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Feet of Fines Lancashire and Military Records and my Ancestors?

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  • Feet of Fines Lancashire and Military Records and my Ancestors?

    What are the chances of my family name that I find in the Feet of Fines in Lancashire as far back as 1250, and in military records being that of my ancestors!
    I have found the family name in records of military service for Richard Fitz Alan Earl of Arundel in 1388 as an archer, the family name is in sixteen medieval garrison records for musters and pay records in England, France and Scotland everyone one of the soldiers are recorded as originating in areas of Lancashire for example Fishwick, Wiswell & Sefton to name just a few locations.
    Could military service be the reason why the name is still found in clusters in the locations where they were associated with a particular commander like Exeter, where they served Thomas Beaufort Duke of Exeter.
    In Essex where I come from, my ancestors first appear in church records in Elizabethan times in Saffron Walden which also has a castle which owned by the Bohun family as Sir Humphrey Bohun Earl of Essex was granted a licence to crenellate the castle by Edward 111.

    Could this be the link between Lancashire, Arundel and Essex?

    Mary Bohun who inherited Saffron Walden castle was the daughter of Humphrey de Bohun and Joan Fitzalan (1347/1348-1419), the daughter of Richard FitzAlan, 10th Earl of Arundel and Eleanor of Lancaster.

    Pure Conjecture I know but very interesting all the same!



  • #2
    That all sounds very exciting. There's certainly a logic to the idea that a family in service to a Lord might well find members "posted" to other branches of the same family. After all - a reference from a family member would normally carry at least as much weight as one from some other unrelated person.

    Christine
    Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

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    • #3
      I forgot to include that the family doesn't have a Coat of Arms but it has a family Crest which is in Fairbairn's book of family crests, it's very similar to the Isle of Man's coat of arms.
      It is described in Fairbairn's book of family crests as (Family name) English in origin, Three Legs in Armour, United at Thigh, Flexed at Knee and Spurred.
      I don't use it or display it as I can't prove that I am entitled to use it.
      But it could still be another part of the jigsaw I don't know why crests were bestowed on a person in the medieval period, does anyone know why?
      If so could you let me know the answer.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by fronteria View Post
        I forgot to include that the family doesn't have a Coat of Arms but it has a family Crest which is in Fairbairn's book of family crests, it's very similar to the Isle of Man's coat of arms.
        It is described in Fairbairn's book of family crests as (Family name) English in origin, Three Legs in Armour, United at Thigh, Flexed at Knee and Spurred.
        I don't use it or display it as I can't prove that I am entitled to use it.
        But it could still be another part of the jigsaw I don't know why crests were bestowed on a person in the medieval period, does anyone know why?
        If so could you let me know the answer.
        This looks like a link where you might be able to find out... http://www.college-of-arms.gov.uk/Faq.htm

        Christine
        Last edited by Christine in Herts; 20-03-12, 17:13.
        Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi. Christine
          Thanks for the link, I have had a good look through the site although it explains that the crest is not a Coat of Arms and it was placed on the helm which I assume is the helmet probably to identify him to his own side, It doesn't give a hint as why they were bestowed on the person, It appears to be symbolic of something that I don't understand.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by fronteria View Post
            Hi. Christine
            Thanks for the link, I have had a good look through the site although it explains that the crest is not a Coat of Arms and it was placed on the helm which I assume is the helmet probably to identify him to his own side, It doesn't give a hint as why they were bestowed on the person, It appears to be symbolic of something that I don't understand.
            I didn't notice - is there a contact method through which you could ask? I'd guess an answer from there would be pretty definitive.

            ... and yes Helm/Helmet are the same, I believe in this context. I suspect (without checking) that "helmet" = a little "helm". It begs the question as to why "at the helm" means steering something.

            Christine
            Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

            Comment


            • #7
              Crests weren't bestowed on individuals. As the name suggests, a family crest was used by a family. Coats of Arms are specific to one individual, family crests are a sort of umbrella applying to all family members. You would know if you were entitled to use a Family Crest.

              OC

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              • #8
                Thanks, OC. I have a smattering of knowledge in that field, but nothing specialist.

                Christine
                Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
                  Crests weren't bestowed on individuals. As the name suggests, a family crest was used by a family. Coats of Arms are specific to one individual, family crests are a sort of umbrella applying to all family members. You would know if you were entitled to use a Family Crest.

                  OC
                  Hi. OC
                  Do you happen to know why a crest would have been bestowed on a family?
                  From what I read it can't be unusual for the right to get lost in the mists of time by a family as there are instructions on the College of Arms site on how to to go about proving the right to armorial bearings as they are hereditary, but it appears to be an expensive process as you have to hire officers of arms to carry out various searches within the College of Arms and conduct genealogical research outside of it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The crest is merely a part of a Coat of Arms. It would originally perhaps have identified a family on a battlefield (including their servants). It might help to imagine that the crest is a family surname, a coat of arms is the individual's first name, in the days before surnames were in common use.

                    It is an offence to use or display either a family crest or a coat of arms to which you are not entitled although I don't think there have been many prosecutions lately, lol. Just because you have the same surname doesn't mean you are entitled.

                    Yes indeed, you can claim Arms if you are the next person in line to inherit them. You would know this though, as some close member of your family would be armigerous.

                    For many centuries it has been possible to buy both Arms and Crests, you do not need to be armigerous to do so, just rich.

                    OC

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