Great Aunt married same husband twice

[Penna_tmn]

My great aunt married in 1905 in the Register Office at Eton. But after her death in 1958 my mother found a document suggesting that she and her husband were not married at all.

I checked the records online because I knew her to be a very "strictly correct lady" in her attitudes and for someone born in 1866 as she was it would not be proper to live together while unmarried.

I found two records,one wedding in 1905 as mentioned earlier and another in 1920,also in a Register Office..

Both certificates are for the same couple. Neither party were married to anyone else and they were not related.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Are you absolutely sure neither was married before?

Was the groom in the services?

OC

[Penna_tmn]

I searched records of marriages over and over again and there was no record of marriage for either of them before 1905. They married in Eton Reg Dst .He was a gardener and she was a cook. I haven't found either of them in the 1901 census but in 1905 they both lived in the same road in Stoke Poges and I'm guessing that they both worked for the same family. I'm trying to find them by the address .

In the second certificate she doesn't give an occupation. but still described herself as spinster and he still describes himself as batchelor. The only detail i know was incorrect is that she took ten years off her age at the first wedding. Surely that wouldn't invalidate the marriage.

Names were Edward James Robinson and Elizabeth Fletcher.

[Olde Crone Holden]

AH!

No, it wouldn't invalidate the marriage but I wonder if they may have thought it would? I wonder if they married again in 1920 in order to claim an old age pension.

OC

[Olde Crone Holden]

What was the document your mother found which suggested they weren't married?

I just had a thought. A friend of mine married and divorced her first husband. Twenty years later they got back together and remarried! Any possibility that happened here?

OC

[Penna_tmn]

Re the document - I don't know. I only heard about it through my sister who was still living at home when the aunt died in 1958. She told me that our mother had found something in the late husbands docs to show that he wasn't married. It occurred to me that the date of the document might have been before the 1920 marriage so I sent for the 1920 cert. Once I was sure that I had the right people I sent for the earlier one too.

Problem is that I can't find either them or the road they lived in in the 1901 census (or even in Goggle Maps). On the cert it says Nebridge Rd but I can't find that OR Newbridge Rd,in Stoke Poges. So I've lost them betweeen 1905 and 1958. Had I found them in 1901 I could find the family they worked for and look for that in 1911.

[Penna_tmn]

There isn't any way I can check divorce records online and they said they were spinster and bachelor in 1920.

[Elaine ..Spain]

Do you know when and where they were born to see if we can find them in the 1901/1911 census.

[Penna_tmn]

Yes I know their birthdates She was born in 1866 in Stepney and I'm sure of this. He was born in 1874 in Fulmer Bucks. He was a gardener from a very early age. Edward might have married before and lied about his status at the first wedding,just as she lied about her age. She was a seamstress when she still lived at home with her parents in 1881 but her father died young and the household split up. I think that is when she went into service. She may be in the census 1901 under a diifferent name of course. I know that some families called all their cooks by the same name.

I had pinned my hopes on finding the name of their employes at the time of the 1905 marriage and then being able to find them in 1911. But no luck and,of course they may have joined many others and avoided the 1911 census. I've no idea if she was a suffragette.

[Penna_tmn]

I wondered that too. They certainly didn't have much money and they would have needed the pension. When he died he was described as a jobbing gardener

[Olde Crone Holden]

I wonder if he lied about his age and joined up in WW1, saying he was unmarried?

Maybe it was simply the fact that they THOUGHT lying about her age would invalidate the marriage and were too embarrassed to ask anyone.

OC

[Elaine ..Spain]

They are rather elusive in the census!
I cannot see a Nebridge Road in or around Stoke Poges. Is it written clearly - could it possibly be Uxbridge Road?

[Penna_tmn]

Well there were people about his real age in the WW1 and there ARE several Edward J Robinsons. But it is difficult to be certain if they are the correct man. I did wonder if he had been away in the war and if she just carried on as Mrs somebody else as cook in a family. Cooks were usually given thr title Mrs as a courtesy I belive.

[Penna_tmn]

It definitely begins with an Ne and ends in dge.

[Night Owl]

Re the 1901 - were Edward's parents James and Emma? If so this might be him still living with them. RG13, Piece 1344, Folio 150, Page 96

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7814&iid=BKMRG13_1344_1346-0306&fn=A+E&ln=Robinson&st=r&ssrc=&pid=7811758

Interestingly all the children are listed with their first names except A E Robinson son aged 26 b Fulmer gardener domestic.

I know the initials are wrong but he's the right age and wonder whether it was recorded incorrectly

[Penna_tmn]

Thanks!. Yes that is his family. and it is only four years before the first marriage. What a pity they didn't hold a census every year!

[Night Owl]

There is this Elizabeth Fletcher in 1901 in Folkestone. RG13 Piece 848, Folio 27, Page 45

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7814&iid=KENRG13_847_849-0367&fn=Elizabeth&ln=Fletcher&st=r&ssrc=&pid=6028074

She is a cook domestic born Stepney but the age is given as 29 (you said that she had given the wrong age on the 1st marriage). Trouble is its not an uncommon name so you would need to see if you can eliminate this one in other censuses.

None of this helps with the 2 marriage question I'm afraid

[Penna_tmn]

Thank you VERY much. That is definitely her. I suppose she started lying about her age to get jobs . My Elizabeth was a cook and her birthplace WAS Stepney. I think it is really certain. As you say it does not explain the two marriages but the two census records have filled in some gaps.

[susan h]

This would appear to be the couple in 1911. Living Chobham Woking Surrey. Elizabeth born Stepney 1867, Edward James, Fulmer Bucks 1875.

RG14PN3026 RG78PN106 RD32 SD3 ED12 SN1

[Macbev]

Did she represent herself as being older on the first marriage cert? Might she have been marrying underage and without consent of her guardians/parents?

My grandmother was underage when she married, and an orphan. I guess to get around the 'with consent' issues, she pretended to be 'of age'....but my mother told me my grandmother found out later she was even younger than she had thought and tore up her marriage cert as she was worried her husband would get into trouble (wonder if she realised that would not remove the official records?).

If your great aunt was concerned about those sorts of issues, she may have married again to make sure it was all legal.