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Louisa Vaillant / Valient Penman nee Coster. Can you help me put the pieces together?

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  • Louisa Vaillant / Valient Penman nee Coster. Can you help me put the pieces together?

    I need some help with this lady as I am finding her a bit tricky but would love to put all the pieces together.

    I have found her Baptism on LMA: Louisa Vaillant Coster 14/11/1828. Born 25/9/1826. Parents John & Elizabeth Coster living in City Terrace and Baptised in St Giles without Cripplegate, City of London. They Baptised another daughter, Harriet at the same time. She was born 4/10/1828.

    In the 1841 census she appears with her family in Middlesex, St Leonard, Hoxton Old Town as follows:
    John Coster 40 School M N
    Elizabeth 35 Y
    John 15 Y
    Louisa 14 N
    Harriet 12 Y
    Mary 7 Y
    Ann 5 Y
    Emma 3 Y
    Oliver 4 Mths Y

    I have the Baptisms of all the children from LMA.

    In 1851 she appears in Middlesex, Shoreditch, Hoxton Old Town as follows:
    John Coster 50 Music String Maker B West Dean, Wilts
    Helen 7 Scholar B Shoreditch
    Louisa Penman 24 Mar Dressmaker B United States
    Joseph Penman 3 Grandson B Hoxton, Middx
    Eliza Penman 1 Grand dau B Hoxton, Middx

    In 1861 she appears in Middlesex, Hackney St John, West Hackney with her Brother in law as follows:
    Henry Bailey 27 Widower (he married Mary)
    Louisa V Penman 37 Sister in Law, Widow, Gentlewoman, B Brooklyn, New York
    Louisa E (transcribed as C) Penman 12 Niece B Shoreditch
    Henry Bailey 7 Son

    I have not found her in any subsequent census.

    Again on LMA I found her marriage to Joseph Charles Penman in 1847.

    In 1841 Joseph Penman appears in Middlesex, St Mary Whitechapel with his family as follows:
    Joseph Penman 38 Cabinet Maker Y
    Catherine 38 Y
    Charlotte 10 Y
    Joseph 14 Y
    Sarah 9 Y
    Eliza 7 Y
    Catherine 5 Y
    Jane 2 Y

    I have been unable to find Joseph or any of his family in any other UK census.

    There is an Ancestry Tree which shows Louisa, and her Brother John, both with deaths in Auckland New Zealand. Her marriage is not recorded on the tree, but then neither are many of her siblings marriages. This Tree has her death as 24/12/1869 and John’s death as 13/8/1888. I have not been able to find these deaths.

    This Tree also has her birth as 25/9/1826 in Brooklyn, Kings, New York USA.

    That’s the background – this is where I need help.

    Can anyone find her birth in New York?

    Can anyone find her on a passenger list coming into the UK between 1826 (her birth) and 1828 (her Baptism in London)?

    Any sign of her parents (John Coster & Elizabeth) with her on a passenger list?

    Can anyone find her travelling to New Zealand after 1861 when she was last sighted on the census and before 1869 when she supposedly died?

    Can you find a death for her in New Zealand?

    I have been unable to find a marriage or death for her daughter Louisa Elizabeth Penman, or her Son Joseph John Penman. Both were Baptised on 2/7/1854 but Louisa was born circa 1849/50 and Joseph was born circa 1847/8. Did they go to New Zealand with her?

    I have not found a suitable death for her Husband Joseph Charles Penman and have never found them together in a census. Did he go to New Zealand on his own? Did his family (shown above in the 1841 census go to New Zealand or can you find them elsewhere?

    Thank you for wading through this. I have attempted to make it easier to follow by using different colours and bold. Any help will be really appreciated as I only have limited access to FMP once a week and just basic Ancestry. It seems I need Worldwide access to view passenger lists etc.

    Pat



  • #2
    Here are some resources I would consider (have you had a look in the FTF Reference Library, in case there are any useful ideas there?):
    NZ BMD
    Birth, Death and Marriage - Historical Records



    NZ Newspapers


    This looks as if it might be yours:
    "On April 6, <snip>Louisa Elizabeth, only daughter of the late Joseph PENMAN, Esq., of Islington, London" appears to have got married in 1868 to William H COBLEY: Daily Southern Cross, Volume XXIV, Issue 3347, 8 April 1868, Page 2
    The Expression "Home papers please copy" means that you may be able to find similar announcements in UK papers.
    And that also gives a not-after date for Joseph senior.

    Have to go and do some other stuff, but hope that's useful.

    Christine
    Last edited by Christine in Herts; 30-05-11, 18:15.
    Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

    Comment


    • #3
      If the above story is part of your research, then there's a detailed Breach of Promise caes here: Daily Southern Cross, Volume XXIV, Issue 3563, 18 December 1868, Page 5
      It has references to "Mrs COBLEY" / "Miss PENMAN" - and references to her MiL (which may or may not have any foundation).

      Christine
      Last edited by Christine in Herts; 30-05-11, 18:22.
      Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

      Comment


      • #4
        Thank you so much Christine. I will spend some time later tonight and probably all day tomorrow looking at this.

        I did do some death searches in the NZ historical records without success.

        Pat

        Comment


        • #5
          There's another possible one here: Daily Southern Cross, Volume XXX, Issue 5282, 29 July 1874, Page 2
          I haven't done the arithmetic to tell if it's plausible for you.

          There are several references to a Joseph PENMAN - but no guarantee that he's one of yours, of course!

          And there seems to have been a Mr PENMAN who was on board the Tararua when it went down in April 1881 on the way to Australia.

          Christine
          Last edited by Christine in Herts; 30-05-11, 18:40.
          Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

          Comment


          • #6
            It looks as though Louisa got married the same year as her daughter:

            1868/4511 / Louisa Vallient Penman / Richard Daggett

            Can't see a death for her in NZ, though.

            Comment


            • #7
              It took me ages to read through the breach of promise report. I found another condensed version together with the outcome on the NZ newspaper site. The jilted woman was awarded $1500 and it would appear the groom was wealthy and a partner in business of Louisa Elizabeth's new husband. The only other snippet of interest was that Louisa's Mother in Law enjoyed a drink! The marriage is most certainly that of Louisa Valient's daughter.

              The second marriage of Louisa Valient Penman is of great help as I can now look for a death with the surname Daggett.

              As suggested, I tried last night to look at the Gale newspaper collection in case any mention of the family members were made, but the libary site was so slow it would not load. I'll have another try later today.

              Again, thanks to both Christine and Mary for your help.

              Comment


              • #8
                Sorry if you had a long read for nothing. I have to say I was none too certain that it would be useful, but, without reading it myself, I couldn't be sure, of course.

                Christine
                Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

                Comment


                • #9
                  Christine, it was still interesting and I found out that Louisa Elizabeth's husband was probably quite wealthy.

                  Yesterday I spent some time at the library where I have access to the full version of Ancestry. I trawled through the NZ electoral rolls for all the names in this section of my tree. I haven't collated it all yet.

                  I have still been unable to find a death for Louisa Valiant - even using her new married name. In fact, I couldn't find her new husband Richard Daggett in the Electoral Rolls either.

                  I then spent a few hours searching the Gale newspaper collection and found some marriages and death announcements.

                  It certainly seems that Louisa Valiant Penman did go to NZ with her children. Her Brother John Coster also went. I still haven't found them on passenger lists though as many of those only list possibles as Mr & Mrs Coster. One thing I have discovered is that FamilySearch has NZ passenger lists - free.

                  Thanks again for your interest and help.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    One thing I have discovered is that FamilySearch has NZ passenger lists - free.
                    I hadn't spotted that. It could be very useful!

                    This site may be of use to you: http://www.yesteryears.co.nz/shipping/
                    or these: http://mariners.records.nsw.gov.au/

                    and this


                    Christine
                    Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

                    Comment

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