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View Full Version : Looking for baptisms of two TAUTZ brothers in Middlesex



tiddles
17-07-11, 00:26
hI,

George Leonard Tautz and Charles Tautz have two other brothers William Franklin Tautz and Alfred James Tautz, both were baptized Christ Church, St Marylebone and a sister Isabella Alice baptized Christ Church, Southwark, Surrey. The family of 5 children appear on 1841 census HO107/673/19 St Giles in the Fields, Finsbury with their parents Charles and Isabella.


According to the 1841 census George Leonard Tautz is born about 1836 and Charles about 1831 and I would like some help to find their baptisms
because this is one of those families where there is christian name confusion.
thanks
tiddles

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 01:21
London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906 (http://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=1558&enc=1)
George Lenoard Tautz
Baptism Estimated Birth Date: abt 1836
Baptism Date: 13 Mar 1836
Father's name:Charles Alfred Tautz
Mother's name: Isabella Tautz
Parish or Poor Law Union: St Marylebone Christ Church
Borough: Westminster

William Frankling Tautz was baptised the same day 13 March 1836
Alfred James Tautz on 15 Sep 1833

Then there is Isabella Alice 17 Oct 1841 Southwark Christ Church

Cannot see a Charles.

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 02:11
Marriage
Charles Alfred Tautz and Isabella Frankling 02 Dec 1832 St Mary at Lambeth, Surrey
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_195092-00184&fn=Charles+Alfred&ln=Tautz&st=r&ssrc=&pid=2387183
Witnesses: Henrietta Tautz and Jas Longman Gawler (He signed lots of others tho')

Is it likely that father Charles Alfred or Isabella had been married before?

Possibly Charles born c 1831 was born to a previous marriage or was illegitimate.

cpdavis35
17-07-11, 10:25
in addition to the information on Isabella Alice Tautz baptised 17 Oct 1841... birth was 30 March 1841. Died 14 Dec 1842.

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 12:51
I found this last night but was too tired to look at it properly, lol. Perhaps others can help by finding these on the census to eliminate them as a possibility:

IGI batch no Co47932
Charles William Franklin
born 4 may 1831
baptized 27 Nov 1831 Old Church , St Pancras, London to parents John and Isabella

Only one child baptized to them

However, it says Isabella is a spinster on her marriage entry to Charles.

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 17:29
Found a marriage for Isabella Tautz to George Henry Law 4th Aug 1850 Lambeth Surrey.
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_195098-00107&fn=Isabella&ln=Tautz&st=r&ssrc=pt_t28335829_p12030927522_kpidz0q3d1203092752 2z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgPLz0q3dpid&pid=4868551

Jul-Aug-Sep 1850 v4 p341 Lambeth
Isabella's father is given as William Franklin deceased, a farmer.

Therefore I think we can eliminate the birth for Charles in post 5.

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 17:37
I found Charles on 1851 with his mother and step father George Law- mistranscribed as Tanley, b 1833 Marylebone - cheesemonger

HO107; Piece: 1569; Folio: 219; Page: 17

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=uki1851&indiv=try&h=824767

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 18:17
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=freebmddeath&h=20381842&ti=5538&indiv=try&gss=pt&ssrc=pt_t28335829_p12030927522_kpidz0q3d1203092752 2z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgPLz0q3dpid

This maybe Isabella's death age 64
Jul-Aug-Sep 1879
St Saviour Southwark 1d 72
(http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=freebmddeath&h=20381842&ti=5538&indiv=try&gss=pt&ssrc=pt_t28335829_p12030927522_kpidz0q3d1203092752 2z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgPLz0q3dpid)

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 19:10
Tiddles,
Is any of this info of any use to you - I don't know if you have all this information. :)

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 19:24
Oh this is really strange.
I have found a marriage for Charles Tautz to Maria Chubb and his mother Isabella Law is a witness. However Charles gives his father as Char (crossed out )and David Tautz has been written along side.???
8 Aug 1854 St Marylebone
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_194717-00143&fn=Maria&ln=Chubb&st=d&ssrc=pt_t28335829_p12030927518_kpidz0q3d1203092751 8z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgPLz0q3dpid_m1&pid=6115669

Can someone have a look at this and see what you think please.

I think this must be the question that was being asked in the first place. :)

Katarzyna
17-07-11, 23:27
I see you already have all this information from Roots web

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=printpage;topic=485017.0

W (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=printpage;topic=485017.0)ell that was a waste of time.:(

tiddles
18-07-11, 01:35
Hi, Latarzyna,

Thanks very much for the baptism for George Leonard Tautz. I thought I'd try again on this family just in case something was omitted the first time round on Rootsweb which is why I just asked for someone to look for the two baptisms, George Leonard Tautz baptism obviously was, so it wasn't a complete waste of time.

I decided to go through the children of Charles and Isabella one at a time to see if anything comes up.

I have found Charles and Maria's children Ann Fanny,fathers name CHARLES WILLIAM TAUTZ; George Alfred, father CHARLES WILLIAM TAUTZand Charles James Thomas Tautz, father CHARLES WILLIAM FRANKLIN TAUTZ. I can't get my head round this one, because Charles has a brother named William Franklin Tautz who incidentally I can't find anything on him. All those three children die in infancy but they have a daugher Emily who I know little about, other than in 1871 living with charles and maria in st. saviour, and 1881 census living in lambeth walk.

I appreciate all the time you have spent on this, and would understand if you do not wish to continue.

best wishes
tiddles

Katarzyna
18-07-11, 01:49
Hi,
I'm pleased that I was able to find something for you that you hadn't already got. I enjoyed working thro' it all - I always like a challenge. I just wish you'd put up the reason for this statement:

"this is one of those families where there is christian name confusion"

When I saw the witness - Isabella - on the marriage of Charles and the father's name David - the penny dropped.:)


This is the only indication that a David exists that I can find:

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...i=0&gss=angs-d

a (http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=LondonMarrLicences&pgt=punt&rank=1&gsfn=david&gsln=taute&gsby=1810&gsb2co=3251%2cEngland&gsb2pl=5274%2cLondon&gsdy=&gsd2co=1%2cAll+Countries&gsd2pl=1%2c+&sbo=1&sbor=&srchb=r&prox=1&db=&ti=5538&ti.si=0&gss=angs-d)ssuming the e should be a z. I can't even find a mention of a David by scrolling thro to the T's !!!

cpdavis35
18-07-11, 08:16
I can't find anything on a David Tautz either....possible birth in another country maybe european? or was name made up and was actually something else? frustrating! lol.

Katarzyna
18-07-11, 10:56
If Charles Tautz was born 1831 as on 1841 census then he was born before his parents married.
On Charles's marriage entry his mother is a witness as Isabella Law having remarried after the death of her husband Charles.
Maybe she had second thoughts when her son married and thought she would need to tell her son the truth about his parentage as she would be signing a legal document.
You could be right about a European connection, CP. Perhaps she met her husband thro' a cousin David . She didn't legally have to have her son baptised or registered so the truth may never be revealed.

cpdavis35
18-07-11, 15:05
Just googled Tautz and it brings up some old posts on the ancestry boards...looking more on google it seems the surname could be of German origin. Quick look on IGI and there is a couple of David Tautz births around the right time...Although Charles was born definately before his parents married...

Craig.

tiddles
19-07-11, 22:54
Thanks very much Katarzyna and Craig.

I had another idea, to look up Isabella's baptism etc and when I have her parents I will find all the children born to them and I might find a baptism that way of a Charles - although it may not be obvious, because when I found details of Charles and Maria's childrens' christenings, the fathers' name was down as Charles William Franklin Tautz even though he has a younger brother called William Franklin Tautz. They could've "adopted" an illegitamate child of Isabella's, and bring the child up as their own, I imagine that this type of thing went on quite a lot in those days.

regards
tiddles

Katarzyna
20-07-11, 09:37
Just googled Tautz and it brings up some old posts on the ancestry boards...looking more on google it seems the surname could be of German origin. Quick look on IGI and there is a couple of David Tautz births around the right time...Although Charles was born definately before his parents married...

Craig.

This cannot be said for sure. His birth year varies on all censuses. 2 say 1831 but others say 1833/4.

Katarzyna
20-07-11, 10:29
Thanks very much Katarzyna and Craig.

I had another idea, to look up Isabella's baptism etc and when I have her parents I will find all the children born to them and I might find a baptism that way of a Charles - although it may not be obvious, because when I found details of Charles and Maria's childrens' christenings, the fathers' name was down as Charles William Franklin Tautz even though he has a younger brother called William Franklin Tautz. They could've "adopted" an illegitamate child of Isabella's, and bring the child up as their own, I imagine that this type of thing went on quite a lot in those days.

regards
tiddles

I found on Family search that she married Charles at St. Mary'S Church, Lambeth, Surrey, England. Her father is William Franklin(g) as I put in post 6. It might be worth searching the parish records for her birth c1818.

I found POSSIBLE Marriage for father William Frankling:

09 Sep 1803 —Lambeth, Surrey, England
England Marriages, 1538–1973
William Franklin
Sarah Burgess
09 Sep 1803
Lambeth, Surrey, England
I02857-8
England-EASy
1041639

A POSSIBLE Baptism for William:
WILLM FRANKLIN
International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 27 AUG 1783 Saint Saviour, Southwark, Surrey, England

cpdavis35
20-07-11, 13:38
Thanks very much Katarzyna and Craig.

I had another idea, to look up Isabella's baptism etc and when I have her parents I will find all the children born to them and I might find a baptism that way of a Charles - although it may not be obvious, because when I found details of Charles and Maria's childrens' christenings, the fathers' name was down as Charles William Franklin Tautz even though he has a younger brother called William Franklin Tautz. They could've "adopted" an illegitamate child of Isabella's, and bring the child up as their own, I imagine that this type of thing went on quite a lot in those days.

regards
tiddles

This is quite possible. I found the following via a google link of another child born to Charles and Maria. Charles with the word Franklin in his name....

Charles James Thomas Tautz baptised 25th February 1866 Lambeth born 27th January 1866. Parents listed as Charles William Franklin Tautz and Maria Tautz of King Street, Father Charles listed occupation of carman.

Can't find a bap/christening for Isabella. Although Charles Tautz, as Kat has rightly pointed out, his age differs on the census. I did find this though on familysearch... might be relevant but might not be...

England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Charles William Franklin
Birth: 4th May 1831
Residence: 1831 - London, England
Parents: John Franklin, Isabella
Baptism: 27th Nov 1831, Old Church, St. Pancras, Middx.

Craig

Katarzyna
20-07-11, 18:39
I saw that too but unless it is a huge coincidence that would mean Isabella Franklin(g) married a John Franklin. (her father was William Frankling on her 1850 marriage to George Law)
The only thing I can think of is that she had an illegitimate child and had him baptised with John as his father. . . but wouldn't both parents have to be at the baptism?
However I did search them out on the censuses and couldn't find a John and Isabella anywhere.

I would bet tho that this is correct. We would need to search back to find a John Franklin on her father's side of the family. Maybe they were cousins or similar and they were not actually married. I cannot find a marriage for them.

tiddles
21-07-11, 00:48
Hi,

Thanks for all the help, I notice from census records that Isabella was born in Huntingdonshire, perhaps that might bring something to light.

tiddles

Katarzyna
21-07-11, 08:03
I think that must be wrong because all ealier censuses give Surrey. Her 2nd husband was born in Huntingdonshire.

kylejustin
21-07-11, 13:56
wouldnt help too much being born in huntingdon anyway, there are many parish records for them online!

tiddles
23-07-11, 00:29
Hi,
Thanks for that. I have just checked through census images and in 1861 and 1871 Isabella's place of birth is Huntingdonshire, 1851 Southwark, so I am going to check out both places.

tiddles

tiddles
24-07-11, 22:53
Just a quick thank you to each of you for all the help given, it is very much appreciated.

tiddles