Definition for you Debbs ..
Journeyman - A tradesman who has served his trade apprenticeship and mastered his craft, not bound to serve a master, but originally hired by the day. The name derives from the French for day - jour.
Also a victorian occupation website Debbs that i have found really handy! Came across Stevedore the other day, wouldn't have had a clue but for the site!!
Nooooooo, not telling anyone off, just pointing out that the dictionary contains most words and is an easier first port of call than specialised websites.
I was more interested to know if there were any other descriptions or opinions of the trade name as I have a line in my family that I now suspect were Gypsies or Travellers, so just trying to clarify the things they wrote as their trade in the census. I do try to source other places prior to coming on here and using up other peoples time, but sometimes just a different 'take' on things helps.
My huge Encarta dictionary is never far from my side,I can assure you :0 it is my friend, especially since starting this new hobby - strike that - addiction! lol!
Debbs
I don't think the expression Traveller was used in the 19th century for gypsies. Traveller is a late 20th century description for people who lived on the move with no fixed abode but who are NOT gypsies or tinkers.
In the 19th century, a traveller would have been a commercial traveller - what we would call a salesman today, lol, but one who travelled around with a suitcase full of tinned peaches etc, visiting grocers and so on.
Originally posted by Heather Positive ThinkerView Post
Thing is, what sort of journeyman is your ancestor? It covers lots of skilled workers, such as carpenters, blacksmiths and so on
Great minds! I was just thinking that as I read the thread and turned the page!! I have a couple of journeymen in my tree, one is a shoemaker and the other a housepainter.
usually a journeyman carpenter, blacksmith etc has done his apprenticeship and travels around looking for work. that's the gist i get, i can't remember if it is for experience as part of his apprenticeship or full on work.
Have to disagree Kylejustin. As mentioned above the journey is from the work jour meaning day. After completing an apprenticeship a man would become a journeyman, paid by the day. He might go on to become a master of his trade, or remain a journeyman, but the term did not have anything to do with travelling around.
Have to disagree Kylejustin. As mentioned above the journey is from the work jour meaning day. After completing an apprenticeship a man would become a journeyman, paid by the day. He might go on to become a master of his trade, or remain a journeyman, but the term did not have anything to do with travelling around.
That is right Judith, I looked this up from the site I posted earlier when I found Journeymen in my tree:
Journeyman one who served his apprenticeship and mastered his craft - time served, and no longer had to work for someone else (though they often still did)
After completing an apprenticeship a man would become a journeyman, paid by the day. He might go on to become a master of his trade, or remain a journeyman, but the term did not have anything to do with travelling around.
That's what I understood, too - with an emphasis that he also did not have his own apprentices - i.e., he was trained, had completed whatever apprenticeship was required, but did not have his own shop, and did not train apprentices. The latter two might change later in time.
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