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    finding the 1st wife help please

    hi,
    due to some technical errors earlier this year and managing to delete a person that linked a large part of tree, due to these issues i have made a new tree (and in a way i'm glad as found few interesting bits i hadnt noticed before - 1 ancestor and wife as landlord/lady of the village pub for 1.)

    anyway, whilst adding info about my 2nd great grandfather James Henry Mitchell, 1854 Bradford uk, and his wife Clara Richardson, 1857 Bradford uk i noticed on their marriage cert (1876) he is listed as widower.
    i'm now intrigued to find out who his 1st wife was. on the 1871 census he is still living with parents and unmarried. so this gives me a 5year window before he married clara. other people that have him in tree also only have clara as wife. i have looked on freebmd and as you can guess with name and location there are loads.

    any ideas please to narrow it down and possibly find wife 1?
    **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

    https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

    #2
    Is this the right man? If so, the image of the certificate is on FMP. Scrub that, just spotted your man was born 1854. Sorry.
    James Henry
    Mitchell
    55
    1818
    Bootmaker
    W
    42 Whitefriar Gate
    1873
    26 Nov 1873
    Hull, Holy Trinity
    L
    Elizabeth Maria
    Shaw
    36
    1837
    Wheat Sheaf Prospect Str
    W
    Richard Mitchell
    Hair Dresser (Deceased)
    John Boden
    Wine & Spirit Merchant (Deceased)
    Charles Hall
    Mary Jane Waterhouse
    Yorkshire (East Riding)
    England

    Comment


      #3
      This one is transcript only. Something odd here though as same names as above but different ages for the couple.
      James Henry
      Mitchell
      -
      21
      1873
      25 Nov 1873
      -
      Elizabeth Maria
      Shaw
      21
      1852
      1852
      York, England
      Yorkshire
      England

      Comment


        #4
        thank you for looking.

        1st is definately not him, i have no idea if 2nd is right one. how far is york from bradford? (i know both yorkshire) everything else i have linked to him and family is bradford. there are loads of james and james H and james henry marriages in bradford in the 5yrs.

        i'm going to make a list of all possibles and see if i can find more info on them of his fathers name etc.
        **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

        https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

        Comment


          #5
          They’re roughly 70 miles apart. So not the right one if your chap’s family are all in Bradford for a long time. Who was his father and what was his occupation? I see when he married Clara, there’s no mention of his middle name. No wonder you are having problems.

          I thought it very odd that the two transcripts I found were for the same marriage but vastly different ages for the couple. Maybe one transcript just uses “over 21” although no idea why when actual ages were on the cert. I thought it was a goer as the wife lived at a pub and that might be how it came to your ancestor. But obviously wrong people.

          Comment


            #6
            james henry's father was james mitchell, policeman in bradford.
            **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

            https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by GallowayLass View Post
              They’re roughly 70 miles apart. So not the right one if your chap’s family are all in Bradford for a long time. Who was his father and what was his occupation? I see when he married Clara, there’s no mention of his middle name. No wonder you are having problems.

              I thought it very odd that the two transcripts I found were for the same marriage but vastly different ages for the couple. Maybe one transcript just uses “over 21” although no idea why when actual ages were on the cert. I thought it was a goer as the wife lived at a pub and that might be how it came to your ancestor. But obviously wrong people.
              sorry if i've confused with the pub ppl, that wasnt the mitchells but another bit of info i discovered with having to re-do it, (post made sense to me but i knew what i meant)
              **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

              https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

              Comment


                #8
                LOL No probs. Sorry for the radio silence but have been out to town for a paper and bread.

                Comment


                  #9
                  I am getting totally confused as I have found what I think is the family with the father being a policeman in Bradford 1871 but the links on FMP are taking me back to 1861 with some of the same children and older ones (eldest listed is Mark c.1847) but this time father is in the mining industry. Is that correct? If that’s correct then the wife’s maiden surname from GRO for the children was GORNALL and your ancestor James Henry was registered at birth as plain James Mitchell ? I have found that Mark, William and James were baptised together in October 1862 when James was 10 years old. Again he has no middle name and father is still in mining.

                  I think I’d better leave this one for a while till my brain fog clears LOL
                  Last edited by GallowayLass; 27-12-20, 16:10. Reason: Found extra info

                  Comment


                    #10
                    There's only 8 marriages on FreeBMD for James Mitchell in Bradford 1871 to 1875. It will be a bit of a slog but shouldn't be too hard to eliminate some of them and look for a suitable death of a bride. Several of the certificates will likely be on line to help.

                    Of course if he didn't actually marry in Bradford .....!!

                    Sorry not on main computer at the mo but call out if you can't access the parish record certificates.
                    Anne

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Brain is back in gear and I think / hope I have it.
                      Starting from the 9 marriages of James Mitchell in Bradford 1871 - 1876 (in case he remarried very quickly) I noted all the ones after 1Q 1871 which it could not be as the census on which he is single was 2 April so that’s 2Q. Having got all the possible brides’ forenames and surnames, I worked through the forenames to find a matching death in Bradford between 2Q 1871 and all of 1876 for a MITCHELL woman who would be roughly the same age as James ought to have been given he was actually born 1852.
                      I came up with two Marys and two Isabellas. From the marriage indexes that gave me Mary WATERHOUSE and Mary APPLEYARD and Isabella MIDDLETON and Isabella HEAP.
                      Back to Yorkshire records on ancestry as FMP was surprisingly not much help. Then I hit paydirt!

                      23 January 1875 after Banns at St. Paul, Shipley James MITCHELL Bachelor of full age, warehouseman, residing Shipley. Father James MITCHELL police-officer to Isabella MIDDLETON Spinster of full age, weaver, residing Shipley. Father Thomas MAUDE Blacksmith. Witnesses William BATTLEFIELD and James CRABTREE.
                      The image of the certificate is on ancestry in the dataset West Yorkshire, England, Church of England Marriages and Banns, 1813-1935

                      From Wikipedia Shipley is a historic market town and civil parish in the City of Bradford, West Yorkshire, England.

                      GRO Death Indexes has this;
                      MITCHELL, ISABELLA 22
                      GRO Reference: 1876 M Quarter in BRADFORD YORKSHIRE Volume 09B Page 6
                      I can’t find a parish burial image for her either on ancestry or FMP.
                      It looks like James did not wait that long before marrying again to Clara.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        There could have been a child, perhaps Isabella died after childbirth as it’s the same quarter. There is a death a two quarters later that could be the same child.
                        MITCHELL, SARAH ELIZABETH MIDDLETON
                        GRO Reference: 1876 M Quarter in BRADFORD YORKSHIRE Volume 09B Page 114
                        MITCHELL, SARAH ELIZABETH 0
                        GRO Reference: 1876 S Quarter in BRADFORD YORKSHIRE Volume 09B Page 51

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Spot on GL! That was what I was aiming at! If you don't do much Yorkshire you need to know that Ancestry and FMP have it divided up between them! FMP does most of what is now called South Yorkshire, plus the old North and East Ridings. Ancestry does the rest, mainly the old West Riding, although there is some overlap.

                          edit to say ... good job you checked 1876 as well!

                          Anne

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Further to GL's death reg info for 1st q of 1876 Isabella Mitchell, Ancestry have a possible burial mistranscribed

                            West Yorkshire Non Conformist Records

                            Isabelea Mitchell
                            Born abt 1854 aged 22

                            Burial Bradford
                            Parish Undercliffe
                            Date 6 Mar 1876

                            Interred D26

                            and baby Sarah Elizabeth Mitchell buried 16 Aug 1876 aged 6 months
                            Undercliffe
                            Interred same grave D26

                            Vera

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by vera2013 View Post
                              Further to GL's death reg info for 1st q of 1876 Isabella Mitchell, Ancestry have a possible burial mistranscribed

                              West Yorkshire Non Conformist Records

                              Isabelea Mitchell
                              Born abt 1854 aged 22

                              Burial Bradford
                              Parish Undercliffe
                              Date 6 Mar 1876

                              Interred D26

                              and baby Sarah Elizabeth Mitchell buried 16 Aug 1876 aged 6 months
                              Undercliffe
                              Interred same grave D26

                              Vera
                              Brilliant Vera. That’s her. James was resident at Club Houses, Undercliffe on his 2nd marriage.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Isabella’s baptism. Her father is a blacksmith and they live in the Bolton district of Bradford. Her birth was registered in 1855
                                Isabella Middleton
                                Female
                                Baptised 15 Jul 1855
                                St Luke, Eccleshill, York, England
                                Thomas Middleton
                                Sarah
                                6358422
                                yrs 1844-1884 p 29
                                However there appears to be something awry with the birth registration as we have both of these. I checked both due to Thomas MAUDE being named as Isabella’s father on her marriage to James MITCHELL.
                                MIDDLETON, ISABELLA -
                                GRO Reference: 1855 J Quarter in BRADFORD AND NORTH BIERLEY YORKSHIRE Volume 09B Page 200
                                MAUDE, ISABELLA BOWER
                                GRO Reference: 1855 J Quarter in BRADFORD AND NORTH BIERLEY YORKSHIRE Volume 09B Page 68

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  I’m struggling to find any marriages that fit a Sarah BOWER or variant to a Thomas MIDDLETON or a Thomas MAUDE or variant or a Sarah MIDDLETON as a possible widow to anybody MAUDE or variant.
                                  Also struggling to identify a Thomas MIDDLETON or a Thomas MAUDE blacksmith or similar in Bradford 1851 1861 1871.

                                  Fresh eyes needed methinks.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Just catching up, not sure if solved or not, just skim reading?
                                    Carolyn
                                    Family Tree site

                                    Researching: Luggs, Freeman - Cornwall; Dayman, Hobbs, Heard - Devon; Wilson, Miles - Northants; Brett, Everett, Clark, Allum - Herts/Essex
                                    Also interested in Proctor, Woodruff

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by cbcarolyn View Post
                                      Just catching up, not sure if solved or not, just skim reading?
                                      Not sure. OP has not been back on yet.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by GallowayLass View Post
                                        I am getting totally confused as I have found what I think is the family with the father being a policeman in Bradford 1871 but the links on FMP are taking me back to 1861 with some of the same children and older ones (eldest listed is Mark c.1847) but this time father is in the mining industry. Is that correct? If that’s correct then the wife’s maiden surname from GRO for the children was GORNALL and your ancestor James Henry was registered at birth as plain James Mitchell ? I have found that Mark, William and James were baptised together in October 1862 when James was 10 years old. Again he has no middle name and father is still in mining.

                                        I think I’d better leave this one for a while till my brain fog clears LOL
                                        yes you have the right person, mother was Gormell, but like most names been written in fancy writing or transcribed wrongly.
                                        **no point asking the living for help as the dead are more helpful!!!**

                                        https://purplerosefamilytree.blogspot.com/

                                        Comment

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