I have the birth certificate for Joseph Samaine born in 1858 his parents are given as Joseph and Elizabeth with her formerly KELLY. Joseph is a dock labourer and they live in Shoreditch
In the 1861 census Joseph is shown as staying with his grandparents - John and Mary PADGETT at 6 Larama Place in Shoreditch whilst his parents are in Kingsworth? Place in Shoreditch
Joseph SWAIN 24 a hawker his wife Betty (aka Betsy) and daughter Mary aged 11 months.
This is where it becomes complicated because their surname is never ever recorded the same way twice for all their children.
I should mention here that I did find a marriage for Joseph SMAIN and Elizabeth Kelly in the LMA records for 1858 - Joseph's occupation is given as a labourer
Joseph and Elizabeth have a large family, adding Mary Ann in 1860, James Thomas in 1861, twins Elizabeth and Caroline in 1863 and Charles in 1865 - as well as many more. But I do have the birth certificate for Charles born in 1865 and his mother is given as formerly Elizabeth Pagett
James Thomas was born to Joseph and Elizabeth Semaine in Nov 1861. They lived at 3 Mail Coach Yard - where they stayed for a good few years and Joseph's occupation was a hawker.
The Kelly/Padgett combination is very confusing. I worked along the lines that maybe Joseph married Elizabeth Kelly, she gave birth to Joseph Jnr died and he remarried Elizabeth Padgett. However I can find no death or burial for Elizabeth Samaine/and or all the various spellings, before the 1861 census when he is staying with his Padgett grandparents.
I was hoping that a fresh pair of eyes/brain might see another angle I hadn't previously thought of.
In the 1861 census Joseph is shown as staying with his grandparents - John and Mary PADGETT at 6 Larama Place in Shoreditch whilst his parents are in Kingsworth? Place in Shoreditch
Joseph SWAIN 24 a hawker his wife Betty (aka Betsy) and daughter Mary aged 11 months.
This is where it becomes complicated because their surname is never ever recorded the same way twice for all their children.
I should mention here that I did find a marriage for Joseph SMAIN and Elizabeth Kelly in the LMA records for 1858 - Joseph's occupation is given as a labourer
Joseph and Elizabeth have a large family, adding Mary Ann in 1860, James Thomas in 1861, twins Elizabeth and Caroline in 1863 and Charles in 1865 - as well as many more. But I do have the birth certificate for Charles born in 1865 and his mother is given as formerly Elizabeth Pagett
James Thomas was born to Joseph and Elizabeth Semaine in Nov 1861. They lived at 3 Mail Coach Yard - where they stayed for a good few years and Joseph's occupation was a hawker.
The Kelly/Padgett combination is very confusing. I worked along the lines that maybe Joseph married Elizabeth Kelly, she gave birth to Joseph Jnr died and he remarried Elizabeth Padgett. However I can find no death or burial for Elizabeth Samaine/and or all the various spellings, before the 1861 census when he is staying with his Padgett grandparents.
I was hoping that a fresh pair of eyes/brain might see another angle I hadn't previously thought of.
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