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  • Confused............ Any help welcomed..... :)

    .... little confusion here, if anyone could help clear it up for me id be so grateful... my minds in a muddle over it.

    Ok, so im researching The Taylor side of the family tree...

    Starting from 'Thomas Taylor'. B 1886. Married Lilian Wilkinson...
    Thomas's father was a John Taylor, B abt 1862 in ''Walton, Lancashire, England''.
    I believe he married a Rebecca Snailham and had children.

    Now heres where im confused.... :
    John Taylors father i believe to be Henry Taylor,B.abt 1818 in Longton.
    He was living first in Walton le dale according to 1861 census... with 'Ann'.

    Henry Taylor
    43
    birth abt 1818
    Head
    Spouse's Name is, Ann Taylor
    born, Longton, Lancashire, England
    Civil parish: Walton Le Dale
    St Saviour,Lancashire, England.

    Other household members are,
    Henry Taylor 43
    Ann Taylor 44
    Hannah Taylor 20
    Thos Taylor 18
    Henry Taylor 16
    George Taylor 13
    Dinah Taylor 10
    Mary Taylor 8
    Elizabeth Taylor 4
    Lawrence Taylor 10 Months
    John Taylor 10 Months
    John Thos Taylor 12


    Then i believe he moved with Ann and children to Wheelton going off the 1881 census. Only theres only one child listed with them....

    Henry Taylor
    Age:63
    Birth Year: abt 1818
    Head of family
    Spouse, Ann Taylor
    Born, Longton, Lancashire, England
    Wheelton, Lancashire, England.
    Address, Wheelton House. District,Chorley/Brindle.

    Occupation, Farmer Of 25 Acres Employing 1 Laborour

    Other people in the household ,

    Henry Taylor 63
    Ann Taylor 63
    John Taylor 20
    (( There was also a George Taylor listed aged 23 , But as a farm hand/servant not son,Born longton, 1858))

    So firstly where have all the children gone?? I searched a couple of the childrens names, Started with Hannah from the 1861 census, i found two baptism records for her, the DOB is right and there was no other hannah registered in lancashire in the right area with the right named father. There were two entries which was abit strange, and the mothers name is different... have posted below:

    Hannah Taylor.
    Baptised 14 Jan,1842 St Michael, Hoole,Lancashire,England.
    Fathers Occupation,Farmer.
    Parents, Henry & Nanny
    Abode,Much Hoole.
    (Source: LDS Film 1471151)

    hannah Taylor.
    Baptised, 27 Mar 1842 St Andrew,Longton,Lancashire,England.
    Fathers Occupation, Farmer.
    Parents, Henry Taylor & Nanny
    Abode, Much Hoole
    (Source: LDS Film 1278777)

    So now im thinking whos Nanny??? So i search her...

    I find marriage record for her and a Henry...

    Marriage: 4 Mar 1839 St Michael, Hoole, Lancashire, England
    Henry Taylor - under age Farmer Bachelor of Longton
    Nanny Martindale - of full age Spinster of Much Hoole
    Groom's Father: John Taylor, Yeoman
    Bride's Father: Thomas Martindale, Farmer
    Witness: Henry Sutton; John Forshaw


    Then i search the census records.

    1871:

    Name, Henry Taylor
    Age: 52
    Birth Year, abt 1819
    Relation:Head
    Spouse, Nanny Taylor
    Born: Longton, Lancashire, England
    Wheelton, Heapey,Lancashire,England.
    Registration district, Chorley/ Brindle.

    Other Household Members,

    Henry Taylor 52
    Nanny Taylor 52
    George Taylor 21
    Mary Taylor 17
    Elizabeth Taylor 15
    John Taylor 1

    1851:


    Henry Taylor
    Age:32
    Birth Year: abt 1819
    Spouse:Nancy Taylor
    Born: Longton, Lancashire, England
    Heapey,Lancashire,England.

    Other Household Members:

    Henry Taylor 32
    Nanny Taylor 32

    John Taylor 13
    Anna Taylor 10
    Thomas Taylor 8
    Henry Taylor 4
    George Taylor 1

    So wheres Hannah??? It would make total sense if Ann was listed as her mother... but Nanny is?? Totally confused! Are Henry and Nanny a totally different family to Henry and Ann?? Or could there be something really odd and strange about the whole thing.... Also you'll notice henrys age fits on all the census records, with both ann and nanny.

    If anyone thinks they can help shine a light on this for me id be really grateful. Apologies for the long thread...wanted to put all the info there in the order ive gone through it.

    Taylor.
    Last edited by Taylorfam; 26-05-11, 17:32.

  • #2
    Nan is /was a fairly common pet form of Ann so Nanny would equate to Annie. I'd say this is the same lady who was probably Nan/Nanny to her family but "officialdom" dubbed her Ann on a couple of censuses.

    You ask "So where's Hannah" in 1851. Surely she's there but listed as Anna.
    Last edited by JudithM; 26-05-11, 12:54.
    Judith passed away in October 2018

    Comment


    • #3
      All the children of this family are on Lancsbmd, registered with mmn of Martindale, except for Hannah and Henry, who either weren't registered, or haven't been transcribed yet for some reason.

      As for the double baptism, Nanny was from Much Hoole and may have baptised the child there as well as in her own parish. Not unknown to baptise twice.

      OC

      Comment


      • #4
        Thankyou for your replys.
        Judith, that makes sense i guess...would explain alot if ann and nanny are the same person. Wasnt aware of the pet name with Ann.
        Makes sense with Hannah and anna too.... thankyou for pointing these two things out

        Olde Crone Holden ,Wasnt aware double baptisms were common in some cases...

        Im going to draw up a timeline, try and get all the above info into some sorta order... ready for adding to tree.

        Thankyou for helping to clear up that confusion...would have been staring at it for days had i not posted on here!!

        Comment


        • #5
          Wasnt aware double baptisms were common in some cases.
          Double baptisms are seriously frowned upon by the established church, as being a heresy. One of the first questions in the old baptism service was "Hath this child already been baptised or no?" If the answer were yes, then the service went no further... but who would know, if it had taken place in another parish? Being baptised in a parish conferred rights, so there was a definite incentive to have your children baptised wherever you were living, even if they had been baptised already.

          Christine
          Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

          Comment


          • #6
            I did wonder if the first baptism was "in extremis", the child being born away from home, then the second baptism taking place in their usual parish, due to a mix-up or misunderstanding. I notice the second baptism was performed at a chapel of ease, perhaps this was a receiving into the church rather than a baptism, but you will need to look at the original records to sort this out.

            OC

            Yes indeed, baptising more than once was a heresy but I think many people did it for all sorts of reasons, rights of settlement being one.

            Comment


            • #7
              Ive looked up the other children, and Hannah is the only one that was 'baptised' twice... i wasn't aware of all the different things you've mentioned. Its all very different nowadays... interesting though how things used to be. I shall remember all your comments incase the same thing crops up in my tree again.

              In regards to my tree, now im trying to find the exact address of the family in 1961. I wish the census takers handwriting back then was neater, its took me two days to work out the address says 'near the station' !! Il get my head around all this census malarki eventually!

              Going off some of the other childrens baptisms and census, Henry was at some point a 'beer seller'... 'innkeeper'. Jeez this family moved around lot, seems every ten years they fancied a change of either address or occupation!! Sounds a little like the Taylors of today actually.......!!

              Now to find which 'inn' he would have worked at... i actually live in Bamber Bridge, Parish of St Saviours is only up the road. Its nice to be able to connect family from the distant past back to the area i grew up and live in



              Taylor.

              Comment


              • #8
                Beerseller just meant they sold beer, lol. My GGF made beer in his backyard and sold it from the front room of his house.

                An Innkeeper would have lived on the premises. Even today, a licensee is supposed to live in the pub.

                I think Hannah must have been born ill and not expected to survive, so was baptised privately. When she didn't die, and returned home, she was baptised in the family church. Perhaps the mother had "forgotten" or wasn't aware that Hannah had been baptised already, or was confused about what the baptism meant.

                OC

                Comment


                • #9
                  Im pretty sure on one of the census records for him it states farmer and innkeeper... Oh no wait... sorry, that was Henrys father John. Hnery was just 'beer seller'. Ive that much paperwork forming in heaps here its easy to be mistaken lol! States on the census he was an Innkeeper and farmer... at the Bull Inn longton. Another place im googling that seems its now changed its name,making it difficult... :l
                  Il get there eventually. Trying to gather information on the people aswell,rather than just having alot of names and dates. Is nice to add meat to the bones so to speak, i think

                  Hannah... that makes sense that they would do it twice for that reason. Im sure there would have been a good reason as to why it was done more than once. Although we'll never be able to say for sure...

                  Taylor.

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