives.

                                      Many thanks for all the help,
                                      Holly.

                                      Comment


                                      • what a shame, so if he is your man, DNA matches will be from siblings then, as assume other daughter died too?

                                        I have to say with the DNA it is seeming logical that he is your man, but I don't know how you proceed with the DNA.
                                        Carolyn
                                        Family Tree site

                                        Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                                        Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                                        Comment


                                        • I’ve been looking for any further sightings of Mary Agnes Kean, born December 1881, but nothing as yet...

                                          I was hoping that Herbert Johnson and Catherine Kean had a child, and had descendants who’d tested, - but it seems not.

                                          If the National Archives come back and say that the obscured page of Richard Kean’s Service Record says that he joined The Royal Engineers, - then I’ll know that’s him on the 1891 census at Shorncliffe Barracks . However, I seem to recall that he was impossible to find after then:-(

                                          Holly.

                                          Comment

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