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Englishedith
13-08-09, 13:29
Well,
I,d put off doing my mums line thinking it would be the hardest as the surname is Smith:eek:

Went on Lanc's BMD last night and found all their births and a few children that died young i'd no knowledge of,

Grandparents marriage there all at local church's so my question is if i go to Preston Records office would i be able to get a copy there and then.

I cliked the Ref num' and then the link from that page but the onl;ine ordering is N/A.
So i thought going direst may be quicker.
Anyone dealt with them?
Edi.

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 13:34
IF the marriage registers are held at Preston RECORDS office, then yes, you can get a photocopy there and then.

However, be aware that the cost of a photocopy marriage entry is now £7, in line with the cost of a certificate. (But no one can prevent you hand-copying the entry for nothing).

Check their website to see if they do indeed hold copies of the marriage registers you are interested in - not all have been deposited.

OC

Englishedith
13-08-09, 13:44
IF the marriage registers are held at Preston RECORDS office, then yes, you can get a photocopy there and then.

However, be aware that the cost of a photocopy marriage entry is now £7, in line with the cost of a certificate. (But no one can prevent you hand-copying the entry for nothing).

Check their website to see if they do indeed hold copies of the marriage registers you are interested in - not all have been deposited.

OC

Thanks OC, will have a look at the website and if theyve got them i'm going to town .
It will be my first visit to a records office so any tips would be apprieciated.
Edi.

Uncle John
13-08-09, 14:00
The only place which is certain to hold the records is the REGISTER office, which will have the duplicate records submitted by the church. Since you know which church, they will know which register to look in. The individual church may have deposited their original marriage register at the County RECORDS office, but it's just as likely to still be in the church safe.

Englishedith
13-08-09, 14:04
I've had a look and the registers for St Mathews Church are on microfiche Marriages 1884 to 1983.
Going to town then hoping the info' on record will help me get further back with gramps and grandma.
Going in on bus cause the parking is all meters or tickets
Will see how i get on and if i find it easy and not too nerve racking-----
i'll offer look ups on the volunteering thread.
Will let you know how i got on.
Edi.

Englishedith
13-08-09, 14:15
The only place which is certain to hold the records is the REGISTER office, which will have the duplicate records submitted by the church. Since you know which church, they will know which register to look in. The individual church may have deposited their original marriage register at the County RECORDS office, but it's just as likely to still be in the church safe.

Thanks UJ .Crossed each other . So i'm maybe better asking at the church and if they havent got them then it's the Registry office. Yes?
Edi

Christine in Herts
13-08-09, 14:35
Thanks UJ .Crossed each other . So i'm maybe better asking at the church and if they havent got them then it's the Registry office. Yes?
Edi

Which you feel is best is down to you. My preference is:

Record Office (or the Church if you find that the Record O hasn't got the records) then
Local Register Office or
GRO if there's any* problem getting the record form the local Register O.

*e.g. they don't have an online ordering system, or I want to pay by Cr/card and they don't accept - something like that.

I had thought that you could still get a photocopy or digital photo of a post-June-1837 marriage register if you attended the Record Office yourself to get it. That the £7 cut in only if you have to ask the Office to generate the copy for you.

Christine

Englishedith
13-08-09, 14:37
I've just been on the church's website and sent an email to ask if they still hold the records and if so what is the protocol for accessing them.
So i hope i get a quick reply cause it they havent got them I can still go tomorrow as i have a free day .
Edi.

Englishedith
13-08-09, 14:40
Which you feel is best is down to you. My preference is:

Record Office (or the Church if you find that the Record O hasn't got the records) then
Local Register Office or
GRO if there's any* problem getting the record form the local Register O.

*e.g. they don't have an online ordering system, or I want to pay by Cr/card and they don't accept - something like that.

I had thought that you could still get a photocopy or digital photo of a post-June-1837 marriage register if you attended the Record Office yourself to get it. That the £7 cut in only if you have to ask the Office to generate the copy for you.

Christine
Thankyou Christine Yes will definatley be doing one of those tomorrow
I'm quite excited now and looking forwards to finding some more info on my rellies.
Edi:)

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 15:34
Christine

No, the £7 charge applies to all copies of marriage certificates, no matter who generates the copy.

The "copying agency" has to pay the £7 to the GRO. This is the GRO closing that time-honoured loophole of getting exactly the same information for coppers AND depriving the GRO of revenue.

OC

Christine in Herts
13-08-09, 16:32
Christine

No, the £7 charge applies to all copies of marriage certificates, no matter who generates the copy.

The "copying agency" has to pay the £7 to the GRO. This is the GRO closing that time-honoured loophole of getting exactly the same information for coppers AND depriving the GRO of revenue.

OC

I can't see how it deprives the GRO of revenue. I should have thought that the admin costs of formally producing the cert and then posting out - plus any back-up they have to apply would mean that the margin would be pretty small - certainly not enough to be that money-grubbing.

Christine

Janet in Yorkshire
13-08-09, 16:55
How long has the £7 fee been in place?

I've never paid it. The last copy I had was of a microfiche image and the lady doing it apologised because she had actually printed out both the marriages on the page. I said not to worry - didn't tell her that the second marriage she'd included was the brother of the first bride!

I usually go to the record office and make transcriptions of marriage entries, if I possibly can. I then type these up onto a template I've made.
There have been no costs involved when making transcripts, and I can get details of an awful lot of marriages in a half-day session.

Jay

Christine in Herts
13-08-09, 17:10
I know that, if you apply from a distance, the Records Offices have had to make the £7 charge for a year or so.

I did think that I had more recent experience of being able to take the copy myself for just the copy-price (i.e. zero, if it's a photo).

Christine

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 17:40
It is only recent. I'll see if I can find the blurb.

There is no charge if you transcribe the record yourself, because there is no copyright on the information, it is the format which is copyright.

OC

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 17:51
Ha, I can't find the official announcement but perhaps there wasn't one. I remember thinking "ooh, sneaky" when I read about this.

OK, who is going to test this?

Edith seems to be our guinea pig - please report back here Edith!

OC

Janet in Yorkshire
13-08-09, 19:46
I must admit I haven't been to any record offices for a couple of years, so I'm not au fait with current regulations.

Here's an interesting scenario for you to ponder on, however.

The Borthwick Institute is situated in one of the libraries on the Uni complex.
The actual institute is closed in the evenings, but the microfilm room (for general student use for reading of ALL microfilm) is accessible until 11.30 p.m.

PR is on microfilm and is housed in this room, on a serve yourself basis. So anyone using the room has access to films of the marriage registers. One of the readers is a printer reader, where anyone can make a print of any frame of any microfilm (if they understand the instructions!)

Who is to know which person has made ANY print out and if it was of a marriage?
I don't see how a fee of £7 could be enforced, and if I don't have to pay at one record office, how could others argue the legality of the fee for a comparable print out?

Does this £7 perhaps apply to a digital image of the original, rather than a print out of a microfilm copy?

Jay

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 19:55
Jay

I expect that like all government edicts, the practice is open to interpretation!

I read it to mean that a photocopy of a marriage in a church register will be charged at certificate prices (because it belongs to the GRO in THAT FORMAT - an original register).

Your argument that a photocopy taken from a microfiche is not the same thing, is correct in MY view, but possibly not in the eyes of the GRO!

Let us see what happens if Edith tries it tomorrow.....

OC

Uncle John
13-08-09, 20:10
I must ask our minister what he is charging for info. from our (current) church marriage register. He's had a couple of requests recently.

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 21:31
Uncle John

Yes, that would be interesting and helpful to know.

OC

JayG
13-08-09, 22:00
My understanding is that a CERTIFICATED copy from the RECORDS Office would be more that just printing the entry from the fiche/film yourself.

I was at an Archives last month & paid 50p to print marriage entries from the film.

Looking at the table of parochial fees on CofE website the fee seems to be £19.00.

Englishedith
13-08-09, 22:41
Well i havent had a reply as yet from church and seeing as i would rather go earlier than later to records office don't think i'll get one inthe morning before i go.
So what is it you want me to do / find out
Edi.

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 22:47
Edi

Can you ask please, how much it would be to photocopy a marriage entry directly from a church register? (A post 1837 marriage, that is).

I promise I haven't made up this idea of Records Offices being instructed to charge GRO prices for photocopies of marriage certs...but I honestly cannot remember where I read this. In more than one place though, definitely.

Googling hasn't helped because I'm having difficulty with the search terms, e.g.

"How much does it cost to photocopy a marriage entry in a County Records Office"

brings up the unsurprising reply from google that nothing matches those search terms, lol!

OC

Englishedith
13-08-09, 23:01
Edi

Can you ask please, how much it would be to photocopy a marriage entry directly from a church register? (A post 1837 marriage, that is).

I promise I haven't made up this idea of Records Offices being instructed to charge GRO prices for photocopies of marriage certs...but I honestly cannot remember where I read this. In more than one place though, definitely.

Googling hasn't helped because I'm having difficulty with the search terms, e.g.

"How much does it cost to photocopy a marriage entry in a County Records Office"

brings up the unsurprising reply from google that nothing matches those search terms, lol!

OC
No problem will do.Edi.

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 23:24
Edi has just sent me a link to Worcester Records Office, which gives a list of photocopying charges.

It states on there

"Photocopies of civil (eh??) marriages taken from the Anglican church registers - £7".

It will be interesting to see if LancsRO make the same charge.

OC

Christine in Herts
13-08-09, 23:25
I've certainly seen that rule, OC. Cornwall demands the £7, as does Hertfordshire. That's the Records Offices. I wasn't charged for a digital photo at Warwicks.

Christine

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 23:30
In that case, perhaps I have misunderstood and it is the CHURCH making that charge for some baffling reason.....

OC

Christine in Herts
13-08-09, 23:32
In that case, perhaps I have misunderstood and it is the CHURCH making that charge for some baffling reason.....

OC

I'm pretty confident that the Records Offices said that GRO had leant on them... or not quite that turn of phrase, but...

Christine

JayG
13-08-09, 23:42
Just googled what I think OC has read.

Fiche/Film prints cost 70p (A4) or £1.20 (A3)


Certiticates cost

Baptism or burial £19.00
Marriages £7.00

I take that to mean a CERTIFICATED baptism/burial/marriage will cost £19 or £7. A film/fiche printout of a baptism/burial/marriage will cost 70p or £1.20.

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 23:47
Christine

That was what I heard too, that the GRO had "insisted" they level the playing field.

As it would never have occurred to me to either get, or want, a certificated copy from the Records Office, I am surprised that (apparently) so many people do.

I am perfectly happy to transcribe the record myself for all my side branches, sibs and twigs! It is only the information I want, not particularly in certificate form. Direct Ancestors are different of course.

OC

Olde Crone Holden
13-08-09, 23:53
Jay

Yes, that's answered the other question

Photocopies for which there is a legible surrogate on film...1.30

So if you ask for a marriage entry photocopy off a FILMED church record, it's only £1.30.

If you want a photcopy directly from the original register (certificated in other words) it's £7.

Isn't life complicated....

OC

Englishedith
14-08-09, 13:32
Well I've been this morning, decided to go in car as it had a car park and i was first there so no probs.
The staff are all friendley and helpful.:)
I've now got my readers ticket and a list of participating record offices throughout the country it's valid for 4 yrs.

Oc and others on thread
When i asked the question she said
Certified copies-- Baptisam £12.00
Marriage £7.00
They have always been this price but they are usually required for someone who is alive and not for genealogical purposes.
Copies of entries from Church Records typically cost £2.50---£5.00 uncertified.

I've seen my grandparents MC in the church register book today,:)
theres 2 certs on a page, so they have to do the whole page I got a digitized copy of the page and a photocopy of another document
That cost me £3.30 which inludes postage and vat.

The MC can either be sent or pick up from LRO on your next visit.
Besides the Southport GRO theres a place on Preston docks called the Registry certificate office copies from here again are £7.00
You can go personally but they cannot guarantee you obtaining a copy there and then.
Hope this has helped clarify things?
I feel a bit more confident about going next time ,:D
I think the staff being so friendley has helped.
.Edi

Olde Crone Holden
14-08-09, 13:36
Thankyou Edith.

So.....LancsRO will let you photocopy an actual church register entry for 3.30.

Worcester RO will charge you £7. Unless the marriage appears on a filmed copy of the marriage register, in which case it's photocopying charge only.

(Glad your visit was successful!)

OC

Englishedith
14-08-09, 13:49
Thankyou Edith.

So.....LancsRO will let you photocopy an actual church register entry for 3.30.

Worcester RO will charge you £7. Unless the marriage appears on a filmed copy of the marriage register, in which case it's photocopying charge only.

(Glad your visit was successful!)

OC

I was given the church register from St Matthews and had to lay it on these special foam wedges.
I copied the details into my notebook and then asked the assistant would i be able to have a copy and how much would it cost.
She said they can do a digitised copy of the whole page but not there and then you can have it posted or pick it up next time you go.
Just checked my receipt.
DIGI S-ROOM £ 2.50
Postage 1stclass 61p

With it beeing so resonable i thought it wold be nice to have acopy or my records.
Edi.