Information on Certificates

[ozgirl]

Hi, I'm new to all this, as I am just starting research on my family. My problem is my grandfathers family. They came from Nottingham, but as they have an extremely common surname (Brown) I have various possibilities. Is it possible to actually see the information on a certificate before buying a copy if you go to the local CRO. It's quite a distance for me to get to Nottingham and I wouldn't want to waste a journey. Or is there somewhere in London as I can get there easier. Otherwise I might end up with piles of certificates for other families!!

Many thanks

Linda

[Jessbowbag]

not usually, no.
Start with the facts you know and work back - his fathers name will be on hs marriage cert.

[ozgirl]

Thank you for the quick reply.

We have his fathers and mothers names but that is where it starts to unravel - according to BMD indexes and census info (and what little we have from him) there is a two year difference in his date of birth. This means that for his name and area there are 7 possibilities. So if I could check the info first, as we do know his mothers name it would hopefully narrow the field.

[margaretmarch]

Hi, I'm new to all this, as I am just starting research on my family. My problem is my grandfathers family. They came from Nottingham, but as they have an extremely common surname (Brown) I have various possibilities. Is it possible to actually see the information on a certificate before buying a copy if you go to the local CRO. It's quite a distance for me to get to Nottingham and I wouldn't want to waste a journey. Or is there somewhere in London as I can get there easier. Otherwise I might end up with piles of certificates for other families!!

Many thanks

Linda

Welcome to FTF.
You can narrow things down in terms of which certs to apply for by using a checking point, in this case if it's a birth certificate you can say the father's name as one that you want checking before a cert is issued, This costs £3 per check so it's cheaper than the full cert at £7.
If you want to put up some names - no living people - then maybe we can help.
The 1911 census might be a good start point on the road backwards.
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

You can use the mother's name as a check point and the GRO will stop at the first certificate that satisfies your criteria. It would then cost £7 plus however many £3 checks they do.
You have to put all the references one by one on the order to GRO.
Margaret

[ozgirl]

Thank you all for the information - I am trying to trace Harry Brown, although he might have been registered as Henry Brown born in Nottingham in either 1891 or 1893. His father was Edwin Brown and his mother Martha Ann Johnson.

This is the only information we are reasonably sure of, apart from the names of some of his brothers and sisters - I was thinking maybe to look for certificates for them to find out information.

Linda

[margaretmarch]

Yes that might work. The discrepancy in age is usual from census data but you may find the others are easier to pin down. Have you got them on the 1901 census? If so can you give the reference - its shown on the bottom of the transcript record and it would start RG13
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

Where have you found the information that you have? Is it from family members or from certificates?
I can't see the family on the 1901 census in Nottingham.
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

Here's the marriage for Martha Ann Johnson
1876 Sep, Nottingham Volume: 7b Page: 391 and his name is Edward Brown not Edwin although they can be interchangeable!
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

Here they are with him as Edwin in 1881 RG11; Piece: 3347; Folio: 86; Page: 22 and there are 2 children Thomas 6 and Kate 3.
Edwin c 1838 is from Leicester and Martha c 1851 is from Derby.
do you have access to census images? I found the census details on ancestry so if not let me your email address by private message and I will send the image.
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

Here they are in 1891 RG12; Piece: 2705; Folio 58 but Martha is listed and Ann.
Margaret

[ozgirl]

Our reference for the 1901 census is RG13/3179 - It would appear that Martha Ann (or Annie ) is now widowed - however according to family history we thought that she died first. However there is no trace of Martha being born in Derby in 1850/51. Her place of birth does vary on the census which is also slightly on the unhelpful side!

The info I have for Harry is only from his marriage certificate, which my sister has - I have not seen it. Might be worth getting one for me as that is the only info I am sure of!

Linda

[margaretmarch]

Hi,
Is the family I saw in the 1891 the right one?

You might be best to get Martha and Edward/Edwin's marriage cert for two reasons:- firstly to see if she was married before, and secondly to take you back another generation for both of them.

I would certainly get a copy of Harry's marriage certificate for peace of mind.

Have you got the folio and page number for the 1901 reference as I still can't see where they are
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

Could this be Martha Ann's birth?
Martha Ann Johnson 1851 Dec, Belper, Derbyshire Volume:19 Page:454

I know it's not Derby as such but people were not always accurate and it may be she moved to Derby and assumed she was born there. A lot of people in those days never saw their birth cert and it didn't really matter much, not like today!
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

In fact here's a Martha Ann Johnson born in Belper living in Nottingham in 1861
RG9; Piece: 2457; Folio: 103
Probably her but can only be confirmed if you get her marriage certificate to Edward/Edwin.
Margaret

[ozgirl]

Where do you find the folio/page no? They are in the Nottingham north east, District 57, page 26 if this helps. I'm pretty sure it's them as they are at the same address as in 1891, which is the correct family. Thank you for all your feedback -I think I will get those 2 certificates, and maybe see if I can work out Harry's birth too, as that would help a lot. Ooh, I just found it - folio 43 page 26. It's much easier with the other side of my family as the names are not as common. Thanks again, it does help to have someone to discuss things with.

Linda

[margaretmarch]

Thanks got them on 1901.
Just wondering if Annie is a second wife? her place of birth in 1901 is quite specific as Nottinghamshire Sutton Ashfield.
I would look for another marriage between when you see Martha as the wife oon the census and when you see her as Ann/Annie.
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

I would go for this birth
Harry Brown
1892 Dec Nottingham Volume:7b Page: 370 as that would definitely make him 8 years on 1901.
Margaret

[Mary from Italy]

Try looking at the baptisms here - they have fairly good coverage of Notts:

FreeREG Search

[ozgirl]

According to my sister, the Martha Ann in Belper is not her, as that one married a Henry Ling -I have not checked on that, she might be wrong. I might have a go at that birth certificate, as it does fit in with the dates given. What confuses me, however, is according to family history, my Grandfather insisted he was born in 1891, but I suppose he could easily have been a year out, especially as looking at the census Clara was born around 1891 as well. I will go see if there are any deaths for Martha now.

Thanks again
Linda