Heres an occupation question please

[Heather Positive Thinker]

In 1804 on the Victualling accounts, GGFx4 is noted as "horsekeeper and stage man". Now Im assuming he didnt moonlight as a theatre hand, so do we reckon stage is as we hear in the old cowboy films? sort of carriage?

[Olde Crone Holden]

Stage coach hand I expect, which would go very nicely with being a horse keeper.

OC

[ayse]

It could be he was paid by the publican in a coaching house (pub or hotel) to change the horses and care for them. "Stage" coach because the horses had to be changed every so often to ensure the journey could be continued by the passengers. The mail was taken by mail coaches (I think).
These sites are an interesting read http://www.victorianlondon.org/.

http://www.victorianweb.org/history/work/workov.html

[Heather Positive Thinker]

He actually worked for a brewery. A horsekeeper I would assume owns the horses rather than being like a groom, just caring for them. The stageman I assume must be something to do with stage coach but cant work out what as yet. May be its an older form of "dray man". This would be long before mail coaches.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Stage coach travel was well in force by the early 1800s. You can see adverts in many of the early trade directories.

Stage coaches relied on changes of horses for continual travel, so he would be a "horse keeper" rather than a horse owner, as the horses would be changed over at each stop (stage), rested, then used for a later journey or one the next day.

OC

[Heather Positive Thinker]

Hi OC, but this guy never worked anywhere but for the brewery. Thats why I was wondering if the "stage" was another word for a dray. I mean, a stage, flat wooden structure? And then the barrels strapped on it for taking round the victualling yard? (Next door to Deptford Royal Dockyard/victualling yard).

[ayse]

Hhi Heather

My Grandfather was a saddler/harness maker for Watneys in the days of delivery to their tied houses by dray. I wonder if they had more drays than horses. If so, perhaps they loaded the drays but had to wait for the return of an empty dray. Rather than wait for the re-loading of the dray, the "stage man" would re-harness the horses to a different dray. The term "stageman" may have been used generically.

[Heather Positive Thinker]

Thanks ayse, just trying to get an idea of his level of occupation. He earned £15 a quarter of the year which I spose wasnt bad, even if he was doing a lot of overtime and he had two houses on the go. Just cant understand why he gives his occupation on last kids baptism as brewers labourer when he seems to have come from a reasonably well to do family (albeit dad is bankrupted) and marries into a middle class family. Spose there are things we will never know. Was saying to my cousin, how do we know he didnt get an illness and couldnt cope with a more stressful job anymore. So many mysteries we will never fathom

[ayse]

Perhaps the marriage was frowned upon and he needed to prove himself after his father was bankrupted. Ifhhis family originally came from a "good" family, he may have had experience of horses so it would have been an ideal job. Speculation is a wonderful thing and you are right, there are always soome things we may never know.

All the best

Ayse

[Olde Crone Holden]

Heather

One of my 3 x GGFs calls himself an ag lab in 1851. He was a Yeoman farmer with over 4,000 acres which had been in the family for centuries. I assume he was having a laugh.

OC