Is there a Better "Gedcom"

[graham6846]

Hi All
Most of us are familiar with Gedcom being the universal go between all the different programs, but is it not time we had a new Gedcom that caters for data .

I suspect the program was created by the LDS who are not really interested in that aspect of a Tree , as they want only raw info , so possible not willing to further enhance the program to bring it up to a 2009 status .

I suppose as someone getting older , my fear is that when I have gone , will someone in the Family know that X tree file is run using X tree program should they wish to see the vast amount of certidficate , photos , sound recording ,movie etc etc that is vital part of the TREE and brings life to that Family Tree.

Its all well and good having Gedcom and to some degree it serves a purpose but in its present form its only the bare bone’s of a tree and certainly not full of life .

The other thing that a better Gedcom will easily allow is to share and give out to relations all this wonderful information .

Graham

[Sue1]

Hi Graham,

I couldn't agree more with your comments. I, who am not computer literate - had never used the internet even until 2 years ago - have just completed 4 Trees (are they ever completed) and 2 of them are for specific parts of the family to be sent to other people). I had absolutely no idea until a couple of weeks ago that no photos, etc would be on the Gedcoms I send. I have just bought a flashdrive to save a backup copy of the tree and obviously I will only be saving the data not the nitty gritty of the tree.

Incredibly useful as Gedcoms are, there must be something else "out there" that I didn't know about. I saw an absolutely brilliant family tree that had been done as a personal website but I daresay the same thing would apply.

Perhaps our paperless society does have a need for paperwork after all. I know they can be printed but at enormous cost BUT we can print a copy of our own tree I suppose, page by page.

Sue:(

[Elaine ..Spain]

I have just bought a flashdrive to save a backup copy of the tree and obviously I will only be saving the data not the nitty gritty of the tree.

If you create a BACK UP copy of your family tree file it will be a back up copy of your working file, which will include all data, photos, notes etc.

If you create a GEDCOM copy of the family tree file, and use that as your backup then it will only contain data.

Which family tree program are you using?

[Elaine ..Spain]

Hi All
Most of us are familiar with Gedcom being the universal go between all the different programs, but is it not time we had a new Gedcom that caters for data .

Not sure what you mean here Graham. In what way does the GEDCOM format not cater for your data?

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

The GED format is evolving all the time.

Initially the format could only record around a dozen or so "fields" of information (name, date of birth, place of birth etc), each field is given a "tag" (date, place etc).

The latest revision allows over 250 fields and tags to be recorded, including notes for an individual, some programmes allow custom tags to be created but these may not transfer between different software platforms everytime.

Tags and fields plus link to a table of current tags/fields can be found in the wiki GED pages

GEDCOM Troubleshooter - Family Tree Forum

[Mike Fisher]

Not sure what you mean here Graham. In what way does the GEDCOM format not cater for your data?

Images !!!

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

Images !!!

Gedcom files are text only and can be opened, edited and created by word processing programmes. To transfer images it wouldn't need a better GEDCOM, it would be something that isn't a GEDCOM at all.

It is possible to share all your text and image details with another researcher if you both use the same software programme and both use a high speed connection with a chunky e-mail attachment limit via non GED filetypes BUT as a GED file for even a small tree can be 3-4MB with notes and references etc it's easy to see how a non GED file with images attached could soon be too large to send via e-mail and almost impossible to verify easily. A GED file with notes and sources is far more than "bare bones", the whole story of an ancestor can be transferred quickly and easily between researchers and in any case there aren't many pre 1800 ancestors who you could locate an image for but that doesn't mean they are less interesting to research and share with relatives.

The easiest method of all for large and/or complex files is to save the GED file and images to disc(s) and send them by snail mail, sending the whole lot by e-mail usually means that somewhere there isn't a backup copy made and everything is at risk.

[Elaine ..Spain]

As an alternative, if you are using Family Tree Maker, you could upload your file to Ancestry, make it a private tree and share the login details with invited people only.

[Sue1]

As an alternative, if you are using Family Tree Maker, you could upload your file to Ancestry, make it a private tree and share the login details with invited people only.

Hi Elaine,

On Ancestry.co you certainly can share your tree by making it available by naming people to share it BUT this is only for other fee paying members of Anc.co. I am afraid.

Somebody, Glen in Tinsel Knickers (really) mentioned you can transfer it onto a disc - I didn't know that - are you sure the pictures go on as well? If this is the case, this will be the answer.

However, for one's own descendants for years into the future, a disc will not survive (I am told they deteriorate as do flashdrives) I still wonder if paperwork is not the "thing". Of course with paperwork ancestry have you by the "ears" because, other than printing hundreds of pages, you cannot transfer it to paperwork BUT they will do it for megabucks. Anyway, I tried something called "Legends" and am told, despite having an XP something or other computer, it does not have the required thingy on it to function!!!! Quite beyond my simple mind.

I am pretty ignorant about all this BUT how would you download a tree on anc.co to a disc without it just being a Gedcom - there is no facility to do this as far as I can make out? Info appreciated ++ (but in simple, very simple, terms).

Sue:conf:

[Elaine ..Spain]

Hi Elaine,
On Ancestry.co you certainly can share your tree by making it available by naming people to share it BUT this is only for other fee paying members of Anc.co. I am afraid.

Are you sure Sue? I have a private tree on Ancestry and I know I have shared it in the past with non fee paying members.

Re downloading a tree from Ancestry to a disc, then I am afraid GEDCOM is your only possibility. I had presumed you had a family tree program on your computer.

In my opinion, what you should be doing is keeping your tree on your own computer using a specifically designed software program. You should never rely on a third party to look after your data, in this case Ancestry.
With the data on your own machine you can keep it up to date as and when you want, back your file up regularly, including images, and should you wish to publish it to the internet on sites such as Ancestry then you can do so by uploading a file from time to time, and sharing it with whomever you want. If you are using Family Tree Maker then you can upload a fully working file to Ancestry which will include images.

I have been know to get my soap box out from time to time when discussing this - for me the only option is to keep the master file under your own control on your own computer. :smilee:

[Cloggie]

Hi Elaine,

On Ancestry.co you certainly can share your tree by making it available by naming people to share it BUT this is only for other fee paying members of Anc.co. I am afraid.

People you invite to view your tree only require "guest registration" on Ancestry and do not have to pay a subscription in order to view your tree.

You can also build and share a tree on Ancestry without having a paid subscription.

For more info, see: Ancestry Guest registration

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

Somebody, Glen in Tinsel Knickers (really) mentioned you can transfer it onto a disc - I didn't know that - are you sure the pictures go on as well? If this is the case, this will be the answer.

You couldn't add images into the GED file, the GED format won't support image files (jpeg, bmap, TIFF etc).

What you would have to do is copy the GED file(s) from your pc onto disc and repeat the process for any image file(s) you want to add. The GED file and images would be on the one disc but would be totally separate from each other. There is no way to incorporate image files into a GEDCOM format or vice versa, the two filetypes are not compatable.

[Mike Fisher]

It would be very useful to have the images in my family history program (not FTM) included in a GEDCOM to othe people who use a different program. I use PediTree.

Also FTM does not allow Q(uarter) date as used in the UK to represent the quarters of the years in the GRO indexes

[graham6846]

Hi Guys
Which program used hardly matter’s all of them will do an adequate back up , one a few years ago ( I think Legend) even used to create a shareable CD disc that took a portion of the main program plus all the text & data , photo’s image s, Cert’s etc making a stand alone CD which could easily be given to non PC relations.
Sadly that’s not available now as it doesn’t work with the new windows platforms Vista .

But some also readers ,just didn’t get the point , OK a family tree with just text is fine for many people but to me that’s only a skeleton without the meat and its images photo’s that give a human touch . Then do not forget that while we do not have images of our individual past family we all have Church data , census records etc all of these I have scanned and added to the relevant person/family , non of this transfers with a gedcom file.

I believe a common denominator file to transfer tree’s between programs is of course an excellent tool , but it should also cater for the Meaty data ,not just the bones

Finally , OK we all back up our stuff and the file resides somewhere on the PC or maybe a DVD and then a big red double decker bus decides that’s it !! , when the dust has settled and someone is going thro your effects , will they KNOW what to do with this file , will they recognises the difference between a FTW , and a PAF extension , but a good common GEDCOM file would know what to do !

Graham

[Sue1]

Dear Glen,

Thank you very much for your responses. I have to say I am not quite sure what I am going to do right now - puzzling on the difficulties of technology for now quite frankly.

Sue

[Elaine ..Spain]

But some also readers ,just didn’t get the point , OK a family tree with just text is fine for many people but to me that’s only a skeleton without the meat and its images photo’s that give a human touch .

I think we would all agree with you on this point.

However, I don't see how you can expect an equal platform between different family tree software programs.

We don't get an equal platform between wordprocessing programs such as Open Office, Word 2003, Word 2007, Microsoft Works, Wordperfect etc., so why expect it for family tree software.

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

The reality is that the GEDCOM format does exactly what it was designed to do. Used as intended the GED format still fits the design brief it had to meet and will continue to do so. The LDS don't need v5.5 GED files to continue their work nor the ability to handle images, the basic early version of the GED format was/is quite sufficient for them. In reality the complaint that GED files won't handle images is a bit like saying the colour on my TV is a bit pale, but seeing it's only a black and white set should i be suprised?.

[graham6846]

Oh dear Glen , you miss the point ,
The title is "Is there a better GEDCOM " I certainly have not said the curent gedcom fails to do anything other than what it currently "States on the tin " what I want is a better version ie isn't it about time we had Colour

Graham

[Guy]

There have been a number of suggestions for the future of gedcom:
Gedcom (FD) - Future Direction
GedXL - an xml version

I feel that there is no requirement to develop Gedcom (which is simply a text file) to embed media, photos video sound etc., as these can simply be added to the transfer in their own file format.
Gedcom already allows links to such files and this means that such files can easily be accessed by ensuring they are transferred to similar locations on the new computer.
Cheers
Guy

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

Oh dear Glen , you miss the point ,
The title is "Is there a better GEDCOM " I certainly have not said the curent gedcom fails to do anything other than what it currently "States on the tin " what I want is a better version ie isn't it about time we had Colour

Graham

Asking for a GED file to handle images is like asking for a black and white tv to display a colour picture. Clearly it doesn't happen, the solution is to use the equipment designed for that purpose. With all due respect i am not the one to have missed the point.

Those who have followed my research know my tree is more than a bare skeleton, there are large parts of it which lack images, many relatives from the 1600 and 1700's for example but also a large number from much more recent times too and it's fair to say my tree is none the worse for it in terms of accuracy or depth of detail. If i want to share anything with a contact then i send a GED as an attachment to an e-mail, the time and effort to add a second (possibly third) attachment with images and/or a report is so minimal it doesn't bear thinking about.