Can anyone decipher this name?

[Nora]

My tree mainly consists of welsh records on my grandmothers side. The Irish stuff is only on my GG Grandads side so gonna work on filling them out, it's just hard though because I've never searched Irish things before now. Most of the crime records I've found with people who could be Michael seem to include other Heffernan's. Mainly mass brawls and being too drunk with the odd bit of stealing. There's just so many but I'll start to try and filter it to Waterford or Vicarstown. Not knowing the geography of Ireland and where the cases would go court doesn't help but yep, I agree they are fun to read. I found one Heffernan that was caught stealing two turkeys haha.

[Karamazov]

Yeh, to be honest I'm not sure where to start with the crime records, there's so many and even in the right area I still don't know lol. There was just too many Heffernan's being criminals! I think I found another child for Michael Heffernan and Anne Bagge but it's transcribed as Maria and it's hard to read on the page but I'm pretty sure it says Anne.
This is the record:
https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bi...=successSource
I assume Patritium is Patrick?
I found a dog license record too for one of the daughters in the right area. What was the point of such a record? It doesn't really give much information other than location.

Yes, it’s Patrick and I agree it’s Ann as mother.
Re the dog licence - yes, they don’t tell you a great deal, but in the days before irishgenealogy.ie came online, I was reduced to trawling through them to deduce when someone might have died or emigrated when they no longer got a licence. I’ve heard tell of records where the dog’s name was recorded, which is a nice touch, but have never come across one myself.
Re the petty sessions records - if you’ve now got a reasonable tree together, and have tracked descendants from BMDs and 1901 and 1911 census, make a note of the townland where they lived and see if that narrows things down. Whatever, they can be quite entertaining to read (more serious crimes would have gone to the quarter sessions/assizes.)
Most of mine are disputes/feuds with family and neighbours, but a lot of the time they didn’t even bother turning up to the court- just no app recorded in the verdict section.

Christine

[Nora]

Yeh, to be honest I'm not sure where to start with the crime records, there's so many and even in the right area I still don't know lol. There was just too many Heffernan's being criminals! I think I found another child for Michael Heffernan and Anne Bagge but it's transcribed as Maria and it's hard to read on the page but I'm pretty sure it says Anne.
This is the record:

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=61039&h=153112705&tid=167240555&pid=392234529229&queryId=ac81bc126bd7f2f87ce74db739d834b5&usePUB=true&_phsrc=GIS10691&_phstart=successSource

I assume Patritium is Patrick?
I found a dog license record too for one of the daughters in the right area. What was the point of such a record? It doesn't really give much information other than location.

[GallowayLass]

I haven’t looked beyond Vicarstown as keyword, but what I’ve gathered from searches so far: Heffernan marriages at Modelligo were registered in Lismore, births and deaths in Vicarstown were registered in Dungarvan, and they were up before the beak at Cappoquin.

Christine

That’s also what I found but as I haven’t a clue where some of the placenames are that were involved in the offences, I didn’t bother posting the finds for Michael and the spade etc. in case it started a wild goose chase LOL

[Karamazov]

I found a Michael Heffernan appearing a few times in the Petty Sessions on ancestry charged with theft. one of his offences was stealing a spade! No idea if all the Michael Hefferenans are the same man nor if he is the same one you are researching (William's father).

I haven’t looked beyond Vicarstown as keyword, but what I’ve gathered from searches so far: Heffernan marriages at Modelligo were registered in Lismore, births and deaths in Vicarstown were registered in Dungarvan, and they were up before the beak at Cappoquin.

Christine

[GallowayLass]

I found a Michael Heffernan appearing a few times in the Petty Sessions on ancestry charged with theft. one of his offences was stealing a spade! No idea if all the Michael Hefferenans are the same man nor if he is the same one you are researching (William's father).

[Karamazov]

There's so many petty crime records for Heffernan's. I did wonder if maybe some were relations because my GG grandad William liked to drink and steal haha. I think the Ellen on the 1901 and 1911 census is Johns widow. Found the birth records for all the children except Kate but there is a Mary born the same year, the parents are Ellen Corbett and John Hefferman. I think I found Ellen's death cert and informant is Michael Heffernan.

You can narrow them down by typing in the townland in the keyword section of the search. That’s fine with Vicarstown, but is more problematic when there are variant spellings of the place. I had to do all sorts of wildcarding for my Donegal ancestors - not just the townland but all the variant surname spellings!

Christine

[Nora]

Working theory re parents of Michael who married Ann Bagge: looking at the field books for Modelligo entries for Margaret and John Heffernan, my thoughts are that these two could well be his mother and father.
I think they refer to the same lease of just 4 roods, which was initially held by John. Presumably he dies between Oct 1848 and Sept 1850 when Margaret takes over the lease.

http://census.nationalarchives.ie/search/vob/results.jsp?surname=Heffernan+&firstname=&year_from=&year_to=&dd_dd=&dd_mm=&dd_yyyy=&book=&county=&barony=&parish=Modelligo+&townland=&last_name_other_or_lessor=&first_name_other_or_lessor=&search=Search

For more info on the field books, click on the Valuation office books tab at the top of this page:

https://genealogy.nationalarchives.ie

Thoughts, anyone?

Christine

This is amazing. Thank you so much Last week I didn't even know Williams birth year for sure and now I more than likely have all his family!

[Nora]

I did think of something else - the Irish Petty Sessions records - and got a few results for John and William Heffernan for drunkenness and salmon poaching!

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61938/?name=_Heffernan&count=50&keyword=Vicarstown&keyword_x=1&name_x=_1&_phtarg=sKE44%2CsKE45%2CsKE46%2CsKE47%2CsKE54

Christine

There's so many petty crime records for Heffernan's. I did wonder if maybe some were relations because my GG grandad William liked to drink and steal haha. I think the Ellen on the 1901 and 1911 census is Johns widow. Found the birth records for all the children except Kate but there is a Mary born the same year, the parents are Ellen Corbett and John Hefferman. I think I found Ellen's death cert and informant is Michael Heffernan.

[Karamazov]

Working theory re parents of Michael who married Ann Bagge: looking at the field books for Modelligo entries for Margaret and John Heffernan, my thoughts are that these two could well be his mother and father.
I think they refer to the same lease of just 4 roods, which was initially held by John. Presumably he dies between Oct 1848 and Sept 1850 when Margaret takes over the lease.

http://census.nationalarchives.ie/search/vob/results.jsp?surname=Heffernan+&firstname=&year_from=&year_to=&dd_dd=&dd_mm=&dd_yyyy=&book=&county=&barony=&parish=Modelligo+&townland=&last_name_other_or_lessor=&first_name_other_or_lessor=&search=Search

For more info on the field books, click on the Valuation office books tab at the top of this page:

https://genealogy.nationalarchives.ie

Thoughts, anyone?

Christine

[Karamazov]

I did think of something else - the Irish Petty Sessions records - and got a few results for John and William Heffernan for drunkenness and salmon poaching!

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/61938/?name=_Heffernan&count=50&keyword=Vicarstown&keyword_x=1&name_x=_1&_phtarg=sKE44%2CsKE45%2CsKE46%2CsKE47%2CsKE54

Christine

[Karamazov]

I had a look at the Griffiths Valuation for Heffernans in Vicarstown. County Waterford was surveyed 1848-1851. The only Heffernan in Vicarstown is a Margaret Heffernan.

http://griffiths.askaboutireland.ie/gv4/z/zoomifyDynamicViewer.php?file=302183&path=./pix/302/&rs=16&showpage=1&mysession=2728553818008&width=&height=

I would hazard a guess that she could be Michael Heffernan’s widowed mother. To confirm this, you would need access to the Griffiths Revision books to track who the tenancy passed to. Unfortunately, at the moment, you can only access these in person at the Irish Life Centre in Dublin.

As as you say you’re new to Irish records, I highly recommend Claire Santry’s Irish Genealogy Toolkit. She has a good overview of Griffiths Primary Valuation here:

https://www.irish-genealogy-toolkit.com/griffiths-valuation.html

and an overview of the Revision books here:

https://www.irish-genealogy-toolkit.com/revision-books.html

Christine

Further to this - I think this is probably the GV Margaret Heffernan’s death:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1873/020686/7258164.pdf

The informant is a Maggie Heffernan, also of Vicarstown, but relationship not recorded - daughter? daughter-in-law? Pity it’s not Michael!

Not sure what to suggest next, unless you want to trawl through all the Heffernan BMDs registered in Dungarvan and Lismore to see which happened in Vicarstown, and work out various family relationships...

Christine

[Nora]

Hmm ?

It's a good thing! I'm just very impressed with how quick you are at finding stuff. Without your help, I'd have been very stuck so thank you

[Karamazov]

For what it’s worth - I found the probate for the Heffernan priest (post 22) - his first name was indeed Pierse.

http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/reels/cwa/005014900/005014900_00199.pdf

Christine

[Karamazov]

You are a machine.

Hmm ?

[Karamazov]

I had a look at the Griffiths Valuation for Heffernans in Vicarstown. County Waterford was surveyed 1848-1851. The only Heffernan in Vicarstown is a Margaret Heffernan.

http://griffiths.askaboutireland.ie/gv4/z/zoomifyDynamicViewer.php?file=302183&path=./pix/302/&rs=16&showpage=1&mysession=2728553818008&width=&height=

I would hazard a guess that she could be Michael Heffernan’s widowed mother. To confirm this, you would need access to the Griffiths Revision books to track who the tenancy passed to. Unfortunately, at the moment, you can only access these in person at the Irish Life Centre in Dublin.

As as you say all you’re new to Irish records, I highly recommend Claire Santry’s Irish Genealogy Toolkit. She has a good overview of Griffiths Primary Valuation here:

https://www.irish-genealogy-toolkit.com/griffiths-valuation.html

and an overview of the Revision books here:

https://www.irish-genealogy-toolkit.com/revision-books.html

Christine

[Nora]

Found the first marriage in Modelligo in 1884 to Catherine Hackett. His age is given as 34 which would give birth around 1850, but as noted upthread, I couldn’t find a baptism for him so I suspect he was probably older. In my experience, Irish ages can vary wildly from record to record! The witness Margaret Heffernan

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1884/10920/5989730.pdf

Poor Catherine didn’t last long, dying in 1886

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1886/06257/4791941.pdf

She is recorded as wife of an army pensioner.

Christine

You are a machine. Thank you so much for all of this. There is no way I would have ever found this, I've never delved in to Irish records before now.

[Karamazov]

Found the first marriage in Modelligo in 1884 to Catherine Hackett. His age is given as 34 which would give birth around 1850, but as noted upthread, I couldn’t find a baptism for him so I suspect he was probably older. In my experience, Irish ages can vary wildly from record to record! The witness Margaret Heffernan

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1884/10920/5989730.pdf

Poor Catherine didn’t last long, dying in 1886

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1886/06257/4791941.pdf

She is recorded as wife of an army pensioner.

Christine

[Nora]

That makes sense. I couldn’t find a Bag or variant in Vicarstown on 1901 or 1911 censuses but there are Heffernan and variants. Have added in House number 1 in 1901 because in 1911 part of what is likely this family are now in Vicarstown South with a Heffernan servant. Looks like father has died and the brothers have moved house. You can see the “all information” in the actual images at http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/

Residents of a house 1 in Vicarstown North (Modelligo, Waterford)

Show all information

Kiely	Patrick	60	Male	Head of Family	Catholic
Kiely	Michael	30	Male	Son	Catholic
Kiely	Patrick	28	Male	Son	Catholic
Kiely	John	24	Male	Son	Catholic
Walsh	Margret	20	Female	Servant	Catholic
Walsh	Noragh	10	Female	Servant	Catholic
Morrisey	Thomas	60	Male	Servant	Catholic

1901 Residents of a house 2 in Vicarstown North (Modelligo, Waterford)

Show all information

Cullinane	Michael	38	Male	Head of Family	Roman Catholic
Cullinane	Mary	60	Female	Wife	Roman Catholic
Mahony	Maggie	18	Female	Relative	Roman Catholic

1901 Residents of a house 3 in Vicarstown North (Modelligo, Waterford)

Show all information

Heffernan	Ellen	50	Female	Head of Family	Roman Catholic
Heffernan	Kate	12	Female	Daughter	Roman Catholic
Heffernan	Hanora	11	Female	Daughter	Roman Catholic
Heffernan	Ellen	9	Female	Daughter	Roman Catholic
Heffernan	Michael	8	Male	Son	Roman Catholic

1911 Residents of a house 1 in Vicarstown, North (Modelligo, Waterford)

Show all information

Kiely	John	32	Male	Head of Family	Roman Catholic
Kiely	Michael	41	Male	Brother	Roman Catholic
Kiely	Patrick	38	Male	Brother	Roman Catholic
Hoffernan	Michael	18	Male	Servant	Roman Catholic

1911 Residents of a house 2 in Vicarstown, North (Modelligo, Waterford)

Show all information

Heffernane	Ellen	60	Female	Head of Family	Roman Catholic
Heffernane	Mary	21	Female	Daughter	Roman Catholic
Heffernane	Ellen	20	Female	Daughter	Roman Catholic

1911 Residents of a house 1 in Vicarstown, South (Modelligo, Waterford)

Show all information

Hickey	Patrick	51	Male	Head of Family	Catholic
Hickey	Margaret	44	Female	Wife	Catholic
Hickey	James	18	Male	Son	Catholic
Hickey	John	17	Male	Son	Catholic
Hickey	Bridget	16	Female	Daughter	Catholic
Hickey	Richard	14	Male	Son	Catholic
Hickey	Thomas	12	Male	Son	Catholic
Hickey	Catherine	11	Female	Daughter	Catholic
Hickey	Margaret	9	Female	Daughter	Catholic
Hickey	Maurice	7	Male	Son	Catholic
Hickey	Mary	2	Female	Daughter	Catholic
Cahill	Patrick	65	Female	Servant	Catholic
Heffernane	Norah	22	Male	Servant	Catholic

Could this be John's widow Ellen? It makes sense with her being widowed or am I clutching at straws.

[Karamazov]

I think this is probably the death of informant son/stepson John Heffernan - informant is his wife, another Ellen.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy....83/4701565.pdf

The John Heffernan who marries an Ellen Keating in 1874 is not him - different father.
(I’ve only been looking at Heffernan info registered in Dungarvan as that is the nearest registration town for Vicarstown/Modelligo parish.)

If the age if 50 is correct, he was born circa 1843, which would account for why I couldn’t find a baptism for him - so can’t find first wife’s name via that route, unfortunately.
Wonder where he was getting a pension from? Could he have been a soldier too?
Christine

I think this is John Heffernan marrying Ellen Corbett in 1887 in Modelligo Catholic Church. Reg district is Lismore.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy....97/5937493.pdf

Occupation is caretaker. He’s a widower, so will have a look for first wife!

Christine