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Wise family to Australian in late 1800s

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  • #21
    Unfortunately the Ellington parish records (pre-1837) don't appear to be online anywhere, including the IGI, and that's probably where most of the events you're looking for took place.

    You could e-mail the local record office and ask them to do some research for you, but it'd probably be quite expensive.

    If you have an LDS (Mormon) family history centre in your area, you can order the microfilm of the parish records to view at the centre for a nominal fee.

    There's a list of centres here:

    http://www.familysearch.org/eng/libr...&submit=Search

    Passenger lists are another problem; not all of them have been transcribed and put online by any means. There's a list of the main passenger list sites here:

    http://ftfmagazine.lewcock.net/index...d=49:june-2009

    Bear in mind that your people may not have travelled directly to Vic, so you need to check NSW and Qld lists as well. Another difficulty is that Christian names aren't always listed, or there may just be an initial.

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    • #22
      We have found John Wise after the 1851 census, but only in the 1881 and 1891 census when John, aged 50, and his wife Ann age 43 are living in Kensington , in Bedfordshire, he is working as a Day Gardener. Have found no children for John and Ann, nor could we find a marriage record for them, and no record after this census or of their death, nor any record in the 1861 and 1871 census.
      In 1871 he's still single, in Chatham Barracks, Kent, as a private in the Rifle Brigade:

      http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec/?...c=&pid=6138093

      I can't find him in 1861, so he may have been serving abroad with the Army.

      I think this is Annie in 1871, working in Northamptonshire and mistranscribed as Ann Farry:

      http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec/?...=&pid=14477817

      This is probably their marriage:

      Marriages Dec 1877
      Fairy Annie Huntingdon 3b 587
      Martin George Godfrey Huntingdon 3b 587
      Morlin George Godfrey Huntingdon 3b 587
      STANYON Ellen Huntingdon 3b 587
      WISE John Huntingdon 3b 587

      You already have them in 1881 and 1891; in 1901 they're still in Bedfordshire:

      http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec/?...c=&pid=8562133

      Annie's still in Bedford in 1911, as head of the household. She's presumably a widow, but I don't have a sub to the 1911 census to check.

      These are probably their deaths (from FreeBMD):

      Deaths Mar 1908
      WISE John 67 Bedford 3b 226

      Deaths Dec 1915
      Wise Annie 67 Bedford 3b 362
      Last edited by Mary from Italy; 02-11-10, 01:30.

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      • #23
        It looks as though there's a service record for him on FindmyPast:

        http://www.findmypast.co.uk/chelsea-...h-start.action

        You'll need to buy a few credits to view it unless you can access it at the library.

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        • #24
          5. Thomas and Mary Wise had children Martha and one less than 1 year old, when they arrived Australia in June 1853, where were those children born and when, and what was name of baby less than 1 year
          I assume this is Martha:

          Births Dec 1851
          Wise Martha Huntingdon 14 204

          The only other Wise child born between 1851 and 1853 in the Hunts area was James, born in Q2 1852, but he was born in Peterborough.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by Mary from Italy View Post
            I assume this is Martha:

            Births Dec 1851
            Wise Martha Huntingdon 14 204

            The only other Wise child born between 1851 and 1853 in the Hunts area was James, born in Q2 1852, but he was born in Peterborough.
            Thank you for this Mary, we dont really know whee Thomas and his wife Mary were living after they were married, could this child James be their child, because we have not been able to find thomas and Mary in the 1851 census, and they arrived in Australia in 1853, with Martha and a child under the age of one year,looks as though James was born apr/May/June 1852 and they arrived Aust in June 1853, so James would be approx one year old by then, so perhaps not, but guess if we knew the names of his parents, or where Thomas and Mary were living at 1851 census would help. thank you for your excellent assistance, info we could not find is hitting us left right and centre, why are we the dumb one, hope though that we learning something from all the help we are given here and hope we can repay the kindness one day.

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            • #26
              I've now found Thomas and Mary in 1851; they're living in Ellington, next door to John and Elizabeth, and their surname's mistranscribed as Wiss. However, there are no children living with them, and I can't find Martha anywhere else.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by Mary from Italy View Post
                It looks as though there's a service record for him on FindmyPast:

                http://www.findmypast.co.uk/chelsea-...h-start.action

                You'll need to buy a few credits to view it unless you can access it at the library.
                Thank you Mary, paid for some points on findmypast and got his record for his almost 19 years service with the Rifle Brigade in England India and China, also now know the medals he was given for his service. Thanks so much for the tip

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                • #28
                  Thanks to all the lovely people on this site, not only for the things they found for me, but also for the guidance that has allowed me to find some of it myself. The only things I cant find are:


                  1. Date and place of marriage of John Wise to Mary Mardling/ (in whichever spelling her name was) in 1827
                  2. Mary Mardling/Maudling/Mordling place and date of birth and name of parents
                  3. Did John marry Elizabeth, where and what date, and what is her maiden name
                  4. Where did Elizabeth die and when in 1851( although we think this may have been a defacto relationship)
                  5. why cant we find any entry for Joseph Wise (age 17 in 1851) after the 1851 census, not found on shipping lists, census, marriage, or death.
                  6. still cant find how Jonah Wise got from England to NZ before he came to Aust in 1864
                  7. cant find any record of David Houghton arrival aust with his wife Ann nee Wise, and two daughters Mary Ann and elizabeth (who we have found on England records born 1848 & 1849) between then and birth of child 1854 in Aust.
                  8. we found a Joseph Wise age 52 and wife Sarah age 43 at Ellington 1861 census, and also 1841 with son Jonah age 8, but cannot find on 1851 census, think they are related to my Wise family, but can find no other details on them, not understood why they are not on 1851 and 1871 census.

                  It looks as though all our other questions are now answered, please point me in the right direction to find the answers to the above, sorry to be such a nuisance, tried every site we know of, all the combinations in the spelling of the name Wise and Houghton, nothing found still

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                  • #29
                    Re David and Ann (Wise) Houghton arriving in Australia - and Jonah Wise - the availability of passengers listed on ships arriving is variable.

                    They may not have always arrived into the colony where they settled. Some of my husband's family first arrived in Adelaide and after 10 days shipped out to join the rest of the family in Melbourne. One of mine arrived into north Queensland, found his way to Newcastle and the Hunter Valley before finally finding permanent work and settling in Sydney. NZ passengers records are not as frequently available on-line but all are getting more accessible every year. So you should keep checking, and check in every colony, because they were all separate.

                    The best indicator of when they arrived could be their death certificates, as there is always the question "how long in colony" and generally lists each colony (NSW, Qld, or Vic) if they spent any considerable time there - I think one of mine also indicates how long in NZ. The earliest death cert. might be the most accurate.

                    Also don't forget that ship's crew were not included as passengers and some worked their passage, then there are different records to search for. Several of OH's miraculously arrived here but worked on coastal shipping for several years - so you sort-of assume they came out here as ships crew.

                    One of my best finds was the obituary that said Alexander ran away to sea at age 12 and after being dragged home to his grandfathers, was then apprenticed to the sea for 4 years - after that he sailed as crew all around the world before settling in Sydney, where he died aged 84. no wonder he was not on the census anywhere ! Sometimes you can be very lucky like that.
                    Diane
                    Sydney Australia
                    Avatar: Reuben Edward Page and Lilly Mary Anne Dawson

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                    • #30
                      John Wise and Mary Mardling married in 1827
                      Children in 1841 Census:
                      Ann Wise 12; Thomas Wise 10; Joseph Wise 8; William Wise 6; Eunice Wise 3; John Wise 0 (less than 12 months)
                      Jonah Josiah Joseph Wyse (name spelt differently) was added to the family two years later.

                      Mary died in childbirth in 1846 together with her son whose name was James Wise recorded variously as James and Jabez.

                      John recorded in 1851 Census had a live in partner he named as Elizabeth Wise (wife) who died the same year at 52 years. They were never married and had no children together.
                      Children at home: Joseph Wise 17; William Wise 15; Eunice Wise 13; John Wise 10; Jonah Wise 7. Name spelt correctly this time. (during earlier times of mass illiteracy enumerators wrote down names how they thought it would be spelt)

                      The ancestor who has provided the history states that Ann and Thomas had both left Ellington Thorp, both had married and Ann was already resident in Australia. If you look at the top of the page (12) for the family in the 1851 Census you will see Mary Wise and on the previous page (11) Thomas Wise, both still at Ellington Thorp, just a different home, probably right next door.

                      In September 1853 John Wise married again to Susannah Mattin. She was a single mother and already had a son William Henry Mattens (spelt with an e) born December 1846. Recorded in 1851 Census as living with his grandmother also Susannah Mattin, in Easton, Huntingdonshire.

                      John is recorded in the 1861 Census, 57, married agricultural labourer, born March in Cambridgeshire.
                      Susannah Wise, wife, 48, born Easton, Huntingdonshire.
                      William Henry Wise, son, aged 14, unmarried, born, Huntingdon, Huntingdonshire.
                      None of John's children were still at home so he gave his name to Susannah's son. With five children having gone to Australia Jonah the youngest was still in England listed in the Census as an 18 year old farm labourer and inmate of at the Union Workhouse at Saint Johns, Huntingdonshire. He was entirely destitute and living in a poor house in dreadful conditions until he was 21. He immigrated to NZ as an assisted migrant and finally brought to Australia by his brothers when they paid for his passage from Otago to Port Phillip.

                      I have other information on the other children of John and Sarah Wise but most is to do with the Australian members. There is documentary evidence for marriages, deaths, births in Australia. Except for Census records in the UK I don't have much evidence for the early dates other than what is in the two documents, "Born to be Wise" and "Dare to be Wise". As they do not have bibliographies I can only surmise the information was passed down by relatives. These documents also have lots of photos and other documents but I do not know who now holds them. Dare to be Wise was put together by Desma L. Meek and I believe she has passed on. I will look at the other information you are looking for or where correction is required.

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