Why the name change ?

[Guest]

in 1911 have a Valentine Tomselle aged 30 born Italy occupation Lead Worker with
Wife Josephine aged 26 also born Italy
3 children
Rosie aged 3 born London
Mary aged 2 " "
James aged 11 months " "
says married 6 years
have Birth Cert of Maria in 1908 Bromley London says
Father Valentino Tomaselli
Mother Josephina Tomaselli formerly Firara
The only marriage I can find for a Valentino Tomasello is in 1906 Kensington to a Pepina Swar ????
HELP???

[Olde Crone Holden]

Well, Pepina is a derivative of Josephina, so that fits.

The surname SWAR only appears once on Freebmd, so I imagine that is a mistake on the certificate, or on the transcription.

OC

[naomiatt]

Hi - and this birth gives another spelling -
Births Jun 1912 Tomasello Walter Sivar Poplar 1c 939
If the same family....I wonder if it's how Firara sounded at the time to the registrar?
There is nothing else for Sivar on FreeBMD either...Sivar and Swar sound/look similiar..
would an Italian 'F' sound comes across as a 'S' or 'SW' sound?

[Christine in Herts]

Might be worth keeping an eye on the TOMASETTI records, in case they get mixed up with one another?

Christine

[Christine in Herts]

There's also a Baptism: Louis Ulysse Joseph Tomaselli 7 Jul 1891 at Holy Trinity, Lambeth.

The parents were Joseph (a butler) & Adele.

Christine

[Guest]

Thanks very much everyone you have helped a lot
I did not know that was Pepina OC??
I wonder if that Walter is another child of theirs then ???ummmm

[naomiatt]

There's an Antonio as well - with the Swar that OC mentioned;
Births Dec 1913
Tomasello Antonio Swar Stepney 1c 608

If it's all the same family (??) under that spelling, they've gone from Kensington to Paddington to Poplar and Stepney.....but then you mentioned that Maria was born in Bromley..
Where were they living in 1911?

[Guest]

hi again Naomiatt and thanks they are in 55 Bygrove Street Poplar in 1911
Reckon that could be another child of theirs??

[naomiatt]

hi again Naomiatt and thanks they are in 55 Bygrove Street Poplar in 1911
Reckon that could be another child of theirs??

Hi - could well be.....I'm just wondering if there are two families here getting confused with each other..although Poplar makes sense for James and Walter..

Marriages Sep 1906
Tomasello Valentino Kensington 1a 435

Births Jun 1907
TOMASELLO Rosie Paddington 1a 76

Births Sep 1908
TOMASELLI** Maria Poplar 1c 488

Births Jun 1910
TOMASELLO James Poplar 1c 567

Births Jun 1912
Tomasello Walter Sivar Poplar 1c 939

Births Dec 1913 Tomasello
Tomasello Antonio Swar Stepney 1c 608

When you look forward, there's lots for Tomaselli e.g
Sewell Joan E Tomaselli Kensington 1a 512
Tomaselli Walter Sewell Kensington 1a 512
Marriages Jun 1936

and Christine found that info below..

but nothing further on FreeBMD after Antonio's birth with the surname spelling of Tomasello

Have you accounted for the children etc going forward?

Might be an idea to apply for Valentino's marriage cert. to clarify the spelling for his wife

[Olde Crone Holden]

Yes, it does look as if there could be two families, one with wife Josephine and one with Pepina, lol!

OC

[Guest]

oh no Really ??? not two
Let me explain I have a marriage cert for Marietta Tomaselli aged 27 marrying my George Arthur Miller in 1935 Kensington
says Father of Marietta is Valentine Tomaselli Ice Cream Vendor
so thought this was the right Birth Cert for her ???
and maybe James and Rosie were her siblings ???
Now not so sure ??????????????

[naomiatt]

What was the occupation in 1911? (Italian's make the best ice cream!!)
Ignore me! You said he was a lead worker then...
Walter married in Kensington as well...have you looked at births for a Marietta and not a Mary or Maria?
I saw this;-

Births Mar 1907 Taramaschi Marietta Louise Lambeth 1d 365

and as before;
Births Sep 1908
TOMASELLI Maria Poplar 1c 488


Does the cert give a middle name or initial for Marietta?

[Guest]

yes there isnt one for a Marietta of the right age ??? but an aunt told she called herself May ??? so it is varied anyway I have the wedding photo of them and she is very pretty .

[naomiatt]

I think then that the birth is the right person...who married George....
and it seems likely that Walter is her brother as well because they both married in
Kensington...but I've not yet seen marriages for the others...have you?

[naomiatt]

In 1911, there was an Ellen Ferera living in Mile End - she was born in 1829 -
and another Antonio - Tomaselli - born 1893 and living in Newark, Notts.

Here's Ellen -

Deaths Mar 1918 Ferera Ellen 89 Poplar 1c 697

also Poplar**

and only two others with that spelling on FreeBMD

Births Jun 1893
Ferera Mary Vulante Cardiff 11a 437

Deaths Jun 1934
Ferera Rose 41 Swansea 11a 1013

This Rose matches the 1893 birth year for Mary Vulante

There is one with the spelling of Ferrera/Ferreira;

Marriages Mar 1859
Buckle Hannah Kezia Marylebone 1a 744
Buckle Hannah Keziah Marylebone 1a 744
Ferreira Manoel Da' Silva Marylebone 1a 744
FERRERA Manoel Da' Silva Marylebone 1a 744
Haynes Christina Lardy Marylebone 1a 744
Kemp Isaac Marylebone 1a 744

Also -
Deaths Mar 1908 Fereira Maria A M 34 Kensington 1a 75

and there are loads and loads of Ferreira's on FreeBMD
(It can also be a Sephardic Jewish surname)

Perhaps you're looking at a double surname for May's mother....an F and a S....

[Guest]

Thanks again Naomi you have been busy ?
Have found the Deaths for a Marietta Carmella Tomaselli in Brent 1970 right birth date for Josephine UGH
and one for probably her Husband Valentine Tomasello also in Brent right age
Think I will have to satisfy my curiousity and send for them

[Christine in Herts]

Marietta will be a diminutive of Maria, so you may have the same problems as we've found with Emily/Emma, Robert/Robin, Edward/Edwin, and so on.

Christine

[Guest]

Thanks Christine wish they would leave their names alone

[Christine in Herts]

Thanks Christine wish they would leave their names alone

So your name isn't really Valerie? :xmas_wink:

Christine

[Guest]

:xmas_confused::xmas_biggrin:you dont think I'd pick a horrible name like that do you ??? lol