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Father of Andrew Murphy 1810-1855 + Robert born 1803 Liverpool ????

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  • Father of Andrew Murphy 1810-1855 + Robert born 1803 Liverpool ????

    This is a real tough one and I would appreciate your advice. I'm trying to track down the parents of Andrew Murphy 1810-1855 (wife Mary Tebay) and Richard born 1803, from Liverpool. On Andrew's marriage record the father is also Robert a labourer. On Census records it says Andrew was born in Liverpool, but it could be they originally came from Ireland I guess. Any thoughts on how I might sort this one...Murphy Liverpool/Ireland - there are lots of those!!!!
    Thanks for reading,
    Rachel :(

  • #2
    Robert or Richard born Liverpool in 1803?

    Comment


    • #3
      I think Rachel means that Andrew & Richard are brothers, with a father called Robert.

      on Familysearch this is what is shown

      Discover your family history. Explore the world’s largest collection of free family trees, genealogy records and resources.
      Julie
      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

      .......I find dead people

      Comment


      • #4
        this is the marriage I guess

        Julie
        They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

        .......I find dead people

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        • #5
          It's my age Julie.........well that's my excuse.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by AlanC View Post
            It's my age Julie.........well that's my excuse.
            lol!! I know what you mean, I had to read it a few times to get my head around it, though I'm not much nearer now!! I can see Andrew/Mary in the census but can't see anything much for Richard.. grr
            Julie
            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

            .......I find dead people

            Comment


            • #7
              Hello Julie and Alan
              Thank you so much because I now have Andrew's mother's name Ann which I didn't have before and I have a possibility for her in the 1841, but with lots of guesswork - I'm convinced Robert (father of Andrew) and possibly his wife Ann came to England from Ireland, Andrew's baptism was at St Anthony's Church, Liverpool, newly built for Irish Immigrants! I just don't know how to get back further, as Andrew was born in 1809 and his brother in 1803, I'm guessing they were born in the 1770's - this is really tough.
              But thanks again,
              Rachel

              Comment


              • #8
                Rachel,

                do you know if Andrew left a will when he died? getting back pre census is a nightmare especially if you don't have much of an idea where they came from.. maybe there is a clue in his childrens names? sometimes they followed a naming pattern, {but not always!}.. this might help.
                Julie
                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                .......I find dead people

                Comment


                • #9
                  had you seen this one Rachel.. possibly a sister?

                  Discover your family history. Explore the world’s largest collection of free family trees, genealogy records and resources.
                  Julie
                  They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                  .......I find dead people

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    oooooooooo have you seen this Rachel??

                    might be worth looking thru them to see if any more info can be gleaned.. (ie a burial for Robert) or bapts for other children..

                    Julie
                    They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                    .......I find dead people

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yes, St Anthony's index records are really helpful if you have ancestors there, as I do.
                      The image of the 1809 baptism for Andrew Murphy is available on ancestry if you have access, but it's not indexed yet so doesn't come up in search results. If you browse Liverpool Catholic Baptisms>St Anthony's>1809 you should be able to see it, but here is the link:

                      Sponsors were Peter Scallan & Mary Henrick & d.o.b. 30/11/1809 but I couldn't spot any other Murphy baptisms belonging to the same family.
                      Just a word of caution, are you absolutely sure that the Andrew Murphy baptism at St Anthony's is the right family? Although the father's name is the same, this was a Catholic baptism, whereas Andrew married at a C of E church. I know this was possible, of course, but you may just want to check that there weren't two Andrew Murphys in Liverpool at the time!
                      Good luck with your search
                      Sandra

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        What a great find Julie well done, just had a browse and the baptisms give the names of the godparents too

                        Edna

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                        • #13
                          http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk/ Not forgetting this site too, though a little late maybe for this thread

                          Edna

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                          • #14
                            I cannot see the details of the marriage to know what year it took place, but please remember that before 1824 (?) Roman Catholic marriages were not recognised as valid in England and Wales. Even after that date, many RC churches were not licenced for marriage, so the getaround for that was to marry in the C of E church and then have a nuptial mass in the RC church, which then made the marriage valid from a RC point of view!

                            OC

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                            • #15
                              Thank you, I did not know that and it certainly answers that question. They were married in 1837. They were certainly from an Irish Catholic background but later in the tree both weddings and baptisms take place in Anglican Churches
                              Best wishes,
                              Rachel
                              Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
                              I cannot see the details of the marriage to know what year it took place, but please remember that before 1824 (?) Roman Catholic marriages were not recognised as valid in England and Wales. Even after that date, many RC churches were not licenced for marriage, so the getaround for that was to marry in the C of E church and then have a nuptial mass in the RC church, which then made the marriage valid from a RC point of view!

                              OC

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by clematised View Post
                                What a great find Julie well done, just had a browse and the baptisms give the names of the godparents too

                                Edna
                                I didnt do owt fancy... just googled the church :smilee:
                                Julie
                                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                .......I find dead people

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Yes interesting, very much a late addition, as I can't find any children in between, a bit odd really children born in 1803, 1809 and then this one in 1828!!!
                                  Thanks,
                                  Rachel
                                  Originally posted by Darksecretz View Post
                                  had you seen this one Rachel.. possibly a sister?

                                  https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JSVF-CLK

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    one of my Doctors as a child was Dr Tebay ...his daughter is still a doctor here ...so ...I knew Tebay were C OF E ...but you say Andrew Murphy was Irish catholic ...
                                    OPC, Online Parish Clerk, family history, local history, free data, parish registers, census, Lancashire

                                    mary tebay
                                    marriage
                                    1837 .........luckily...it is there
                                    14th august 1837 at St Peter ,Liverpool,Lancashire
                                    Andrew Murphy X aged 27 a Labourer, Bachelor of Addison Street
                                    Mary TEBEY X aged 24 Spinster of Circus Street
                                    grooms father Robert Murphy a labourer
                                    brides father John Tebey an Ostler
                                    witness Michael Hogan X Elizabeth Kenning ( the only one to sign )
                                    married by Banns by John Cheetham , Curate ........................................do you already have these details ? same site has Mary Tebay baptism - same church -23rd may 1813 ..parents John Tebay and Mary ...abode William Street ...Johns occupation states Hostler......
                                    I am curious now as to whether our local Dr Tebay is connected ?.....lol
                                    hope this helps
                                    allan;)
                                    Last edited by garstonite; 25-10-12, 11:09.
                                    Allan ......... researching oakes/anyon/standish/collins/hartley/barker/collins-cheshire
                                    oakes/tipping/ellis/jones/schacht/...garston, liverpool
                                    adams-shropshire/roberts-welshpool
                                    merrick/lewis/stringham/nicolls-herefordshire
                                    coxon/williamson/kay/weaver-glossop/stockport/walker-gorton

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      This website is for sale! liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!


                                      street locations , if you are interested ...Circus Street is by Lime Street station area ...I would have thought a decent area in those days ( 1837 )...if John Tebay was an Ostler ( Stableman ) I wonder did he live with his Employer ??....

                                      Andrew Murphy lived very close to St Anthonys in Addison St( Scotland Rd area ) - very heavily populated at the time ...

                                      allan
                                      Allan ......... researching oakes/anyon/standish/collins/hartley/barker/collins-cheshire
                                      oakes/tipping/ellis/jones/schacht/...garston, liverpool
                                      adams-shropshire/roberts-welshpool
                                      merrick/lewis/stringham/nicolls-herefordshire
                                      coxon/williamson/kay/weaver-glossop/stockport/walker-gorton

                                      Comment

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