A 1851 census lookup please..........

[siamesewillow]

For years I have been looking for Philemon Mangal Richards born approx 1806 England on the 1851 census without success. In 1825 he marries Emma Rowles. On the 1841 census Philemon is a widower, he is now living at Sheppard Court, Castle Precinct Ward Bristol with his sons George b 1829, William b 1827 and daughter Emma b 1831, all three born in Bristol. In 1853 Philemon goes to the USA where he lives with another family from England and dies over there. He was a cordwainer by occupation.

Any help would be appreciated.

siamese

[herky]

Sorry - no luck so far!

[Loopy Linda in La La Land]

Nor me

Linda

[Darksecretz]

nor me!!

[Loopy Linda in La La Land]

He's on Genes...unless that's you!

Linda

[Darksecretz]

Siamesewillow,

on the marriage does it name any witness'? where does the name Mangal fit in? is this on the marriage? you could try looking for the Banns of the marriage, this might them give you an idea where he came from.

[herky]

from memory - I did find a Philemon Mangel

[Katarzyna]

Me too,
I thought I had posted on here this morning!!?? Must have forgotten to press enter lol.

I googled the name and I saw you had asked this question on just about every forum there is I know how you feel, you just know he has to be somewhere! Pity he wasn't born in County on the 1841 census - at least you would have a place to start.

[Christine in Herts]

I've had a bit of a look, without success.

I've found some possible candidates for teh children - none of whom seems to be with Philemon.

Do you know from which port Philemon left when he emigrated? That might give a clue as to where he was in 1851... no guarantee, of course.

Otherwise, it's possible he was in an institution, and listed only by initials.

Christine

[siamesewillow]

Philemon left from Liverpool on the Empire. Philemon and Emma married at St Paul's Bristol. Found the marriage on family search.
Thanks

siamese

[Katarzyna]

Have you looked at the PR's for St Paul's Bristol? That should give father's name and witnesses which should help.
Julie referred to this in post 6 - did you miss that one?

[Katarzyna]

As a last resort:
The marriage was a submitted entry batch no 8527030 sheet no 57
The form of the submitter is on the Patron Ordinance Submission Sheets 1969-1991.
This is on the film - FHL US/CAN Film 1396106 and can be ordered through LDS centre.
With a bit of luck you can find the submitter and contact them to see where they got that marriage info from (probably the PR's).They may have other info that could help you.

[chrisj1961]

I know this is a wild card, but are you quite sure your Philemon Richards emigrated to the USA ?, nowhere either in the US records or the UK records can I find any mention of Philemon Mangal Richards emigrating. I have a few Philemon Richards emigrating (including the one who sailed from Liverpool in 1853) but nothing which absolutely indicates it is your Philemon Mangal Richards.

Am sorry this doesn't really help you, but it might be something to question unless you have proof on this.

[chrisj1961]

Also, are you sure he is from England, Richards is a very popular name in Wales, have you looked through the 1851 Wales census ?

[Darksecretz]

have you checked Non Conformist registers for his birth?