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elusive marriage & dodgy IGI records

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  • elusive marriage & dodgy IGI records

    Hello all,

    after a long absence I am having a go at my most frustrating line.

    I am trying to find the marriage of my great-grandparents in a desperate attempt to go back a further generation.

    Their names are Francis Smith & Henrietta Flaacke (Grandad's birth cert).Their first child was born c1881. I can't find them in BMDs & can only find a really dodgy submitted IGI record which gives marriage as "c1882 England", and also gives their dates of birth as 1862 (both) whereas the 1901 census gives them as c1852 & c1853 respectively.

    Any bright ideas, anyone?:(

  • #2
    do you have a census ref at all, or could you tell us the pob's for Francis & Henrietta please
    Julie
    They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

    .......I find dead people

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi there.

      The only census I can find them in is the 1901 RG 13/282 p22 living at Bethnal green in London.

      They give thier places of birth as London, altho Mum thought Henrietta was German.

      Comment


      • #4
        Which of the children is your granddad? Might be worth getting the birth cert for one of the others, to see how the mother's name is spelled (could be Flack). Could also be that Francis was married twice.

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi Karen,

          I have just spent half an hour looking for them on any other census and cannot find them at all :(

          How long have you been looking for them? They must be driving you crazy!

          Sorry that I've not been any help,
          Janet ;)

          Researching - Curr, Woolven, Beeden, Haslett, Shurey, Barton, Slade & Harding.

          Better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid, than to open it and remove all doubt - Mark Twain.

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi Mary & Janet,

            thanks for your help.

            My grandad is Francis. Luckily his birth cert has been passed down.

            I've tried finding birth records for his siblings, but as they are William, Francis & Elizabeth Smith & none seem to have middle names - Grandad certainly didn't - and their place of birth on the census is just given as London- I've never had any luck.

            I,ve been doing my tree for about 4 years now but this line just keeps defeating me- just wondered whether any better brains than mine might have some bright ideas that haven't occurred to me!

            Comment


            • #7
              For others looking, the children in 1901 are


              William age 20
              Francis 18
              Alfred 15
              Elizabeth 12

              all born "London" which is nice and vague!
              ~ with love from Little Nell~
              Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

              Comment


              • #8
                What is the exact address on the birth cert for Francis? And which registration district was he registered in?
                ~ with love from Little Nell~
                Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hi Nell,

                  he was born at 51 Cowper Street.

                  Reg district: Holborn
                  Sub-district: Finsbury
                  County: Middlesex

                  Is that any help at all?

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                  • #10
                    Well I can't find Francis Smith in the GRO birth indexes for Holborn on ancestry - which doesn't help, does it, as its clear he was registered and presumably his siblings were too?!
                    ~ with love from Little Nell~
                    Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Oh gosh, did a check for Alfred Smith born Holborn and found this poor chap:

                      Ennergetic Alfred Smith
                      ~ with love from Little Nell~
                      Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I've drawn a blank so far in 1881, 1891 and 1911. There is a Francis S Smith, upholsterer (which matches the 1901 occupation) in 1881, born St. James, Middlesex, but he's living with wife Elizabeth and no children.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Little Nell View Post
                          Well I can't find Francis Smith in the GRO birth indexes for Holborn on ancestry - which doesn't help, does it, as its clear he was registered and presumably his siblings were too?!
                          Karen...
                          If people can't find the GRO ref for a London cert - do make sure you have more than one copy/scan, or you may find it completely irreplaceable!

                          Christine
                          Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Little Nell View Post
                            Well I can't find Francis Smith in the GRO birth indexes for Holborn on ancestry - which doesn't help, does it, as its clear he was registered and presumably his siblings were too?!
                            He's on FreeBMD:

                            Births Sep 1883
                            Smith Francis Holborn 1b 782

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Whoever did the submitted marriage entry on the IGI has also submitted the children's baptisms. They've guessed at most of the dates, but they give an exact date for Francis: 20 JUL 1883. Is that correct? The entries for William, Alfred and Elizabeth are slightly different from the one for Francis, who was perhaps submitted by a different person. Interestingly, whoever submitted the entries for William, Alfred and Elizabeth, and the marriage, gives the parents' names as Francis Schmidt or Smith and Henrietta Flaacke.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                The only one I can get anywhere near with names and ages of children is this one from 1891 (I'm thinking Henrietta Elizabeth for Elizabeth)

                                Henrietta Galer 38
                                William Galer 10
                                Francis Galer 7
                                Alfred J Galer 4
                                Henrietta E Galer 2

                                RG12; Piece: 243; Folio 43; Page 41
                                Jeanette
                                Don't interpret this smile as happiness; it's insanity! :D

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Christine, the birth cert I have is not the original, it's a copy from 1950, so why would the GRO no longer have the record?

                                  Mary, 20th July 1883 is the date on grandad's birth cert. I have no idea whether he was christened & didn't realise his siblings were. I'll have a look on the IGI now.

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                                  • #18
                                    I suspect whoever submitted those entries had Francis jr's birth certificate (which suggests they're fairly closely related to you) and just guessed at the rest.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      That Henrietta Galer and family does look promising, although I can't find a Galer-Smith or Henrietta ?-Galer marriage. The image is hard to read - it might not be Galer but something like Galov.

                                      The only remotely similar birth I can see is this one, which probably relates to that Henrietta:

                                      Births Mar 1852
                                      GALLERS Henrietta Elizabeth Kensington 1a 25

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        OMG Jeanette-I've just realised all those names & ages tie in perfectly & presumably Henrietta E could be Elizabeth.

                                        But how could Galer be confused with Flaacke?

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