Solomon Smith Senior - help with date of death

[stevie2006]

Can anyone help to try to find a date of death for my great great grandfather.

His name was Solomon Smith born 8/3/1866 in Weedon. He married a Mary Ann Stokes in Stepney on 25/12/1892 and he was alive on the 1911 census. In 1911 he was living at 19 St Thomas Road, Mile End London.

When he son, also Solomon, got married on 25/2/1918 he was listed as living and his occupation was a Lighterman.

Can anyone help me to trace his death

Thanks

Steven

[skingers2]

Hi
Found his marriage to Mary Ann Stokes on Ancestry - it says estimated birth year was 1870.... could this be your man? He was 22 and she was 18. Fathers James Smith and Ambrose Stokes. Can't see a death date for him on BMD though. I appreciate your difficulty as there are Smiths in my tree!
Ros

[stevie2006]

Hi Ros he got married on 25/12/1892 and I have his birth certificate which states 1866 in Weedon, Daventry in Northampton

Although it says 22 in 1892 he must have got the age wrong as he would have been 26 and his wife was only 18 - maybe he wanted to be a bit younger

Simply can't find the death at all

Steven

[SueNSW]

He appears to have played a bit fast and loose with his age as he stated he was 40 in 1911 and 30 in 1901

Most likely death - presuming he stayed in the area - and continued to believe he was a little younger - looks to be 1/4 1941 London City 1c 41 - aged 70

BUT - with such a relatively common name (though at least he wasn't John) it is only a likely I guess

Cheers
Sue

[stevie2006]

Thanks Sue how sure are you this might be the one - worth getting the certificate via gro? He looked a little bit closer to his age in 1891 - 24 and was Captain of a boat called the Mars in Cowley Lock

Regards

Steven

[SueNSW]

Sorry Steven - not really better than 50/50 I'm afraid - going on my experience of mine and my husbands working class families who lived loosely in that area of East London/Essex along the Thames over that general period - and longer - they didn't generally tend to move far away at all - so I looked for a close by registration area with a similar age and this was the one that jumped out at me

If he moved away it's much more tricky and I guess any sort of family recollections if they are available would be your best guide to a possible location for his death

Good Luck
Sue

[stevie2006]

Thanks Sue looks like my best option so will order via GRO and fingers crossed

No family I can ask unfortunately - my grandad is no longer alive and no other relatives I can ask

On my own with the support of the Forum

Steven

[Uncle John]

You've probably worked out that he was born to a canal boating family and ended up "a cut above" as a Thames lighterman. So any intermediate sightings are likely to be somewhere on the canals between the Midlands and London.

[stevie2006]

Hi Uncle John looks like he moves occupations. In 1891 he is listed as Captain of the "Mars" at Cowley Lock which I presume is a Barge. Then in 1892 when he gets married he is listed as a labourer. Then in 1901 he is listed as Canal Boat Steerer in Limehouse. Then in 1911 he is listed as Bargeman in Mile End, London. Finally in 1918 on his son's marriage certificate in Stepney he is listed as a Lighterman.

So maybe gone up in the world or can spin a yarn or two!!!! You would have thought that were he really a Captain at only 24 he would have stated this on his marriage certificate to make it more exciting than labourer (no offence intended to any labourers of course).

Cannot find an apprentice record for him which would have been helpful - I know you had to complete an apprenticeship before becoming a Lighterman and it would have been good to have found that. Beginning to think his death was either not recorded or he drowned in the Thames and it wasn't recorded.

Thanks for the help

Steven

[Guest]

and dont forget he may have been dead when his Son got married ?? it has been know for the wrong info to be given, I have a few where they state the Fathers name and occupation yet he was dead??? I also have some say Father deceased but he wasn't ?
Good luck be interested to know if that cert is him hope so .

[stevie2006]

The certificate mentions Solomon juniors wife's dad is deceased that was why I assumed Solomon Smith was still alive but you are right the son may have lost touch and not known or just a mistake on the certificate

Will let you know Val and Sue how I get on - I need the certificate to say retired lighterman/boatman etc

Fingers crossed

Steven

[stevie2006]

Thats is ordered via GRO now its fingers crossed time.

Is there anyway I could find out of Solomon Senior did go through an apprenticeship - I know some kind members were able to help me with another Branch of the family and confirm the date they were bound to a Master and then freed. Trying to prove that Solomon did in fact become a proper Lighterman instead of talking a good game

Thanks

Steven

[Guest]

http://www.parishregister.com/parish_shop/default.asp?CatID=57

this looks interesting Steven

[stevie2006]

Thanks Val I looked at that CD before and wasn't sure but might be worth a shout as I could perhaps look for other ancestors as well. My birthday coming up soon so could add that to my wish list lol

Regards

Steven

[stevie2006]

Hi Sue & Val got the certificate and it looks very good. For one the occupation was given as waterside labourer and I knew he was a boatman/bargeman. Secondly his wife was recorded as Mrs M A Smith and I know her name was Mary Ann Stokes so thanks for all your help

He died at St Bartholomews Hospital and lived in Mile End - would anyone have any guesses as to where he may have been buried when he died in 1941

Thanks

Steven

[Guest]

thats great Steven
I think that covers Tower Hamlets so maybe one of these


TOWER HAMLETS

• City of London & Tower Hamlets Cemetery (also known as Bow Cemetery)
• Victoria Park Cemetery

[SueNSW]

Glad to hear of the seemingly positive outcome Steven - hope you can nail him down for certain

Best Wishes
Sue

[stevie2006]

Thanks Val next stop is phoning the cemeteries to see if I can find where he is buried

Sue - no 100% way of verifying it but with occupation and wife that close it must be him - if I find a grave stone it might give wife's full name

Regards

Steven

[stevie2006]

Val I have emailed City of London Cemetery as a starting point. His address on the death certificate was 135 Canal Road, Mile End, E3 - I forgot to mention this on my earlier post

Fingers crossed

Steven

[Guest]

hope your lucky Steven

this might interest you on FMP

Occupational records of Thames watermen and lightermen will also go online at findmypast.co.uk to complete the collection.