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  • Can someone help me to sort out this family puzzle

    Can someone help me sort out this family puzzle

    John Mills was born in 1824 in Dilwyn, Herefordshire.
    He married at Kingston Parish Church on 10 August 1845 to Ann Cartwright.
    1851 census John (27), Ann his wife (27) living at Etnan Street, Leominster, Herefordshire with their children Hannah (5), John (3) and Thomas (1)
    1861 census John (36) a miller, widower living at South Street, Leominster, Herefordshire with his children John (13), Thomas (11), Ann (9), Emma (1). He also has a couple of boarders living with him Ann Phillips (25) unmarried, a staymaker and her children Eliza Phillips (3) and Sarah Ann Phillips (1)
    Emma Mills was born 1854 at Etnan St, Leominster to John & Ann Mills nee Cartwright
    Anne Mills nee Cartwright died 1855 Etnan St, Leominster aged 30 years wife of John Mills, Miller
    The above all fits nicely but things go awry by 1871
    1871 census John Mills (54) a miller is living in Irvington, Herefordshire with wife Ann (37) and chldren, Thomas (21), Eliza (13), Sarah Ann (11), William (6), James (4), Richard (2)
    1881 census John Mills (56) a miller with wife Ann (46) living in Irvington with children James (14), Richard (11), Amos (8), and Cephas (5) his grandson child of Eliza
    I have Amos birth certificate and it states his mother's maiden name is Phillips
    I sent off for a marriage between John Mills and Ann Phillips in 1858 both bride and groom were aged 20 and the groom was a porter
    A John Mills died in 1888
    Can anyone help me sort out which is my John Mills and family please?

  • #2
    I made a chart of your info.

    It looks as if they are all yours (not the 1858 marriage: too soon as wrong ages), but that there are a couple of enumerator errors:
    Emma should be 6 in 1851, not 1
    John should be 45 in 1861, not 54 (notice that transposing digits is a very easy mistake to make!)

    I'm going to have a quick look at images to see if I can see anything to clarify.

    Christine
    Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for your help Christine, do you think my John married another Ann but not Ann Phllips? As his wife died in 1855 and then by 1871 he descibes Ann as his wife. Can you see why I am banging my head against a wall!!

      Comment


      • #4
        not the 1858 marriage: too soon as wrong ages
        Also hard to see why they'd say that they weren't married at 1861.

        Christine
        Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

        Comment


        • #5
          This IGI batches are interesting:
          J146102
          K146102

          Christine
          Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

          Comment


          • #6
            The John Mills baptised in 1848, is my great, great grandfather, but the Ann Phillips baptism is interesting, I suppose it is possible they didn't marry just put down they were man and wife to save face, because I can only find one marriage in the time scale for John Mills and Ann Phllips and that I agree with you isn't mine. I'll be bald by the time I sort this out, I am tearing my hair out as well as banging my head on a wall!

            Comment


            • #7
              Burial records can be revealing.

              I have a gx2-g-mother who's described as
              bur 21 Jan 1894, age 68, Mary Elizabeth Stratford "properly called GARDNER" Wigginton
              GARDNER as her maiden name. Her husband was John STRATFORD, but he'd been married to her elder sister who'd died very young, so they wouldn't have been able to marry at that time, being deemed too closely related.

              Christine
              Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

              Comment


              • #8
                John Mills was born in 1824 in Dilwyn, Herefordshire.

                He married at Kingston Parish Church on 10 August 1845 to Ann Cartwright.

                1851 census John (27), Ann his wife (27) living at Etnan Street, Leominster, Herefordshire with their children Hannah (5), John (3) and Thomas (1)


                1861 census John (36) a miller, widower living at South Street, Leominster, Herefordshire with his children John (13), Thomas (11), Ann (9), Emma (1).
                Emma Mills was born 1854 at Etnan St, Leominster to John & Ann Mills nee Cartwright

                Anne Mills nee Cartwright died 1855 Etnan St, Leominster aged 30 years wife of John Mills, Miller

                He also has a couple of boarders living with him Ann Phillips (25) unmarried, a staymaker and her children Eliza Phillips (3) and Sarah Ann Phillips (1)

                The above all fits nicely but things go awry by 1871

                1871 census John Mills (54) a miller is living in Irvington, Herefordshire with wife Ann (37) and chldren, Thomas (21), Eliza (13), Sarah Ann (11), William (6), James (4), Richard (2)

                1881 census John Mills (56) a miller with wife Ann (46) living in Irvington with children James (14), Richard (11), Amos (8), and Cephas (5) his grandson child of Eliza

                I have Amos birth certificate and it states his mother's maiden name is Phillips

                I sent off for a marriage between John Mills and Ann Phillips in 1858 both bride and groom were aged 20 and the groom was a porter

                A John Mills died in 1888
                From reading this, it seems that he might not have married Ann no2 but she just took his name on as though they were married.

                Have you found Ann Phillips before 1861? did she have her children baptised? if so does it state anything for a 'supposed father?' (i'm thinking Eliza and Sarah here)
                Julie
                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                .......I find dead people

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thank you they are both interesting thoughts, I will havea trip to Hereford in the summer and see if I can find the burial records, I do actually have the death certificate of the second wife, if she is his wife as well as the first. I will also check the baptism records for Eliza and Sarah Ann. I suppose it would be an idea too get a birth cert for either Eliza or Sarah to see who the father is. Will go back on the census and look for Ann. Thanks for your help
                  Anne

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    John Mills is also my great great grandfather. I have visited Hereford Records Office and they found the following details for me.
                    John's first wife, Ann Cartwright died 22/10/1855. He then married Ann Phillips on the 20/12/1858 in Eye, Ashton and Moreton, Herefordshire.
                    Her father's name was Charles and he was a Shoemaker.
                    That is why Amos has Phillips as his mother's maiden name.
                    John remained a Miller all his life. He lived in Etnam Street, Leominster, South Street, Leominster and Ivington, Leominster.
                    John's son William, who was born 1865 is my great grandfather. Can you tell me which of his sons or daughters you are related to?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      John mills

                      Hi

                      This is great news I had given up on this problem as I was getting nowhere.

                      I sent off for the marriage certificate for John Mills and Ann Phillips but he is down as 20 years old and he would have been 34 years also his occupation is Porter and he was a miller, so not sure this is the right John Mills. Also it says his father is John Mills (this is correct) but his occupation again doesn't match he is down as a nailor or nailer.

                      My great, great, grandfather was John and Ann Mills (nee Cartwright) son John. He left the Herefordshire area and ended up in Salford in Lancashire.

                      If you would like any copies of the certs I have (including Amos - if you haven't already got it - not point in paying for them twice) let me have an email address to send them.

                      Anne

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hello both insane and rival,

                        I was very happy to find this thread, quite by chance! Anne Cartwright's aunt (also called Anne) was my 4x great-grandmother; I have quite a lot of information about the Cartwrights and some of their branches, and I'd love to know more about John Mills' family and descendants.

                        Please contact me via private message so we can perhaps exchange e-mails.

                        Best regards,

                        D.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Dawsr - welcome to FTF!

                          You'll see that these posts were made some time ago. It might be worth trying a PM (personal message - click on the name on the left and you'll see a mail icon). That might attract more attention than just this post, which is on a thread which is slipping down the lists.

                          Christine
                          Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

                          Comment

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