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Where to look for pre-1837 Middlesex births?

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  • Where to look for pre-1837 Middlesex births?

    Hi,

    Sorry to ask something I should be able to answer by looking around, I know it is cheating a bit, but I have confused myself by looking at too many places and now I'm just going round in circles.

    Can someone just clarify for me where (online or in person) I could look for a birth, c 1830, that is not coming up in general searches.

    Thanks in advance

    Rachel
    Last edited by Rachandgarry; 28-10-09, 13:19. Reason: 'cos I'm daft and put 1930 instead of 1830! Doh!

  • #2
    You should be able to find a 1930 birth on the BMD index on Ancestry
    England & Wales, Birth Index: 1916-2005 - Ancestry.co.uk

    Just checking - did you mean 1930 or 1830?
    Elaine







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    • #3
      ROFL! Oops!

      I meant 1830.....

      thanks for that, will edit my original post, lol...

      R

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      • #4
        :Big Grin: Easily done!

        Well in that case you will need the parish records - some of which you may find online, depending on parish.

        Do you want to give some details - might then be able to point you in the right direction.
        Elaine







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        • #5
          Rachel, I have been searching high and low for HENRY or ALFRED JOHN SELWYN.

          Post his details again here to see if anyone else has any luck.

          I have found an Alfred Cresswell born in 1828 and christened in 1829 in Marylebone (Ancestry doesn't say Marylebone but Bryanston Square). They live in Crawford Street. You see how desparate I was getting!

          I wondered that since there was no sign of a SELWYN birth/baptism, whether Alfred/Henry had for some reason completely changed his name! Or perhaphs he was illegit. and had changed his name later on.

          All speculation of course, but we need some lateral thinking.

          You could also ask help for finding him on the 1841 and 1851 censuses. And of course, Emily Rawlins, born c. 1834-1836 Chichester Sussex! :smilee:
          Elizabeth
          Research Interests:
          England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
          Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

          Comment


          • #6
            Rachel,
            I don't know if you're familiar with FreeReg? The ULTIMATE aim is to cover ALL baptism, marriage and burial records, from parish registers.(It is a FREE site.)

            FreeREG - Searches

            The site is still in its infancy, but is being added to all the time.
            Some counties (like East Yorkshire) have very few entries as yet; others (like Norfolk) have good coverage.
            Always worth a look - and you can also search to see which parishes are covered within each county.

            Jay
            Janet in Yorkshire



            Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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            • #7
              Middlesex is a problem as much of it is now London - very densely populated, lots of parishes and pages of baptisms for each day to check through.

              If you can't find info on the LMA records on Ancestry you will need to consider parishes not in their records - or the possibility that your chap was privately baptised and the entry never written in the register - or that he wasn't baptised until much later.
              ~ with love from Little Nell~
              Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi all,

                Thanks for the ideas...

                I know this about him:

                He was born in 1829 in 'Marylebone' or 'Middlesex' (different census' gives diff info, lol).

                He died in Farnham in September 1880. He died as Henry Cresswell Selwyn.

                I cannot find him at all on the 1841, 1851 or 1861 census.

                He was married to Emily Rawlins, born 1834 in Chichester Sussex. She had a sister Jane Rawlins, born 1817 in Hampshire. Her parents were Cornelius Rawlins born in 1795 in Portsmouth/1792 in Hampshire, and Elizabeth ?, born in 1797 Sussex/1799 Hampshire. She lived at: in 1841 - Bevois Street, Southampton, Hampshire then in 1851 – 20 Houndwell Garden, St Marys Southampton.

                As a married couple, they lived at: in 1871 – Ash Rd Lord Clyde Beer House, Aldershot, Surrey. He is listed as Henry Selwyn. They had two children; Alfred Cresswell Selwyn born 2nd January 1861 Hawley Farnborough Surrey, and Isabella Mary Cresswell Selwyn born Q4 1861 Hoxton Middlesex. On Alfred's birth certificate the father is listed as "Alfred John Selwyn" ????? But on Alfred's marriage certificate some years later, the father is listed as "Henry Cresswell Selwyn" - so a mistake/name change/family mystery happened somewhere!

                By 1881, Emily was listed as a widower, living at Alexandra Road, Aldershot (Hants), still with one their son, Alfred. Isabella had moved out and married Walter Flint (long history there too, but I won't include it here lol) and as he was in the army, they were living in Blandford, Dorset.

                Emily died in Blandford, Dorset in Q4 1887, presumably staying or living with Isabella.

                So, I still can't find any record of Henry Selwyn (Henry Cresswell Selwyn) before the 1871 census at which point he was about 41 years old, so he has to have existed....grrrrrrrrrrr!!!!

                Any help greatly appreciated. ElizabethinHerts has done some fantastic work on my tree, including much of the above, so thank you for that, I do appreciate it. We've both been looking for this guy but he just doesn't seem to exist, lol!

                Rachel x

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                • #9
                  Hi Rachel

                  Is there a possibility that these were two different people, perhaps brothers?

                  I have two cases in my tree, where the birth cert says one father & the marriage cert says another, but it turned out that they used their uncle's names on the marriage certs, usually because by the time they married their fathers were already deceased, & it appears it was not uncommon to give another adult's name as "father" on the marriage, usually the father's brother; maybe they were responsible for the child's upbringing.

                  It's worth discounting that they are two different people.

                  Joanie

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                  • #10
                    Hi Joanie,

                    LOVE your username, that's brilliant!!

                    You raise a valid point, and it is completely possible. I wish I could find a birth, baptism or marriage record for him or a brother.... just nothing even resembling Alfred or Henry around that time in that area.

                    <screeeeeeeeeeeeeam>

                    R

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                    • #11
                      Hi - could I suggest searching with his middle name of Cresswell as a surname.

                      Only the other day I found an elusive marriage which had been indexed, not under the surname, but under the name of 'Spencer'. This was his middle name of which he must have been very proud because it always appears!! The actual entry had his name correctly written.

                      Good luck.
                      Lal x

                      Mirror,Mirror, on the wall......I am my mother after all!!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Rachel, there is a Henry Cresswell on the 1851Census born in Marylebone and living in Chelsea with his mother and sister.
                        Class: HO107; Piece: 1474; Folio: 70; Page: 51; GSU roll: 87797.

                        He is a chair maker. I'm wondering if that could turn to upholsterer in the future.

                        I think it would be a good idea to note down all these entries and then review the evidence later!
                        Elizabeth
                        Research Interests:
                        England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                        Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hi again!

                          Sorry for the lack of reply in the last week; I've been on holiday and ran out of time at the last minute packing etc that I didn't have time to post here :-(

                          But the interesting news is that the certificates I ordered before I left, arrived while I was away..... if you can remember the situation, here are some updates:

                          Isabella Mary Selwyn's (b 1862) birth cert shows father's name as "Alfred Selwyn", occupation Upholsterer and Journeyman of 4 Haberdashers Place East, Hoxton Old Town.

                          That other child you mentioned who died in infancy, George Cresswell (b 1872) - was indeed Isabella and Alfred's brother; his birth certificate shows the father as "Alfred Henry Selwyn", occupation 'retailer of beer' of Ash Road Aldershot Hants.

                          I have the death certificate for the Henry Cresswell Selwyn who died in Frimley on 2nd July 1880. It is definitely him because the informant is "I.M.Cresswell" - daughter. He is listed as an upholsterer, age 51 at time of death, at Sandpit Cottage Alexandra Road, Aldershot. He died of Brights Disease, and then in the same box it says something that is illegible: looks like "certified by H E Frestrail, F.R.E.S." (which I presume is the doctor?)

                          So, whilst we have more information to hand, we are still no closer to tracking this guy down. Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!!!!

                          I will note all this down, see if I can put a very clear timeline of what we know about him then perhaps ask for help again on another post!?

                          How frustrating lol. Thanks for all the help so far, the suggestions have been wonderful - and I've found so much information that I wouldn't have otherwise. Yayyyyyy!!

                          Regards
                          Rachel

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