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Stuck with census can anyone help please

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  • Stuck with census can anyone help please

    i'm sinking my teeth back into the Hattons and so far:
    John Liptrot Hatton born 29th November 1809 St Peter, Liverpool, Lancs
    married Emma Pounsett (previously Marsh as was married to Richard Poussett)

    1841 there is
    John
    Emma
    Margaret
    Frances
    Julia (step daughter)


    1851:
    John as a visitor

    1851:

    Emma and Frances (daughter)

    now 1861 there is a John Hallon who is a professor of music which is what John Hatton was and also married to an Emma but the thing is there are 3 children called John (Johann) Sebastian 1856 whose mother is Frances, George Frederick 1856 mother also Frances and Louis Felix 1859 who also has mother as Frances but on the census they can be found with mother Emma.
    I have found that there could possibly be 2 other John Hattons or Haltons and one of them married a Frances so am now confused are these my Johns children with Emma as they are on the census together or are they another John's children? The other thing is John Hatton (my one) also was a professor of music which the one with these children is so would be a bit strange to have 2 people same area same job same name wouldn't it?
    Any help would be really appreciated.
    Last edited by jennie; 05-12-09, 20:35.
    Jen

  • #2
    Is John Hatton (the Lipptrott one) still in Lancashire in 1841 and 1851 ?

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    • #3
      It has to be the same John Liptrott Hatton being the father on the LMA baptisms as your one and really it has to be Emma as the mother. All I can think of is Emma was known unofficially as Frances for some reason. Have you found Emma's death? Hopefully it says Emma F Hatton even if she wasn't christened as such. I've looked at Johann's marriage cert and Emma's not a witness so no luck there. Have you found the other's marriages?
      Hail Spode!

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      • #4
        sorry Jennie, have now found 1851 and 1861. Have moved further onto 1871 and have found one of your other John Hattons who is a professor of music. This one comes from Macclesfield, Cheshire. Could this possibly be John Liptrott's son (the john or johann b. 1856).

        In the 1861 I have found a John C Hatton, professor of music but comes from Gloucestershire, living in Lancashire, wife Harriet, children georgianna and john charles.

        In 1851 I have Emma Hatton B 1806 in Greenwich with daughter frances b 1841 in Liverpool living in Bloomsbury - am assumimg this is your Emma and Frances. In 1861, Emma, Frances and Emma J Pounsett are living in Chichester. Emma is still married to a Professor of music. Emma Jane Pounsett marries in 1867.

        The only other thing I can think of is that John was living with, or bigamously married another Emma.

        Sorry Jennie, don't really think I have done anything to help but just gone over everything you already know. Will have a more organised look on Sunday

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        • #5
          Originally posted by guybrush View Post
          It has to be the same John Liptrott Hatton being the father on the LMA baptisms as your one and really it has to be Emma as the mother. All I can think of is Emma was known unofficially as Frances for some reason. Have you found Emma's death? Hopefully it says Emma F Hatton even if she wasn't christened as such. I've looked at Johann's marriage cert and Emma's not a witness so no luck there. Have you found the other's marriages?

          That is what i was wondering could it be a middle name or she was actually called Frances but went by the name of Emma. She is on the 1861 census but not the 71 census so i am guessing she passed away between those years, but as yet haven't found a death cert. I don't have any other certs for this side as it is my friends tree so i think i will have to get her to dig in her purse for some.
          Jen

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          • #6
            Originally posted by champagnegal View Post
            sorry Jennie, have now found 1851 and 1861. Have moved further onto 1871 and have found one of your other John Hattons who is a professor of music. This one comes from Macclesfield, Cheshire. Could this possibly be John Liptrott's son (the john or johann b. 1856). This could be his son but wrnog place but right year of birth

            In the 1861 I have found a John C Hatton, professor of music but comes from Gloucestershire, living in Lancashire, wife Harriet, children georgianna and john charles. I thought there was 2 very strange that 2 people called the same do the same job

            In 1851 I have Emma Hatton B 1806 in Greenwich with daughter frances b 1841 in Liverpool living in Bloomsbury - am assumimg this is your Emma and Frances. In 1861, Emma, Frances and Emma J Pounsett are living in Chichester. Emma is still married to a Professor of music. Emma Jane Pounsett marries in 1867.

            The only other thing I can think of is that John was living with, or bigamously married another Emma.

            Sorry Jennie, don't really think I have done anything to help but just gone over everything you already know. Will have a more organised look on Sunday
            Oh no you have helped thankyou i am playing around with so many ideas at the minute to see which one is most likely.
            Thanks for your help.
            Jen

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            • #7
              I dare say you've seen this but I'll post it anyway

              John Liptrot Hatton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
              WendyP

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              • #8
                Hi Wendy yeah i have that thankyou.
                Jen

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                • #9
                  Dear All

                  Birth Cert for John Sebastian Hatton has name of mother as Frances Hatton (formerly Day) - if you check the following 1851 census you'll notice that there is a Frances Day here and John Liptrott Hatton as visitor so there are definitely an Emma and Frances as mothers, now need to confirm that there weren't two John Liptrott Hatton's as profs of music

                  1851 England Census
                  Name: John Liptrot Hatton
                  Age: 39
                  Estimated birth year: abt 1812
                  Relation: Visitor
                  Gender: Male
                  Where born: Liverpool
                  Civil parish: Marylebone
                  Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
                  County/Island: Middlesex
                  Registration district: Marylebone
                  Sub-registration district: St Mary
                  Household Members: Name Age
                  Ebenezer Day 32
                  Francis Day 21
                  Emma Pearse 21
                  Emma Budlle 25
                  Robert Eradergrats 60
                  John Liptrot Hatton 39 visitor
                  Mary Anne Williamson 27
                  Anne Hillyer 26

                  Regards

                  Dennis
                  Last edited by Southy; 14-12-09, 14:02.

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