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Grenadier Guards.. army records

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  • Grenadier Guards.. army records

    My gt grandad was a GG I havent sent off for his records before because I never knew his service number. (and even though I had sent detailed information to the Guards they were adamant that they couldnt help me)

    my question is, If I sent off for them what sort of info would I get? would they be the same as his pension records? I know when and where he signed up, and also know that he was pensioned out in 1870, and why he was pensioned out, he died in 1872.

    so would his GG records be any different to the ones I already have? he did enlist to the 59th Foot and later transferred to the guards where he became Corperal.

    thanks
    Last edited by Darksecretz; 10-09-10, 18:32.
    Julie
    They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

    .......I find dead people

  • #2
    Julie

    I am not sure if this will help but I had a Great Uncle in the Scots Guards and thought his records would be with the Guards, but apparently his records were actually at Kew. A researcher found them for me when I was unable to find them at Kew and since then they have appeared on FMP. His attestation papers were there and included all his army record from 1842 through to his pensioning off after the Battle of Inkerman in the Crimea War and included a letter about a replacement wooden leg in 1902 so quite informative but I have nothing from the Guards and I was told by the researcher that the Guards had no information.

    Janet

    Comment


    • #3
      hmm thats interesting Janet, I was told that the Guards kept and have archives of all sorts of stuff... maybe I ought to try again with them (now that I know his service number) though I am rather loathe to do so after the manner in which I was treated before.
      Julie
      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

      .......I find dead people

      Comment


      • #4
        In view of what I was told I have not made any further enquiries through the Guards, but I will be very interested if you do make enquiries and get some help so do keep us informed.

        Janet

        Comment


        • #5
          I contacted The Guards regarding my great-grandfather, who fought with the Coldstream Guards in the Second World War. I had read also that the guards kept their own separate archives. I found them to be quite helpful, they sent me the records and the service was pretty quick. I'm not sure what the date range is of the records that they hold, though. Perhaps they don't have the earlier service records in their collection, hence the negative response? However, I would have thought they'd have given some advice regarding where/what to try next...

          moulie
          Luke Mouland
          Genealogist, Historian & Writer
          Kith & Kin Research
          Website: www.kithandkinresearch.co.uk
          Blog: www.kithandkinresearch.posterous.com




          Comment


          • #6
            Janet,

            I will try again and see what happens, and of course will let you know the outcome.

            Moulie,

            yes this is what I had heard, that they have their own archives/achivist.. I know they have a museum as well.

            I will have to get my thinking cap on now, as to how to word the letter.. (this is one area I'm not very good at)
            Julie
            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

            .......I find dead people

            Comment


            • #7
              hmm with regards to the guards having no information: from the 'Guards Museum' http://www.theguardsmuseum.com/Family-Research

              Increasing numbers of people are undertaking major research to find out more about their relations who have served in The Guards regiments. Many of these people ring the museum to ask us to search the archives for details about these former soldiers. Unfortunately, we do not hold any service records on individuals as these are still maintained by the Regimental Headquarters (RHQ) of each regiment. Regimental photographs are also held by the RHQs.
              Please do not write to us or call as we cannot assist you.

              Those seeking information should write to the relevant RHQ directly. All five RHQs are based in Wellington Barracks the address of which is as follows:

              Wellington Barracks
              Birdcage Walk
              London SW1E 6HQ
              just goes to show what conflicting advice there is then .. I contacted the Archivist @ Wellington Barracks, and was told they couldnt help. BUT I will write again.
              Julie
              They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

              .......I find dead people

              Comment


              • #8
                Yes, it was the Wellington Barracks that I would have written to/visited as i do not live far from there. It was only by accident I discovered they were at Kew, when I queried a name on a website which looked like my ancestor, but the name was slightly incorrect. The website contained all those injured at the Crimea and the contact for this site happened to be a researcher at Kew. We exchanged a few e mails and he assured me that the records would be at Kew and not with the Guards. I had already searched at Kew without any luck and he just said that sometimes they get hidden at Kew and it can be difficult to find so I let him do the research for me. He found them and corrected his own records for the correct name. Now a year later they are on FMP! One of the problems is that the Wellington Barracks above is the Museum so I do not understand.

                The Guards Museum, Wellington Barracks, Birdcage Walk, London SW1E 6HQ
                Tel: 020 7414 3271/3428

                Maybe they used to have the records and no longer have them?

                Janet
                Last edited by Janet; 10-09-10, 16:49.

                Comment


                • #9
                  not sure Janet,

                  I am lead to believe that the Museum and the Barracks are two seperate entities, though at the same address. ( I have a friend that has a son in the G Guards at the moment) so will query this with her.
                  Julie
                  They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                  .......I find dead people

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Julie

                    I found some info at Kew about my G Uncle who was in the GG. He was there on 1901 census so that helped. It was more like a role call of all the regiment and where they were based. He then rejoined and fought in WW1 so have he army records for that and mention of him being in GG.

                    Will PM you
                    Lin

                    Searching Lowe, Everitt, Hurt and Dunns in Nottingham

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      thanks Lin, PM recieved
                      Julie
                      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                      .......I find dead people

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Julie,

                        It was certainly Wellington Barracks (Birdcage Walk) that helped me with my successful query. Do give them a nudge and let us know what the outcome is. Fingers crossed.

                        moulie
                        Luke Mouland
                        Genealogist, Historian & Writer
                        Kith & Kin Research
                        Website: www.kithandkinresearch.co.uk
                        Blog: www.kithandkinresearch.posterous.com




                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I've just dug out the records I received last year, which has a cover letter attached, headed 'Regimental Headquarters, Coldstream Guards, Wellington Barracks, Birdcage Walk, London SW1E 6HQ'.

                          So I assume if you change 'Coldstream Guards' for 'Grenadier Guards', it would be okay. However, I must reiterate that the records I received were from the Second World War era, were ordered last year and that I'm unsure about the range of records that they may hold - they may not have earlier ones in their collection. Worth a shot, though.
                          Luke Mouland
                          Genealogist, Historian & Writer
                          Kith & Kin Research
                          Website: www.kithandkinresearch.co.uk
                          Blog: www.kithandkinresearch.posterous.com




                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Moulie

                            I wonder if it is just the later records that are there? It does make sense for the Second W War records to be at the Regimental Headquarters re the Guards, because ordinary service records post 1922 to include Second W War, are still with the MOD and not in the public domain, and you have to pay to access. The earlier records pre 1922 are in the public domain, accessible to all, so I am wondering if this is the difference? Did you have to pay to access?

                            Julie

                            Have you tried FMP to see if the records are on there? Not all the records are yet on FMP but they are gradually being put on there so worth a check.

                            Janet
                            Last edited by Janet; 11-09-10, 11:52.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Janet,

                              Indeed, I also think this is probably the reason and yes, I did have to pay for copies of the records (a bit too much, in my opinion!).

                              moulie
                              Luke Mouland
                              Genealogist, Historian & Writer
                              Kith & Kin Research
                              Website: www.kithandkinresearch.co.uk
                              Blog: www.kithandkinresearch.posterous.com




                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Janet,

                                I managed to get his pension records from FMP (WO97 1855-1872) but I have no credits now and only have an Ancestry sub.
                                Julie
                                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                .......I find dead people

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Moulie,

                                  yes I will keep you informed of the outcome, am I right in thinking that it costs about £25 to get the records, ?
                                  Julie
                                  They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                  .......I find dead people

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Julie, I believe it actually cost me £35 for the Second World War service papers...

                                    moulie
                                    Luke Mouland
                                    Genealogist, Historian & Writer
                                    Kith & Kin Research
                                    Website: www.kithandkinresearch.co.uk
                                    Blog: www.kithandkinresearch.posterous.com




                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      The Regimental HQ certainly have 19th century records but exactly what, I don't know. Many, though, are also held at Kew. I successfully argued with them some time ago that access to pre WW1 records should be free as they are at Kew, so it's worth a try.
                                      The National Archives, Kew – Research Service Offered
                                      Contact me via PM on Family Tree Forum or via my personal website - www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk

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