How can I resolve this

[Helen Smith Too]

Hi,

This is a bit long-winded, and definitely confusing!

I have in my tree a Thomas Needham born c1815 in Tideswell in Derbyshire. His parents were William Needham and Elizabeth Harrison, married 1810 Tideswell.
In my early research I found Elizabeth Harrison, baptised Aug 1788 to William Harrison and Elizabeth Brightmore. She seemed to be the only likely Elizabeth Harrison born in Tideswell at the right time.
At that time (early 2006) I was in contact with someone who told me he'd found evidence to suggest Elizabeth Harrison was the daughter of Robert Harrison and Elizabeth Olerenshaw and bapt 1785 in Tideswell (as Betty).
I left this open ended until I got Elizabeth's death certificate. She died in 1845, aged 57. This seemed to tie up with the 1788 birth and I decided she was the daughter of WH & EB after all.

A couple of days ago, I was just googling and inputted the name of EB's father, Ralph Brightmore. This took me to someone's family site with lots of names the same as mine. I looked at her Harrisons, and she has MY Elizabeth Harrison (dau of WH & EB) down as marrying Thomas Bingham in 1814, meaning the other Elizabeth married William Needham!

I've checked the parish records (I have a set of transcriptions), and Elizabeth Bingham died in 1819, aged 29. This also ties in with a birth circa 1788.

So how can I work out which Elizabeth Harrison married William Needham, and which married Thomas Bingham? If the fathers names were in the records, they would be in my transcripitions. Obviously they aren't.

On the Harrison side this isn't too much of a bother as Robert & William were brothers.

Thank you for looking.

[Janet in Yorkshire]

How sure can one be that the other party has, in fact, got it "right"?

Sounds as if you need some other source, in addition to parish registers. Have you googled the surnames in the catalogue for the appropriate record office to see if there are any references for documents?

Jay

[Mike Fisher]

Any clues from the witnesses to both marriages?

[Helen Smith Too]

The transcriptions I have don't give the witnesses, but its a good idea...but then, the 2 Elizabeths were cousins and the same names appear in both families.
My only real thought is that William & Elizabeth Needham didn't name any of their sons Robert. In fact no Roberts at all down the line, and Robert Harrison lived long enough.
Elizabeth Bingham had 3 children before she died, but neither son was a Robert.

Janet, I'm not sure the other person has got it right either, but its enough now to get me thinking. i think the records are probably at Matlock.

[dicole]

We had a similar problem sort of problem with our WORNERS. Three Emmanuel WORNERS born in two years, all cousins of varying degrees - how to work it out ?

Among the Worner researchers, we agreed that one went to Tasmania with his parents, so that left two - and three marriages - one to Anne, one to Eliza and one to Mary Ann. We looked further and decided that the one with the son called Henry was most probably the son of Henry, and Henrys mother Eliza had probably died and his father remarried to Mary Ann. Baptism for Joseph Symes Worner (Symes was Mary Ann's maiden name) helped confirm this, but we were still unsure.

The other Emmanuel who married Ann had only daughters..... and then we had contact from a descendent of Henry Worner's Emmanuel and all was revealed !!

I agree with Mike - do the marriage witnesses give any clue, possibly a father or mother, brother, or just the parish clerk ?

What about a will for Elizabeth's fathers, William or Robert - even if one Elizabeth died young, he might have left something to his grandchildren - some of mine did. Or the husband mentioning a brother-in-law as executor ?

What about the census records, Elizabeths parents or siblings were not staying with the family (now there would be a piece of luck, and you have probably already tried it) ?

What about the children naming a child after maternal grandfather or grandmother - might not be definitive proof, but its somewhere to start. What about where they lived in the census - or did they all live close to Robert and William's parents ? Birthplaces of children might also indicate which is more likely to be which ?

It might not be possible to absolutely definite to start with, but build up the little clues and it might become clearer.


Di

[Uncle John]

I know it's in a different time-frame, but I've been chasing a distant rellie who died in the USA according to the person I got that part of the tree from. Now having Worldwide Ancestry (courtesy of the half-price offer) I was able to find the family's emigration. I knew I had the right family when the UK contact for the husband was his wife at a particular UK address, and then when the wife and children followed, her married sister at the same address was the contact.