Sullivan Mary Ann proving she existed

[cbcarolyn]

Well someone in that notice is a sibling of dennis, as it states father and brother.

I saw that, and wondered who it would be as couldn't see anyone from the family found a while back. Maybe she was know as something else.

I just used Trove to find that one.

https://trove.nla.gov.au/search/adva...e&l-decade=194

the Welsh newspaper are also free where a lot was found for the callaghan family.

what choices do you have on the GRO, I can only see the one I mentioned?

[cbcarolyn]

I thought it maybe easier to quote some info about Denis from previous threads rather than merge them:

Here is a summary of the records found on this thread– I think this is everything:
1841 on his own in Abergavenny
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/8979/MONHO107_743_744-0555/8284737

1851 Abergavenny with the family (transcribed badly Lewis)

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGTG-WZ3

Post 50 has an image

Dennis Ocalligan Head Mar 40 Laborer Ireland
Ellen Ocalligan Wife 38 Ireland
Mike Ocalligan Son 6 1845 Monmouthshire, Wales
Jerry Ocalligan Son Unmarried Male 3 1848 Monmouthshire, Wales
Timothy Ocalligan Son 3 1848 Monmouthshire, Wales

1861 Aberystruth
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/8768/MONRG9_3994_3997-1034?pid=13434933
Dennis C Callagan 49
Ellen Callagan 38
Tim Callagan 13
Dennis Callagan 9
Mary Callagan 4

1871 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V55C-R7X
Ellen remarried
James Donovan 50
Ellen Donovan 50
Mary A Callaghan 15

Children from census with likely birth regs
Michael 1845
Jeremiah Timothy 1848
birth - Jeremiah Timothy Callaghan Q3 1848 Abergavenny MMN Collins
Death - O'CALLAGHAN, JEREMIAH age 9
GRO Reference: 1858 M Quarter in ABERGAVENNY Volume 11A Page 73
Dennis 1851
Birth - O CALLAGAN, DENIS MMN COLLINS GRO Reference: 1851 S Quarter in ABERGAVENNY Volume 26 Page 14
Thomas 1854
Birth - CALAGHAN, THOMAS MMN COLLINS GRO Reference: 1854 D Quarter in ABERGAVENNY Volume 11A Page 65
Death - O'CALLAGHAN, THOMAS age 3
GRO Reference: 1858 M Quarter in ABERGAVENNY Volume 11A Page 65
Mary 1857
Birth - O CALLAGHAN, MARY COLLINS
GRO Reference: 1857 S Quarter in ABERGAVENNY Volume 11A Page 68

Post 19 Has death of Dennis:
Just come across something in the Welsh newspapers

https://newspapers.library.wales/vie...is%20Callaghan

BLAINA. FATAL ACCIDENT —On Wednesday the 22nd instant, an accident occurred at these works, which resulted in the death of a man, named Dennis O'Callaghan, aged 46 years...

death
CALLAGHAN, DENNIS 46
GRO Reference: 1861 J Quarter in ABERGAVENNY Volume 11A Page 48

I remember we were wondering about the 2 sons who must have died in an accident, I was looking at Ellen who appears to have married as Collings and came across a burial for a James Donovan of Blaina age 60 Aberystruth records

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCTL-P8G

Can't remember how I got here but Michael Occaligan burial age 12 Blaina

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCY9-WYK

And newspaper account of how he died

https://newspapers.library.wales/vie...20AND%20blaina

Jeremiah Occaligan

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCY9-4W2

Newspaper account

https://newspapers.library.wales/vie...20AND%20blaina

Here's the link transcribed as Davies

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCY9-4RF

[2weis]

Carolyn
sullivan john 1875 j qtr swansea 11a 752
sullivan john 1874 j qrt newport 11a 205
callaghan john 1874 s qrt bedwelty 11a 123

I will try the Welsh papers as I have had some luck in Blaina area
I have to make the time to do more searching on Trove

Is that Trove result for a particular person or just a example of what is there
Brian

I just saw the new post and will read it shortly

Carolyn have had a quick look and i have some of the Monmouthshire Merlin articles and tomorrow i will look closely at all of it.
Thank you very much for the effort and input

[cbcarolyn]

the last one in bedwelty has MMN of Wall so not that one

CALLAGHAN, JOHN WALL
GRO Reference: 1874 S Quarter in BEDWELLTY Volume 11A Page 123

I guess it maybe none - Newport seems more likely to records found, have you seen any connection of Mary in Swansea? Have you tried to trace the one born in Swansea on any future census, does seem to be a few sullivans about.

Posted link to Trove that should have funeral notice

[vera2013]

Carolyn
sullivan john 1875 j qtr swansea 11a 752
sullivan john 1874 j qrt newport 11a 205
callaghan john 1874 s qrt bedwelty 11a 123

I will try the Welsh papers as I have had some luck in Blaina area
I have to make the time to do more searching on Trove

Is that Trove result for a particular person or just a example of what is there
Brian

I just saw the new post and will read it shortly

Carolyn have had a quick look and i have some of the Monmouthshire Merlin articles and tomorrow i will look closely at all of it.
Thank you very much for the effort and input

The Newport one could be the child b SULLIVAN, John June Q 1874 no mm n died SULLIVAN, John June q 1875 Newport aged 1 11A 113

There is another Bedwelty one for SULLIVAN, John b June Q 1874 no mm n 11A 91

Vera

[cbcarolyn]

The Newport one could be the child b SULLIVAN, John June Q 1874 no mm n died SULLIVAN, John June q 1875 Newport aged 1 11A 113

There is another Bedwelty one for SULLIVAN, John b June Q 1874 no mm n 11A 91

Vera

that looks a likely one

[2weis]

Vera Carolyn
Good morning
I have made note of them and will see what i can find, between this branch an another branch (Gibson/Sharpe 1800-1850) it looks like i will be propping up the UK economy via GRO for some time

Carolyn that newspaper article for the burial wont open unless i have a paid subscription

Thanking All
Brian

[cbcarolyn]

do you mean this link?

https://trove.nla.gov.au/search/adva...e&l-decade=194

I have no subscription. not even sure I logged on. The whole article is the snip, so nothing more to see.

You should be able to search Trove for any other articles.

[2weis]

carolyn
No it is this reference i cant open


I remember we were wondering about the 2 sons who must have died in an accident, I was looking at Ellen who appears to have married as Collings and came across a burial for a James Donovan of Blaina age 60 Aberystruth records

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCTL-P8G

Brian

[2weis]

Have just ordered first cert. Mary Ann 1857 v11a p68 Abergavenny 7 pound = 12 or 13 aus dollars not bad
Brian

[cbcarolyn]

carolyn
No it is this reference i cant open


I remember we were wondering about the 2 sons who must have died in an accident, I was looking at Ellen who appears to have married as Collings and came across a burial for a James Donovan of Blaina age 60 Aberystruth records

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCTL-P8G

Brian

I guess they have changed that record only, Elaine found it sometime back, you probably saved it then?

[cbcarolyn]

which certificates are your short list?

I did see that you reported on one of the child's birth she put down Glamorgan rather than Monmouthsire. Not sure if this is significant, as it is also Monmouthshire on another

[2weis]

Carolyn
I will sift the hint I've received here thru the record via GRO and see which seem likely,I also have 2 relatives researching so I will try and collaborate with the
.
Once again thanks to all for your invaluable input and if any thing else arises I am interested
Brian

[teasie]

Just going back to the Hydaspes passenger list, I think it actually says Margt [Margaret] Sullivan, not Mary.

If you look about half a dozen entries up from the Sullivan entry (page 20/58) you'll see Mary Rafferty & Margt Ryan, and the Sullivan entry is definitely written more like the Margt.

Another Mary & Margaret [Beary] are travelling together on page 19, immediately followed by 3 more Mary's, and the difference in how they are written is very clear.

https://archives.sa.gov.au/sites/default/files/documentstore/passengerlists/1876/GRG35_48_1_76-25_Hydaspes.pdf

[cbcarolyn]

Just going back to the Hydaspes passenger list, I think it actually says Margt [Margaret] Sullivan, not Mary.

If you look about half a dozen entries up from the Sullivan entry (page 20/58) you'll see Mary Rafferty & Margt Ryan, and the Sullivan entry is definitely written more like the Margt.

Another Mary & Margaret [Beary] are travelling together on page 19, immediately followed by 3 more Mary's, and the difference in how they are written is very clear.

https://archives.sa.gov.au/sites/def...5_Hydaspes.pdf

any idea what the reg numbers mean? and why they share the same one?

[teasie]

I can only guess that the registry number is a bit like a booking reference, but relates only to the specific ship/journey.

If you go back to the first page there are a number of families travelling together and they all share the same registry number, so it certainly looks like Sullivan & Gallagher were travelling together. It would be a heck of a coincidence if it wasn't them, but it still looks like she was listed as Margaret

[vera2013]

[QUOTE=teasie;n1321941]Just going back to the Hydaspes passenger list, I think it actually says Margt [Margaret] Sullivan, not Mary.

If you look about half a dozen entries up from the Sullivan entry (page 20/58) you'll see Mary Rafferty & Margt Ryan, and the Sullivan entry is definitely written more like the Margt.

Another Mary & Margaret [Beary] are travelling together on page 19, immediately followed by 3 more Mary's, and the difference in how they are written is very clear.


Also recorded as Adult Irish but maybe because no column for Welsh.

[cbcarolyn]

I can only guess that the registry number is a bit like a booking reference, but relates only to the specific ship/journey.

If you go back to the first page there are a number of families travelling together and they all share the same registry number, so it certainly looks like Sullivan & Gallagher were travelling together. It would be a heck of a coincidence if it wasn't them, but it still looks like she was listed as Margaret

That is what I was thinking, but thought you were maybe saying she was someone else.

If this is them together John must be left behind, and I am assuming he has never been found by Brian with the family in Australia, so he is likely to be with a family member in Wales....shame his name is John!

[2weis]

Vera
Unfortunately it appears you are correct with the name. The only thing i can suggest is that she was unable to read or write so the clerk may have made an error.
Or its not her. The same with her son John th only thing i can think is he was placed with a relative as a child and Mary kept in touch but never reclaimed him.
Brian

[vera2013]

Vera
Unfortunately it appears you are correct with the name. The only thing i can suggest is that she was unable to read or write so the clerk may have made an error.
Or its not her. The same with her son John th only thing i can think is he was placed with a relative as a child and Mary kept in touch but never reclaimed him.
Brian

Brian Teasie noted the entry was Margt (Margaret) not Mary on Hyspades and Carolyn with ticket number 507 same as that of entry for Denis Callaghan.

The Margaret entry could be your Mary Ann. In my own family the registered names are quite different from those they are known as.

I would still look at John who was likely to be born in Wales for clues to your Mary Ann.

Vera