Waters

[Phanuel]

Seeking any info on John Waters b c1792 Norwich,son George b c1826 Deptford,Kent,dau Ellen E b c1831 Wapping Mddx,dau Emma M b.c1837MddxSt.George... Census 1851 shows John Widr age 59 Manager to Thames Towing Co... have not traced any other records for this family other than marriage of Ellen E to Joseph Robertson Sept 8 1857 and death of Ellen( age69) May 3 1905 in Glasgow which records father:John Waters (Master Mariner) mother: Elizabeth Waters M.S Pattison both deceased.
Phanuel

[Katarzyna]

Possible Deaths for John Waters
Jul-Aug-Sep 1853
St George in the East
1c 274

or
Apr-May-Jun 1854
St George Hanover Square
1a 135

[Katarzyna]

Cannot find Joseph and Ellen on any census together but not surprising as he was a mariner.
1871

Glasgow Maxwell

644/13

ED: 56; Page: 3; Line: 19;

119 Shields Road

Helen E Robertson37 b England
Eliza C Robertson6 b Glasgow
Joseph Robertson4
Minnie E Robertson2
Ada W Robertson8 MO

1881

Glasgow Govan

ED: 56; Page: 3; Line: 19;

26 Airlie Terrace

Ellen Robertson46
Charlotte Robertson16<<<<<probably Eliza C as in previous census
Joseph Robertson14
Minnie Robertson12
Ada Robertson10
Robert Robertson9

[Katarzyna]

1891

Glasgow Govan

ED: 48; Page: 4; Line: 1;

10 St Andrews Rd

reg no 644/13

Ellen Robertson55
Alexander Robertson30 << Don't know where he was before. he is son of Ellen, a bridge fitter. b Glasgow
Joseph Robertson24
Minnie Robertson22
Ada Robertson20

[Katarzyna]

1901 Glasgow Pollockshields

ED: 35; Page: 5; Line: 18;
Reg No

644/13

181 St Andrews Rd

Ellen E Robertson64
Minnie E Robertson32

These are all from Ancestry. You can pay to view images for more info on Scotlands People.
It says wife for all of censuses except for 1901 which says Head so she may be a widow by then.
Cannot find 1861 census.

[Katarzyna]

the 1841 census for John Waters is only a possibility as his occupation is given as Male servant not mariner. Has Elizabeth and Emma both born in County but he is born out of county which would fit. However George and Ellen are not on this.

1841 St George Hanover Square

HO107; Piece 734; Book: 8;

Folio: 14; Page: 21;

John Waters25
Elizth Waters25
Emma Waters1

[Katarzyna]

Possible death for Elizabeth Waters
St George Hanover Square
Oct-Nov-Dec 1848
Folio 1 page 4

[Elaine ..Spain]

The LMA records on Ancestry show a baptism for a George Michael Waters on 6th December 1824 at St Paul's Deptford - parents John and Rachel Waters.
John's occupation: Master Mariner
Address: George Street

[Elaine ..Spain]

also:
Baptism - Emma Maria Waters - 29 Jul 1836 - St George in the East
parents John and Rachel Waters
Difficult to read the occupation for John - looks like Clerk which is a bit different from Master Mariner!
Address: Sampsons Gardens
Emma born 11 July 1836

[Elaine ..Spain]

Might be worth considering this death for Rachel:

London, England, Deaths and Burials
Rachel Waters
Burial 6 Sep 1849
(age at death 57 - therefore born c1792))
St. John, Wapping, Middx.

Note on the burial register: By Coroner's Warrant

[Elaine ..Spain]

A possibly 1841 entry

Household
Rachel Waters 42 - occupation. Ind. (Independent)
Eliza Waters 12
Ellen Waters 10
Emma Waters 4
Maria Hays 30

All born out of county

Address Coldharbour Lane, Lambeth, Surrey

Class: HO107; Piece 1056; Book: 8; Civil Parish: Lambeth; County: Surrey; Enumeration District: 16; Folio: 15; Page: 24; Line: 4

[Katarzyna]

A possibly 1841 entry

Household
Rachel Waters 42 - occupation. Ind. (Independent)
Eliza Waters 12
Ellen Waters 10
Emma Waters 4
Maria Hays 30

All born out of county

Address Coldharbour Lane, Lambeth, Surrey

Class: HO107; Piece 1056; Book: 8; Civil Parish: Lambeth; County: Surrey; Enumeration District: 16; Folio: 15; Page: 24; Line: 4

I saw those Elaine but the death cert gave Elizabeth as the mother not Rachel. That does seeem to suit better tho and typically the man is missing again!

[Elaine ..Spain]

I saw those Elaine but the death cert gave Elizabeth as the mother not Rachel. That does seeem to suit better tho and typically the man is missing again!

Yes, I realised that Kat. I was wondering if Elizabeth was maybe a second marriage but couldn't find anything to back that up!

[Katarzyna]

From the censuses and Death cert Ellen's birth would appear to be between 1834 and 1837 not 1831. There is a big gap between Georges birth and the other two girls. I can't see any other baps tho'.

[Katarzyna]

also:
Baptism - Emma Maria Waters - 29 Jul 1836 - St George in the East
parents John and Rachel Waters
Difficult to read the occupation for John - looks like Clerk which is a bit different from Master Mariner!
Address: Sampsons Gardens
Emma born 11 July 1836

Sampsons Gardens were where they were living on the 1851 census.
This would then give further evidence that mother was Rachel not Elizabeth.

[Katarzyna]

Possible for Emma Waters on 1871 Census
1871 RG10; Piece: 153; Folio: 50; Page: 1
B 1839 b St Georges East....servant

[Elaine ..Spain]

Sampsons Gardens were where they were living on the 1851 census.
This would then give further evidence that mother was Rachel not Elizabeth.

Oh, well done Kat. I didn't check that!

[Phanuel]

Elaine
Thanks to you (and others!) will try and unravel all the info sent to me... the copy I got from Scotpeoples site Statutory Deaths 644/13 0158 shows Ellen Elizabeth Robertson(widow of Joseph Robertson,Master Mariner) died Glasgow May third 1905 parents John Waters,Master Mariner(deceased) Elizabeth WatersM.S. Pattison(deceased) and what other searches for George(son) and Emma M(dau) Ihave made have produced nothing further.
Regards
Phanuel

[Katarzyna]

It seems odd that we cannot find any of the family on the 1861 censuses either in England or Scotland. They could all be together somewhere horribly transcribed.
I have found a possible death for George:
George Waters age 39 born abt 1827 Jul-Aug-Sep 1866 St George in The East London 1c 528

Having looked for George in St George in the East on 1861 census I think this one belongs to a George Waters with wife Catherine but he was born in Maidstone, Kent not Deptford. :(

Have you considered that George may have emigrated? There are lots of George Waters on the NY and Australian passenger lists.

[Phanuel]

Kat

Thanks for this info am waiting for a reply from a contact in Scotland who has pc probs just now..it must be catching as have had similar bother with mine!!..will keep you advised.
Regards
Phanuel