Birth Certificate problem - Any Suggestions ?

[chrisj1961]

Hi all. Whilst doing my one-name study, I have come across a Wheelhouse birth entry from Scotland (On Scotland's People). Date of birth is November 1908, names of the parents Albert and Florence are entered and their marriage date, which is normal in Scotland but over the names of Albert's brother William and his wife Bertha and their marriage date. William and Bertha's names and marriage date have been crossed out. The strangest thing is however is that Bertha actually died in 1906 of uterine cancer (I have the death entry from Scotland's People).

Can anybody suggest any possible idea as to what could have happened here or any way I could find out what had happened ? I am totally confused on this one.

Thanks for any possible help anybody could give me

[Olde Crone Holden]

Chris

I'm not entirely sure I understand what you mean, but does the certificate have "RCE" in the margin anywhere?

Otherwise I cannot see what Albert's brother's details have to do with the birth of a child to Albert!

The only real way to find out is to contact the GROS, of course.

OC

[JudithM]

Reading this to mean that William and Bertha' details were entered first, then crossed out and Albert and Florence's details substituted -
A few possibilities -
1. The registrar knew the families but not well. When William turned up to register the birth he mistook him for Albert and started to fill in wrong details before being corrected.
2 Perhaps uncle William went along to register the birth for his brother, and when asked for names and marriage date got confused and gave his own details
3 Grandma registered the birth and muddled her two sons up

[Olde Crone Holden]

Judith

(2) strikes a chord - one of my deeply thick relatives went to register the birth of her baby and when asked for "father's name" gave her own father's name instead of the father of the baby! Good job I knew that her own father had been dead a good few years, lol.

OC

[chrisj1961]

Thanks for your replies, No OC, there is no mention anywhere of RCE. This child was Albert and Florence's but initially William and Bertha's names, Bertha's maiden name and William and Bertha's marriage date was entered. These were then crossed out and Albert and Florence's details were put in. Florence registered the birth herself. Very possibly Judith the registrar possibly recognised Florence, as you say but thought it was Bertha (even though Bertha had been dead for 2 years !!).

It's just a really strange thing which I have never encountered before in 5 years of family history work.

[Harrys mum]

I'd stick with excuse #2. On my great grandfather's birth cert his father is actually his uncle (his mother's brother). Stupid brother registered the birth as the birth happened when mum was visiting her family and proper dad is back home. It's all back to normal by the baptism six weeks later.

I just assumed it was an Essex thing to get it wrong......I come from a long line of stupids from Essex.......lol

[chrisj1961]

Thanks for your reply Harry's Mum. I tend to think it was more probably #1, the mother (Florence) registered the birth herself (as she did all of the 10 children her and Albert had). The other woman mentioned, Bertha, had died in 1906, this birth was registered 2 years later, in fact Bertha's husband William was back in England at that point with his 2 children.

Sooo, I have contacted the GROS, as OC suggested. Let's see what they come up with - if anything. I've just never seen anything like it before and am really scratching my head !!

[margaretmarch]

Thanks for your reply Harry's Mum. I tend to think it was more probably #1, the mother (Florence) registered the birth herself (as she did all of the 10 children her and Albert had). The other woman mentioned, Bertha, had died in 1906, this birth was registered 2 years later, in fact Bertha's husband William was back in England at that point with his 2 children.

Sooo, I have contacted the GROS, as OC suggested. Let's see what they come up with - if anything. I've just never seen anything like it before and am really scratching my head !!

For any corrections on a register there should be a corresponding entry in the 'error' book which explains why the change was made so even though you can't see the RCE it may be there anyway. Lets hope GROS can find it!
Margaret

[chrisj1961]

well, the reply from GROS is as this

Thank you for your e-mail.

When the information was given to register the birth of Florence J
Wheelhouse by the mother she gave the wrong information which was then
corrected which is indicated by the registrars initials at the side of
the entry each error is always shown in this way. I can't explain as to
why she may have given the incorrect information that I am afraid is
something we will never explain. As this certificate is over 100 years
it is sent out as it appears in the register.

I trust this helps clear up the mystery for you.

Errr, nope, am at a loss as to now why Florence stated her name was Bertha who had been dead for 2 years !! Hey ho, suppose this is one mystery that cannot be solved

[Olde Crone Holden]

Well yes, a mystery for ever. by the sounds of it.

I'm usually quite good at scenarios, but I cannot come up with one for this!

("Does the father of the child have any Uncles and if so, when and where was he married?" Nope, can't see it myself....)

OC

[Harrys mum]

Sounds very odd to me....................

At least mine is fairly easily explained by......

Stupid goes to reg office.......I need to register a birth.
Reg says.....Mother's name and MN??
Stupid says.......Eliza Ketley nee Tunbridge.
Reg says...........Your name??
Stupid says...........Joseph.

Stupid didn't think to add he was Eliza's brother...........lol