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1861 look-up. Elizabeth Powell b c 1825 Northlew

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  • 1861 look-up. Elizabeth Powell b c 1825 Northlew

    I have deduced the following narrative from on-line census and BMD records and, whilst I am reasonably satisfied at its accuracy, I fully accept there remains a potential for false conclusions.

    Elizabeth Lux(t)on was born circa 1825 at Northlew, Devon. In 1848 she married William Voaden, to be widowed in the following year. Later in 1849 she married John Powell, born 1826. He always stated his birthplace to be Lydford but this is in contradiction with the declaration of his father in 1841.

    In 1851 Elizabeth was living with her mother, Elizabeth Luxon, in Stoke Damerel, Plymouth. She was described as "mariner's wife". In 1871 John and Elizabeth were together in Tavistock.

    Elizabeth died in 1873. In 1874 John married Mary Ann Brannan, and in 1881 they were together with their children in Stoke Damerel. John was shown as a "Greenwich Pensioner", born circa 1830. His age was correct in 1891.

    It seems quite likely that John was at sea in 1851 and possibly again in 1861. I have seen an entry for a John Powell, bc 1830, Totnes, on board "Doris", but I think that this was a separate individual. There are matching entries for both Johns in 1841. My question is; where was Elizabeth in 1861? I am keen to trace her to establish if this couple had any children.

    My particular focus is on Elizabeth but if anyone sees John, please let me know!

  • #2
    not found her yet there are only two Elizabeth Powells listed in 1861 born in Northlew abt the right age

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    • #3
      is this someone different?
      1861
      Source Citation: Class: RG 9; Piece: 1465; Folio: 56; Page: 12; GSU roll: 542817.
      Jess

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      • #4
        Jess - Thanks, I will look at that when I am next in the library - but first I shall have to work out how to use the reference you have given me to locate the entry.

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        • #7
          Originally posted by Jessbowbag View Post
          is this someone different?
          1861
          Source Citation: Class: RG 9; Piece: 1465; Folio: 56; Page: 12; GSU roll: 542817.
          That is the same as the one Val has given the link for and it shows John Voaden, ag lab born Branton Clovelly with Elizabeth and 2 children but that can't be her as her name was Powell having married John Powell in 1849.

          We need to look for Elizabeth Powell b1825 Northlew Devon and John Powell b1826 Lydford or thereabouts occ Mariner

          Margaret

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          • #8
            This is the link for the couple in 1871 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?h...=&pid=11244290 and John is shown as a labourer. This is at odds with him being a Greenwich Pensioner in 1881.

            Are you sure it is the same John Powell you see in 1881?

            Margaret

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            • #9
              Can you give us the reference for the 1851 sighting of Elizabeth with her mother and for John in 1881 please? It's the type of information that Jess gave in her post earlier.
              Margaret

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              • #10
                This is the 1851 census Margaret - Class HO107; Piece 1882 Folio 451 Page 72 - http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?h...c=&pid=6765858


                Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

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                • #11
                  And 1881 John - Class RG11 Piece 2206 Folio 145 Page 35 - http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?h...c=&pid=3375744
                  Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

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                  • #12
                    she married John Powell, born 1826. He always stated his birthplace to be Lydford but this is in contradiction with the declaration of his father in 1841.

                    Which do you think is him in 1841 please? Bearing in mind that they only say whether they were born in county or not, not exactly where in the county.
                    Last edited by Chrissie Smiff; 31-07-12, 16:46.
                    Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

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                    • #13
                      Can you tell us please how you got back to Elizabeth etc? What certificates do you have please as I am wondering whether you are getting people mixed up?
                      Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

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                      • #14
                        There is a record here http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/c...accessmethod=0 of John Powell in the National Archives Greenwich Pensioners section. I think you need to check all the records that might be him to see if it helps with your search.

                        Margaret

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                        • #15
                          Margaret - thanks, that looks very interesting and certainly worth following up, although I wonder if the personal details will be sufficiently precise to enable conclusive identification.

                          Chrissie - in my original post I explained that all my research had been done on line (no documentary evidence) and I accepted the possibility that I might be barking up the wrong (family) tree completely. This is what I know/think I know. Sorry. I do not have census references.

                          John Powell, s/o Thomas and Elizabeth was "received" into Lydford church on 28 Dec 1828. The baptism register shows his date of birth as 1 Jun 1826.

                          In 1841 he was living with his parents and siblings, including Sophia, at Lydford. He is shown as being born "out of county". It is known that his father, Thomas , was in the Life Guards in 1827, returning to civilian life in 1828 (a2a documents). It seems quite possible John was born whilst he was serving outside of Devon. As John grew up in Lydford from a very early age, it is natural that he would consider that to be his home and where he was from. It is not too surprising if he confused that with his place of birth.

                          In 1851 and 1871 Elizabeth's date and place of birth is consistently shown as 1825, Northlew. In 1851 she is with her mother, Elizabeth Luxon.

                          The names Elizabeth Luxton and William Voaden appear on the same page June Q 1848, Stoke Damerel

                          The death of a William Voaden is recorded Sep Q 1849, Stoke Damerel

                          The names Elizabeth Voaden and John Powell appear on the same page Dec Q 1849 Plymouth

                          The death of an Elizabeth Powell is recorded Sep Q 1873 Stoke Damerel age 48 ( i e born 1825)

                          The names John Powell and Mary Ann Brannan appear on the same page Jun Q 1874 Stoke Damerel.

                          I had read the occupation of Elizabeth Powell in 1851 as "mariner's wife". At the time I thought this rather strange. I would have expected "sailor" or "seaman". Given what Margaret has found, I now think that this could be "marine's wife".

                          I was initially suspicious of the entry in 1881 for John and Mary Ann Powell, and family, because of the discrepancies in age and place of birth of John and the fact that I had found a John Powell, b 1830, Totnes, with a naval record. However when I compared it with 1891, with its match for all family members, I was satisfied that this was the same family, and the same John Powell. The clincher for me was the presence of a young daughter, Sophia.

                          A possible answer to my original question is that John was serving overseas in 1861 and that Elizabeth was accompanying him.

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                          • #16
                            I can see your logic adds up with the evidence you have but I think you must get the marriage certificates for and John to Elizabeth and John to Mary Ann to see if he gives his father's name as Thomas. That is the only certain way to confirm he is the same person.

                            Margaret

                            PS the Greenwich records may show where John was in 1861 and if Elizabeth was with him.
                            Last edited by margaretmarch; 01-08-12, 09:29.

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                            • #17
                              I agree. My next step is to get hold of some documents to see if they support the theory. Incidentally, I should have mentioned in my previous post that the first child of John and Mary Ann was named Thomas John. Co-incidence or what?

                              There still remains the uncertainty whether John and Elizabeth had any children in their 24 years of marriage. I am beginning to suspect not.

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                              • #18
                                The only sure way is to work back step by step with certificates and census entries. It's very easy to veer off into the wrong tree.
                                Uncle John - Passed away March 2020

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