Why am I unable to find his birth?

[LorraineJ]

Its for a Noel Fred Midgley who was born on 7th November 1920, I have been able to find his death in 1996 but no corresponding birth entry and wonder why. I have tried Midgeley/Mildly/Midley/Migly and come up with nothing, does anyone have any further ideas?

He was the son of Fred and Charlotte Midgly (nee Wilson), who married in Sculcoates, Yorkshire in 1919. He had two sisters, one of whom is deceased and the other's death does not show up on the listings, but she could have died between 2005 to date.

[scuda]

Noel F Midgly is there in the Ancestry transcriptions - Sculcoates, Q4 1920 just as you said. (may not be on freebmd yet, of course). Ask again if you want the full info (not sure if you have access to Ancestry)

scuda

[LorraineJ]

Noel F Midgly is there in the Ancestry transcriptions - Sculcoates, Q4 1920 just as you said. (may not be on freebmd yet, of course). Ask again if you want the full info (not sure if you have access to Ancestry)

scuda

Is it really. I never thought of just putting in an F, off to find it now.

[Gwyn in Kent]

After about mid 1910, only initial letter was used for middle names.

[LorraineJ]

After about mid 1910, only initial letter was used for middle names.

Really, didn't know that.

Got another question for you, his wife appeared to have been Alberta A Thomas, was she foreign, as her birth doesn't seem to be registered.

[scuda]

Of course, Alberta A Thomas could have been Albert A Anything when her birth was registered! Her mother may have married/remarried after Alberta's birth.

Do you know if Noel and Alberta had children? The one Val found would have been rather too old for children by 1949 when they married.

scuda

[LorraineJ]

I didn't know of Noel's existence until 48 hours ago, therefore I don't know anything about him.

To clarify, Alberta wasn't her name, its where she came from, is that right. We have no idea what A stood for.

[Darksecretz]

She could have just been registered as 'female' and named later.

[scuda]

To clarify, Alberta wasn't her name, its where she came from, is that right

The name of Noel's wife was Alberta A Thomas (actually given as Alberts on the Ancestry transcription, but Alberta on the image). I wonder if she died, or they were divorced before 1968, as there is another Noel F Midgly marriage then (in Farnworth, to Maria Neilson).

scuda

[LorraineJ]

I have found out that Alberta and Noel had a son and a daughter, and he had a daughter with Maria. I have been unable to find a death for Alberta, therefore can only conclude that Alberta and Noel must have divorced at sometime between 1953 (when their son was born) and 1969. Alberta was a much older mother, she was 55!!

[LorraineJ]

Either that or he was a bigamist!!

[Olde Crone Holden]

I would want to see a doctor's certificate for a 55 year old mother! Vanishingly unlikely in my opinion.

OC

[Mary from Italy]

Hi Lorraine,

I'm afraid you're doing too much guesswork here.

How do you know that the Noel who married in Farnworth was the same one? There was also a Frank Noel Midgley who died in Sheffield in 1994 - it could have been him.

How do you know Alberta's age? There isn't a birth in England and Wales for an Alberta A Thomas as far as I can see; there are various Albertas, but it could be any of them. As OC says, having a baby at 55 is highly unlikely.

How do you know Alberta didn't die before 1968 if it is the same Noel who married in Farnworth? Deaths aren't indexed for that period, so you'd have to check each quarter individually from 1953 to 1968, which is quite a long job.

If you want to know more about this couple, you'll have to start by getting their marriage cert, which at least will give you their ages and father's names and occupations.

[LorraineJ]

I am not saying you are wrong, but having children in their 50s isn't unknown in my family. Also it would be really unusual for the wife to be 22 years her husband's senior. However I think it quite likely that its the first marriage to Alberta thats wrong, in that we have the wrong Alberta (albeit a very kind digging around on my behalf). I have been through quarter by quarter and no deaths show up for an Alberta Midgley/Midgeley at all.

[Mary from Italy]

OK, then I think the only solution is the marriage cert, to get her age and father's name.

[scuda]

I think if you really want to get this sorted out you need to get the certificate for the Noel F Midgly/Alberta A Thomas marriage. That will confirm you have the right Noel Midgly, and give you more information for tracing Alberta both backwards and forwards. I'm not sure how you know her age - have I missed something?

scuda

Mary got there first - as you can see, I agree with her.

[LorraineJ]

OK, then I think the only solution is the marriage cert, to get her age and father's name.

Very true, thanks. I think though that Alberta had to have come from somewhere in the Commonwealth given the dates and she does not appear to have her birth registered here. The marriage in 1949, children born 1950 and 1953. There is nothing to say that she and Noel didn't divorce before he remarried in 1969, but I cannot see she is the one found born in Nebraska in about 1891.

[LorraineJ]

I think if you really want to get this sorted out you need to get the certificate for the Noel F Midgly/Alberta A Thomas marriage. That will confirm you have the right Noel Midgly, and give you more information for tracing Alberta both backwards and forwards. I'm not sure how you know her age - have I missed something?

scuda

Mary got there first - as you can see, I agree with her.

Getting the certificate is a purchase for the future, I have plenty more direct line certificates to buy. Until 72 hours ago I didn't even know Noel Midgley even existed. I still think that the 1949 marriage is a correct one, on two counts, his middle name is Fred after his father and the marriage was in Bolton like both of his sisters and the father's business (with my GF) was just up the road in Wallasey, Liverpool.

As for knowing her age, Val wish I'd never started found a possible; that Alberta was born in Nebraska, father Wm A Thomas, mother Lilian Thomas, Alberta aged 22. Another thought occurs to me, we could be a generation out and that Alberta could be her aunt.

[Mary from Italy]

I think though that Alberta had to have come from somewhere in the Commonwealth given the dates and she does not appear to have her birth registered here.

I don't think you can assume that, I'm afraid. Just because there's no registration for an Alberta A Thomas doesn't mean she wasn't born in England or Wales. She could have added a middle name later, or it could have been missed when she was born; or she could have been given Alberta as a middle name and something else beginning with A as a first name, and switched them later. Or she could have been married before she married Noel, in which case her birth name will be different.

These are all possibilities, so you need to keep an open mind, rather than jumping to conclusions.