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17th Century Genealogy

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  • 17th Century Genealogy

    I have a number of lines back to the mid to late 17th century which I am "stuck" on. What other records, other than parish records, can I use further research them? I've already thought of wills, if my ancestors left them (few of them did, apparently).

    I'd also welcome any recommendations of books on the subject of early genealogy.

    If it makes a difference, all the early lines are in Droitwich, Worcestershire.

  • #2
    Hearth tax, window tax, recusant rolls, Protestation Oath rolls, manorial records (in English during the commonwealth period)

    C17th is usually much easier for alternative records - essential because there is usually a hiatus in parish records.
    Phoenix - with charred feathers
    Researching Skillings from Norfolk, Sworn from Salisbury and Adams in Malborough, Devon.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
      Hearth tax, window tax, recusant rolls, Protestation Oath rolls, manorial records (in English during the commonwealth period)

      C17th is usually much easier for alternative records - essential because there is usually a hiatus in parish records.
      Will I need to hire a professional researcher for those records? I'm in Australia, so I can't get to the Worcester Record Office, and it's hard to get to the nearest LDS centre by public transport.

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      • #4
        Iused to write book reviews and there were never any sent to me on that period. We recently had a talk given by Else Churchill of the Society of Genealogists. Her speciality is the earlier periods. She had put information on sources for C18th on a website - I think for the BBC. It might be worth Googling her, to see if anything useful pops up.

        Sadly, the main organisations likely to publish definitive, accurate information are no longer doing very much. The National Archives publish on various aspects of their records, but these tend to be quite pricey.
        Phoenix - with charred feathers
        Researching Skillings from Norfolk, Sworn from Salisbury and Adams in Malborough, Devon.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
          Iused to write book reviews and there were never any sent to me on that period. We recently had a talk given by Else Churchill of the Society of Genealogists. Her speciality is the earlier periods. She had put information on sources for C18th on a website - I think for the BBC. It might be worth Googling her, to see if anything useful pops up.

          Sadly, the main organisations likely to publish definitive, accurate information are no longer doing very much. The National Archives publish on various aspects of their records, but these tend to be quite pricey.
          I'll do that, thank you (google Else Churchill).

          As for the National Archives, my funds are limited so I probably wouldn't buy from them. Thanks for the heads up anyway.

          Comment


          • #6
            LDS libraries have some manorial records on film and lots of the other records have been published. See if you can find any Gibson Guides on Hearth Tax, early censuses etc as these will tell you what has been published.

            Roehampton has an ongoing commitment to publishing such early records in book form.

            My history is a bit ropey, but I think a bit of the Civil War was being played out in Worcestershire. It may be that there are specialist history books you can order to give you a flavour of the period.
            Phoenix - with charred feathers
            Researching Skillings from Norfolk, Sworn from Salisbury and Adams in Malborough, Devon.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
              LDS libraries have some manorial records on film and lots of the other records have been published. See if you can find any Gibson Guides on Hearth Tax, early censuses etc as these will tell you what has been published.

              Roehampton has an ongoing commitment to publishing such early records in book form.

              My history is a bit ropey, but I think a bit of the Civil War was being played out in Worcestershire. It may be that there are specialist history books you can order to give you a flavour of the period.
              I'll do that, and I'll look for some history books for the period.

              Looks like I'll be trying to get a lift from a friend to the LDS centre. :D

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              • #8
                Redacted

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                • #9
                  My experience has been exactly the same as Penelope's, although my ancestors don't hail from Worcester.

                  Many more Wills and this possibly reflects a determination that the loathed Commonwealth government won't get a penny!

                  Also - the English character is such that as soon as you tell people they are forbidden to do something they immediately do it in defience.

                  Thus, all those lazy clerics and vicars who kept patchy registers prior to the commonwealth, started keeping detailed secret registers and once the monarchy was restored, wrote up the missing years. Some of this may have been guesswork but I find it most interesting that some CHURCH marriages are recorded - these must have taken place in secret.

                  This leads to a curious thing. If, after about 1700, you suddenly start seeing in registers "John Smith alias Brown" etc, this can sometimes reflect that the parents contracted a civil marriage during the commonwealth period and that the church does not recognise it as a marriage, or possibly that John Smith alias Brown's parents were rude to the vicar/church during the commonwealth period and he is getting his own back by delicately hinting that they were not REALLY married in the eyes of God (that is, the C of E).

                  I also agree with Penelope that the lack of information on the IGI only reflects the fact that no one has yet transcribed the registers, it doesn't mean they don't exist.

                  Personally, I have only ever found one gap in the registers which can be put down to non-recording by the church during the commonwealth period. However, my area of interest is almost always Lancashire and Lancashire doesn't appear to have been particularly affected, possibly because it was largely remote terrain and possibly because there were a lot of two-faced Lancastrians.

                  For a general "read up" of the period, either Google, or read Asa Briggs A History of England - this covers all periods and is interesting, well written and not too heavy.

                  OC

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                  • #10
                    Thanks for all that.

                    As for my gaps, there appear when there are baptisms and marriages of other families earlier (in the IGI), so I'm not sure that the records would exist. Something to keep in mind, though.

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                    • #11
                      There have been many books on Genealogy/Family History published these days and in the past.
                      Many of the old ones give good pointers to types of records that will help the researcher that the newer books miss out.
                      In addition some records are now available on the internet or republished on CD.

                      There are many suppliers on the internet such as Anguline Research Archives, Parish Chest, Gould Genealogy, JiGrah, Eneclann, Findmypast, WorldVitalRecords etc., where you may find republished books or transcripts of records.

                      These could take you back to the 15th century or even earlier.
                      Cheers
                      Guy
                      Guy passed away October 2022

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Heavily into the Civil War in Northamptonshire I have found many excellent books for this era as all have pointed out. I also have found Commonwealth marriages which are very thrilling to find when you do happen to come across them and I would also echo what others have said about the IGI. Very few of my Northants ancestors are on the IGI.

                        However reading about the history will not really help you with your personal family history of these times. Much of the information you are after is most probably in the Worcester County Records Archives somewhere. You could ring/e mail to find out just what they have got and look at their website to see what you can find. I found all of mine not through the IGI or through the internet but at Northants/Huntingdon County Record Offices and have spent many happy days within these offices searching out all those details that put the flesh on your tree. You are coming from Australia and this is not an option for you, but have you friends, relatives in the UK that may be able to help you? If not you may gain more info and friends by joining a Family History Society in Worcester and these FHS are reasonable to join, around £10 for a year. Worcester FHS may have done some CD's/Fiche to help you. Also do you belong to an Australian FHS? Your Australian FHS are really wonderful with excellent facilities and can often help to crack a problem for you.

                        Other than that your only other real options are a visit to the UK which would be horrendously expensive or to find someone at the CRO who will do some work for you at a cost.

                        National Archives may well have some old wills which will be worth downloading. Occasionally you will find wills on the internet and I have been lucky in Northants in this respect finding many wills.

                        I have also found may books on Northants county history by going through Amazon and just doing a Northants search. I found many many books this way so I am sure you could do the same for Worcestershire.

                        Most counties have mailing lists which may help and I notice that Genuki Worcs has one, so you could look into that as I find these mailing lists do have some very good county experts, where you can ask all sorts of questions and often amongst many answers receive expert help. I belong to the Northants mailing list and there is often very interesting info on there which I have tapped into.

                        The Genuki website for Worcs:



                        Janet
                        Last edited by Janet; 03-07-09, 10:38.

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                        • #13
                          Thanks a lot, Janet.

                          I can't really afford a professional genealogist at this time so I guess I'm going to have to rely on the occasional lookup and whatever I can search or buy online. I've already bought a few microfiches (parish register transcriptions) from the BMSGH and I'm thinking of joining the society.

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                          • #14
                            There is a member, Ian H, who is offering to do look up's at worcester history centre, he may be able to help, give him a pm or look out for his thread on research board, good luck
                            www.chrisatstjohns.tribalpages.com
                            http://www.familytreeforum.com/wiki/index.php/User:ChrissyConfused-91

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Chrissy Confused View Post
                              There is a member, Ian H, who is offering to do look up's at worcester history centre, he may be able to help, give him a pm or look out for his thread on research board, good luck
                              I have been thinking about that (in fact, I requested a lookup from him just recently), but I've been hesitant about asking for anything other than parish records and wills.

                              I have no idea, for example, how hard it is to such look up hearth taxes and polls taxes and I was thinking it might be a big imposition asking for people to lookup those. :o
                              Last edited by tanyal; 03-07-09, 12:26.

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                              • #16
                                I understand what your saying, as I feel the same way too when asking, but the worst he can say is no, and you would of lost nothing but on the other hand you could gain a whole lot more
                                www.chrisatstjohns.tribalpages.com
                                http://www.familytreeforum.com/wiki/index.php/User:ChrissyConfused-91

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Chrissy Confused View Post
                                  I understand what your saying, as I feel the same way too when asking, but the worst he can say is no, and you would of lost nothing but on the other hand you could gain a whole lot more
                                  That is true. I'll think about it. :D

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by tanyal View Post
                                    Thanks for all that.

                                    As for my gaps, there appear when there are baptisms and marriages of other families earlier (in the IGI), so I'm not sure that the records would exist. Something to keep in mind, though.
                                    The gap years (ie: 1640-46, actually during the War) may not even affect your family, though depending on whether the relevant people were in their childbearing years during that time. So other families may appear because they were, if that makes sense?

                                    Also, the ECW was an incredible time of upheaval, 'the world turned upside down'.

                                    Here in Yorkshire, we had Scots troops billetted so Scots names start turning up in our registers, even 10 years later. Other locals would have lost their homes - depending on the outcome of local battles, etc.

                                    People lost their farms because they were requisitioned or had so many soldiers billetted on them, they went broke, or had their crops/livestock stolen by one, or both armies as they came and went. Men were sent to the other end of the country to fight, many never to return. And families were ripped apart by different alliances.

                                    In the villages here where I live (and where my ancestors were), the local castle was repeatedly won and lost by both sides, until they did the only sensible thing they could do to stop the royalists and dismantled it. The villagers would largely have been paying rent and their landlord - employer and everything else to them - changed as places were requisitioned. My family did well after the War was won, as they had clearly been on Parliament's side, so got the living at the church. But many others lost out. Society was riped apart for a generation after. ALL this is what you see reflected in the parish records.

                                    It may be you draw a blank as your families are the ones that moved in after the War - like our local Scots names. People were displaced and others came in, and if that is the case you may never get back past the 1640s as people travelled vast distances across the landscape, when they were dispossessed, or went in search of a lost loved one, or moved for other reasons.

                                    So if you can see names on the IGI for that parish pre 1640, but not your names, it may be that the family only came during or after the War. If that is the case they could be from anywhere - even out of county.

                                    Round here, certain names stay - most of my own names are there in the 16thC and still there post ECW. But other familiar names vanished and I can only assume they were probably royalist sympathisers, and one parish along from Lord Fairfax was a dangerous place for them to be, after the parliamentarians won.
                                    Last edited by Penelope; 03-07-09, 13:09.

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                                    • #19
                                      I'm afraid you might be right, Penelope. :(

                                      My earliest Tickle ancestor appears out of nowhere in 1689. In fact, I've found very few Tickles before 1700 in the whole of Worcestershire
                                      My earliest Brook is baptising children from 1650 but I his baptism is nowhere in the IGI, though earlier baptisms, including some Brookes: the problem is linking them up.
                                      My earliest Dudley is baptising children from 1666 but, again, no baptism even though there are other families baptising children in the same area.
                                      It's the same with my Bebbington family, though a little later. Daniel just appears marrying in 1704.

                                      Of course, since I'm basing much of this on the IGI I still have hopes that those baptisms are out there, somewhere. :D

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        The Dudleys appear quite a lot in Northants. The Bebbington may also translate to Babbington and there was a Babington Plot around the time of Mary Queen of Scots when Mary wrote to Anthony Babbington to try to get Elizabeth assassinated. Mary was then imprisoned in Fotheringhay Castle, Northants and executed a few months later. Anthony Babington came from Derbyshire. May be worth your while doing some googling. Here is just one web site:

                                        Read about some of the codes and codebreakers that have sealed the fate of queens and of wars throughout British history. Find out about three spies in British history and the nature of espionage in their time. Become a codebreaker yourself. Send and receive messages using a real French cipher. This resource has been archived […]


                                        Northants is the next county South to Worcestershire and Warwickshire and there is a lot of exchange of families across these borders as well as Oxfordshire/Rutland and Huntingdonshire. The Dudleys are in a small hamlet of Clopton on the Hunts border from about 1450 onwards. They had seats in Warwickshire and Bedfordshire as well as possibly Hertfordshire and Middlesex and there is a link with the Earl of Leicester. So yes, you may find you have a merry chase over the borders. I have chased many of mine from Northants to Rutland to Hunts to Warwickshire.

                                        Janet
                                        Last edited by Janet; 03-07-09, 17:46.

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