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**cbcarolyn** · 23-05-21, 09:13

Her mother is Emily Jane Harris on the birth cert?

and her name is Lily Augusta Wall Harris on the cert?

have you found any connection with Wall

and the Birth cert may not even be hers?
When did she die?

just found the exact details of the BC that you posted before

LILY AUGUSTA WALL HARRIS. Born November 26? 1874. Mother Emily Jane Harris, domestic servant.

Place of birth Oxford Workhouse, Cowley Road, Reg. district, Headington, sub district Saint Clement.

Informant Mother, address Oxford Workhouse.

**Cath RJ** · 23-05-21, 10:07

and the Birth cert may not even be hers? *
When did she die?**

*That's what I'm trying to prove.
**19th May 1934 in Bury

**GallowayLass** · 23-05-21, 10:08

Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post

I am now at a complete tangent and looking at George Clarke....and see he is a clerk to the Bookstall and is moving around the country - never heard of it, any idea what it is

This could perhaps be the answer?

Steam-Powered Knowledge

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=WAoGd7HfTB8C&pg=PA138&lpg=PA138&dq=what+was+a+clerk+to+the+bookstall&source=bl&ots=a9oEFzJeXJ&sig=ACfU3U3jsMRcmHjhiVGYqyv9JkJWdlB7cQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjrrMPBxt_wAhXFB2MBHVvbA8EQ6AEwB3oECAwQAg#v=onepage&q=what%20was%20a%20clerk%20to%20the%20bookstall&f=false

With the overwhelming amount of new information that bombards us each day, it is perhaps difficult to imagine a time when the widespread availability of the printed word was a novelty. In early nineteenth-century Britain, print was not novel—Gutenberg’s printing press had been around for nearly four centuries—but printed matter was still a rare and relatively expensive luxury. All this changed, however, as publishers began employing new technologies to astounding effect, mass-producing instructive and educational books and magazines and revolutionizing how knowledge was disseminated to the general public. In Steam-Powered Knowledge, Aileen Fyfe explores the activities of William Chambers and the W. & R. Chambers publishing firm during its formative years, documenting for the first time how new technologies were integrated into existing business systems. Chambers was one of the first publishers to abandon traditional skills associated with hand printing, instead favoring the latest innovations in printing processes and machinery: machine-made paper, stereotyping, and, especially, printing machines driven by steam power. The mid-nineteenth century also witnessed dramatic advances in transportation, and Chambers used proliferating railway networks and steamship routes to speed up communication and distribution. As a result, his high-tech publishing firm became an exemplar of commercial success by 1850 and outlived all of its rivals in the business of cheap instructive print. Fyfe follows Chambers’s journey from small-time bookseller and self-trained hand-press printer to wealthy and successful publisher of popular educational books on both sides of the Atlantic, demonstrating along the way the profound effects of his and his fellow publishers’ willingness, or unwillingness, to incorporate these technological innovations into their businesses.

**Cath RJ** · 23-05-21, 10:09

Just got results of DNA test but I'm mostly Lancs/Yorks and Scottish which I already knew.

**vera2013** · 23-05-21, 10:59

Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post

I am now at a complete tangent and looking at George Clarke....and see he is a clerk to the Bookstall and is moving around the country - never heard of it, any idea what it is

I followed the Emily Harris possible Sister of Henry J m to Clara.

George was a Clerk for W H Smith and couple lived in Swansea, Sheffield ? Harrogate. Don't now think she is the mother of Lily Harris b 1874. The couple are in Swansea in 1881 and no Lily with them.

Vera

**vera2013** · 23-05-21, 11:09

Originally posted by Cath RJ View Post

Thank you ladies you have been brilliant !!

Vera, you furnished me with loads of information re Harris/Brimfield about 4 years ago and as you can see I still can't definitely find Lily Augusta between her birth in 1874 and when she appeared in Bury in 1901. It's so frustrating - I have a couple of photos of her and I feel a real connection to her (she's my grandmother) .
Oh how I wish I'd asked my Dad and aunts before it was too late.

Thanks again.
Cath.

Well so much for my memory. Still enjoyed the exercise.

Need to read through again

Vera

**vera2013** · 23-05-21, 11:11

Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post

I thought it maybe useful to go back to the beginning? so found the other threads

Sorry to ask again but... - Family Tree Forum

https://www.familytreeforum.com/forum/research-advice/family-history-research/67827-sorry-to-ask-again-but

Questions, answers and general information about your family history research.

1901 census look up please. - Family Tree Forum

https://www.familytreeforum.com/forum/research-advice/family-history-research/66606-1901-census-look-up-please

Questions, answers and general information about your family history research.

can anyone see a connection - Family Tree Forum

https://www.familytreeforum.com/forum/research-advice/family-history-research/54628-can-anyone-see-a-connection

Questions, answers and general information about your family history research.

and changed the title of the thread, as you have Lily in 1901 - I think I have that correct.

Thanks Carolyn. Hope you managed to sleep

Vera

**vera2013** · 23-05-21, 13:03

Originally posted by brentor boy View Post

This could be totally irrelevant, but have you noticed this?

Lily Augusta Walker. Dec 1870. Headington. No mmn.
In 1871 living as "inmate" with Emma Walker, age 21.
Lily Augusta Wall Harris. Dec 1874. Headington. No mmn

Did you see this one

The Lillian Graham in 1901 is recorded as b 1876 Oxfordshire

Do you have any other evidence, other than being called Gussie, for the Lillian Graham in 1901 being Lily Augusta Walker Harris?

Vera

**Cath RJ** · 23-05-21, 13:46

Originally posted by vera2013 View Post

Did you see this one

The Lillian Graham in 1901 is recorded as b 1876 Oxfordshire

Do you have any other evidence, other than being called Gussie, for the Lillian Graham in 1901 being Lily Augusta Walker Harris?

Vera

No. She's Lily Augusta WALL Harris. I can't find any other Lily or Lilian Augusta Harris born in Oxford at the right time. Her children's bc say her maiden name was Harris.

**vera2013** · 23-05-21, 15:16

Originally posted by Cath RJ View Post

No. She's Lily Augusta WALL Harris. I can't find any other Lily or Lilian Augusta Harris born in Oxford at the right time. Her children's bc say her maiden name was Harris.

Yes, my mistake Wall not Walker

Will look at Lillian Harris b 1876 Oxon

Vera

**cbcarolyn** · 23-05-21, 15:26

The Augusta could have been added later, people seem to add names just to be unhelpful to us!

Have you tried any other birth certs?

Did start looking through the papers and found nothing, was hoping for maybe a funeral announcement.

With regard to her children - have you traced each of them? wonder if there was an odd will that could mention a cousin or something

**Cath RJ** · 23-05-21, 16:46

With regard to her children - have you traced each of them? wonder if there was an odd will that could mention a cousin or something.

.From all her children there 's only me, my brother and one cousin. The rest died either unmarried or childless.

**cbcarolyn** · 23-05-21, 17:18

no wills?

**cbcarolyn** · 23-05-21, 17:47

clutching at straws, but you said that Thomas Graham had a 2nd wife, who was she, and did your grandmother come onto the scene quite quickly, maybe a connection to each other?

Just thinking my grandmother helped my grandfather nurse her sister during her illness and then she died, and then they married.

**Cath RJ** · 23-05-21, 20:30

No wills. They were a very poor family. Lily seems to have appeared on the scene very soon after his 2nd wife died but she was also a Bury girl. I can't find it at the moment but somewhere I have a note that his second wife lived at the same address as Thomas with her first husband before she was widowed. I think it was some sort of multiple dwelling or yard. Perhaps Lily lived nearby but I can't prove it.
His second wife was Helen Pennington, formerly Morton.

**cbcarolyn** · 24-05-21, 19:06

I will have a look through the papers, you never know something might turn up, sometimes it is easier to look for an address with a surname, so have started to make a list of the addresses

1891	57 Trinity Street	census
1896	Heap Bridge	marriage
1901	6 Taylor Street (?)	census
1902	Luna Street (?)	Baptism
1907	257 Bell Street	Baptism and burials
1911	9 Washington Court, Bury Lane	census
1916	Union Square	Violet burial

edit - other places Union Street, Union square, Openshaws Yard on Cecil Street

I did see that 2 of the boys (Reginald and Percival) were buried at the same time, and did wonder if this was due to a small pox outbreak in the area, the papers are reporting like the virus today, and tracking where it came from.

I did also spot this in the paper.

bury times 1907.JPG

no help in finding Lilian.

**vera2013** · 25-05-21, 02:50

Not sure if you have tried these people

EDIT link doesn't work.

Oxford History Centre
Local Studies Catalogue

Title Oxford Workhouse register of baptisms 1841 - 1893
Title Transcripts of births in institutions

Email oxhistory@oxfordshire.gov.uk

Vera

**vera2013** · 25-05-21, 03:05

Ignore

Vera

**Cath RJ** · 25-05-21, 10:13

Carolyn, that article is AMAZING. We have been searching for Thomas junior for ages and finally found him in the Seaforth Highlanders (see avatar). It looks like he joined up as soon as he could. He seems to have eventually gone to Canada where we loose him completely.
Hugh Graham was born in Bell Lane, 1906, so it looks like this is the correct Thomas. There is another Thomas Graham born in Bury at the right time but he was an engineer. Most of my Grahams were painters. Thomas jrn. was Thomas Battersby Graham and it had been our mission for years to trace him.
Thanks for the addresses. I think we have them and many more. The family were very prone to doing "a midnight flit" by the looks of things.

Yes thanks, I tried the Oxford Family history route many years ago with no success.

Thank you , thank you, thank you.

Cath.

**cbcarolyn** · 25-05-21, 12:00

Originally posted by Cath RJ View Post

Carolyn, that article is AMAZING. We have been searching for Thomas junior for ages and finally found him in the Seaforth Highlanders (see avatar). It looks like he joined up as soon as he could. He seems to have eventually gone to Canada where we loose him completely.
Hugh Graham was born in Bell Lane, 1906, so it looks like this is the correct Thomas. There is another Thomas Graham born in Bury at the right time but he was an engineer. Most of my Grahams were painters. Thomas jrn. was Thomas Battersby Graham and it had been our mission for years to trace him.
Thanks for the addresses. I think we have them and many more. The family were very prone to doing "a midnight flit" by the looks of things.

Yes thanks, I tried the Oxford Family history route many years ago with no success.

Thank you , thank you, thank you.

Cath.

if you post a few more addresses I can have a wander through the papers, might find another snippet. There are so many children, and sadly so many deaths. Smallpox seems to have been on and off in the area and Bell lane mentioned.

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Trying to trace Lily Augusta Harris, b.Oxford St. Clement, 1874

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