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Scottish research - am I banjaxed?

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  • Scottish research - am I banjaxed?

    Is it possible to get marriage certs post 1933? If so, how, and what are the minimum details required?
    All I have for definite is a surname for the bride (an unusual one in Scotland), names of both her parents & mmn.

    I always believed Uncle Jack to have had a daughter called Chrissie, but the only possible birth registration in either Scotland & England is for a Mary Isabel. (Issie perhaps??) Or could Mary Isabel have had Christina (her maternal grandmother's name) as a third forename??

    IF this is "Chrissie", then she was born in 1922.
    I know "Chrissie" married and produced Uncle Jack's only grandchildren, but I have no idea of her husband's names.
    I tried a death search for Mary Isabel, using the birth name as "other name", but couldn't do a search without entering at least part of a surname.

    Jay
    Janet in Yorkshire



    Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

  • #2
    Edit to say:

    I just realised its marriages after 1933 and they're not indexed on SP yet - so you have to call them or download forms and send off for them.

    However because it seems you don't have enough information I would telephone them. Number on second link.

    General Register Office for Scotland

    General Register Office for Scotland - Family Records - How to Order an Official Extract

    As far as I am aware they will do searches I would call them. But I don't know how much they charge or how much info is necessary to even start to look.
    Last edited by Guest; 29-06-09, 12:41. Reason: having realised it was marriage and not Birth/Death

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    • #3
      Thanks for that maggie.

      I will give them a ring tomorrow, but from the pricing section, it sounds as if a search (with what little I know) could be VERY expensive :( and still end up fruitless.

      A friend called this afternoon and further complicated the issue by cheerfully pointing out that a girl born in 1922 would be of a nice marriageable age during WW2.
      So, Miss "unconfirmed name" could have married anywhere not necessarily Scotland LOL
      What a shame the birth index can't be searched by mmn only, or the death index by maiden name!
      Edinburgh in the autumn is beginning to look a VERY attractive proposition!

      Jay
      Janet in Yorkshire



      Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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      • #4
        The restricted search criteria do pose a problem when your info. is sketchy.
        Uncle John - Passed away March 2020

        Comment


        • #5
          I think that when you do a death search of a woman it is indexed by both maiden name and married name.
          I have just checked my ggg granny putting in her 1st and maiden name only and got a result.
          herky
          Researching - Trimmer (Farringdon), Noble & Taylor (Ross and Cromarty), Norris (Glasgow), McGilvray (Glasgow and Australia), Leck & Efford (Glasgow), Ferrett (Hampshire), Jenkins & Williams (Aberystwyth), Morton (Motherwell and Tipton), Barrowman (Glasgow), Lilley (Bromsgrove and Glasgow), Cresswell (England and Lanarkshire). Simpson, Morrow and Norris in Ireland. Thomas Price b c 1844 Scotland.

          Comment


          • #6
            That's interesting, herky - I can't get round the mandatory surname requirement.

            Of course, IF Mary Isabel is my "Chrissie", she was born in 1922 and could well be still alive. Her mother lived to be 86 and there is no online death reg for her brother Thomas who was born c1926.

            Jay
            Janet in Yorkshire



            Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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            • #7
              ScotlandsPeople does say that it it is common for married women to be referred to by their maiden surname. I have several wills that bear that out.
              Uncle John - Passed away March 2020

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              • #8
                Thanks for that UJ - would that happen as recently as the last 10/20 years?

                I have already tried Mary Isabel + birth surname on the deaths index, but there is no hit.
                I think the Scottish registrations are great, from an information point of view, but I do wish births could be searched by inserting mmn only. Mary Isabel was the only female with that surname born in Scotland in the 1920's, and there were just 3 other girls born between 1900 & 1919, in very different areas of Scotland. Would really have narrowed down the possibilities, as "Chrissie" lived in the same area as her parents.
                Ah well, last time the freebies came up, it wasn't possible to search for births in the time she and her brothers were born.

                Jay
                Janet in Yorkshire



                Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                Comment


                • #9
                  Just a thought - I have some relatives who on their marriage cert have a 1st and middle name, yet on their birth cert only a 1st name.
                  Perhaps the second name was an after thought.
                  Could your relative been registered with the 1st name and no middle name? Does that give you more of a choice?
                  herky
                  Researching - Trimmer (Farringdon), Noble & Taylor (Ross and Cromarty), Norris (Glasgow), McGilvray (Glasgow and Australia), Leck & Efford (Glasgow), Ferrett (Hampshire), Jenkins & Williams (Aberystwyth), Morton (Motherwell and Tipton), Barrowman (Glasgow), Lilley (Bromsgrove and Glasgow), Cresswell (England and Lanarkshire). Simpson, Morrow and Norris in Ireland. Thomas Price b c 1844 Scotland.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Janet

                    If you know of anyone going to Gros or Park Circus you could ask for it to be looked up.
                    I won't be going for some time as I'm just too busy and it's a 6am to 10pm day for me when I go, but if you wish to pm me the details I'll put it in my book just in case I get some free time.
                    We do searches for members on SFT but again, due to work and holidays, it's likely the next trip will be end August. There's a new centre opening in September in Inverness so I can search there any time. Downside is, it's not going to have many spaces and is reputedly going to cost £25 as opposed to £10 in Edinburgh.

                    Gros has a new search system and it is possible to search by mother's maiden name but this doesn't start till 1929.
                    A birth certificate can be obtained from any registrar's office but it's expensive (£14) but they do ensure it's the right person - mind you, if you phone Gros they'll do it for you for £10, I think.
                    I never bother. I have the certs I need for family, the rest I just use the downloaded page from the register and transcribe for the latest ones. I like the page from the register as quite often every record on it is relevant.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Herky
                      I have that as well! I'm sure it's done to confuse those following!

                      Sometimes there's a reason, though. If a parent/grandparent died then the next child was given that name. If no more children born then a name was added or sometimes even changed entirely.

                      Would there be a grandparent who was Chrissie/Chirstie, Janet?

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                      • #12
                        Hi Woody,
                        I am interested to hear about this new centre in Inverness as I pass through there a few time each year and it would also be more convenient for me than Edinburgh.
                        Is there a web site with details?
                        Sorry to be going off topic but your mail caught my interest.
                        herky
                        Researching - Trimmer (Farringdon), Noble & Taylor (Ross and Cromarty), Norris (Glasgow), McGilvray (Glasgow and Australia), Leck & Efford (Glasgow), Ferrett (Hampshire), Jenkins & Williams (Aberystwyth), Morton (Motherwell and Tipton), Barrowman (Glasgow), Lilley (Bromsgrove and Glasgow), Cresswell (England and Lanarkshire). Simpson, Morrow and Norris in Ireland. Thomas Price b c 1844 Scotland.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Woody View Post
                          Sometimes there's a reason, though. If a parent/grandparent died then the next child was given that name. If no more children born then a name was added or sometimes even changed entirely.

                          Would there be a grandparent who was Chrissie/Chirstie, Janet?
                          Hi Woody, yes there was. "Chrissie's" maternal grandmother (the Scottish side) was Christina, which is why I had expected my cousin to have been Christina.
                          I have just had another fiddle on the death index and it would seem the grandmother died in 1932, when Mary Isabel was 10 years old. (There was only one possibility for the death of Christina Coull, nee Gove, in the Bervie reg dist, so it was just a case of narrowing down the date search to find the exact year.)
                          "Chrissie" was the only girl in her family. Her paternal grandmother was Mary and her mother had sisters called Mary & Isabel, so Mary Isabel sounds a strong candidate.
                          I know that at one time uncle Jack and family arrived in England and lived with the paternal grandparents for a couple of years (youngest 2 children were born in Northumberland) before moving back to Bervie. So it's quite possible they also lived with the maternal grandparents (Christina & David Coull) and the daughter was nicknamed "Little Chrissie."

                          Thankyou for the kind offer, Woody, but it's not that important, only a question of tying up a loose end. I was intrigued, really, as to why I couldn't find a birth reg for Christina XXX. However, it's looking quite likely that Mary Isabel IS "Chrissie".
                          I really appreciate all the helpful and constructive comments on this thread, so thankyou one and all.

                          Jay
                          Janet in Yorkshire



                          Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Jay, I'll still take a look the next time I go. If it was done officially then there may be an amendment in the margin and there will be an entry in the RCE (Register of Corrected Entries).
                            I might get away the last Thursday in July, it's looking good at the moment but likely something will happen to change that!!

                            Herky
                            It's due to open in September and there's to be a Homecoming do in Eden Court to coincide with the opening.
                            Not all the records will be available straight away as they will need to wait about 18 months for the storage conditions to be in order but this should be well worth the wait. Apparently, even some of the papers at NAS are likely to come here.

                            Do you know where the Boating Pond and the Islands are? It's just across the road from the Boating Pond. We passed there on Sunday and it's pretty well on so it just may be on target - that's the September target, the original was July!!!

                            No web site as yet but this is the council link. The Archive part at the Library is moving there so they may know more. The Registrar's Office is also moving in but they don't know when either.

                            The Highland Council Archives

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thanks Woody - This all sounds quite exciting as some of my direct line family were Ross and Cromarty and then moved to Inverness. This new centre may just open up some new avenues for me as I haven't had a chance to visit the archive in the library (that's next to the bus station isn't it?).
                              No I don't know that part of Inverness but it isn't a large city so I am sure I will have no trouble finding it. With it being a larger centre then I will certainly make time for visits.
                              Thanks again
                              herky
                              Researching - Trimmer (Farringdon), Noble & Taylor (Ross and Cromarty), Norris (Glasgow), McGilvray (Glasgow and Australia), Leck & Efford (Glasgow), Ferrett (Hampshire), Jenkins & Williams (Aberystwyth), Morton (Motherwell and Tipton), Barrowman (Glasgow), Lilley (Bromsgrove and Glasgow), Cresswell (England and Lanarkshire). Simpson, Morrow and Norris in Ireland. Thomas Price b c 1844 Scotland.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Jay, would this birth be one of yours?
                                The maiden name of the mother of Christine Gove/Coull was May Mowatt.

                                18 1918 COULL MARY C S MOWATT F BERVIE OR INVERBERVIE /KINCARDINE 254/00 0012 No Image ORDER

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                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by herky View Post
                                  Thanks Woody - This all sounds quite exciting as some of my direct line family were Ross and Cromarty and then moved to Inverness. This new centre may just open up some new avenues for me as I haven't had a chance to visit the archive in the library (that's next to the bus station isn't it?).
                                  No I don't know that part of Inverness but it isn't a large city so I am sure I will have no trouble finding it. With it being a larger centre then I will certainly make time for visits.
                                  Thanks again
                                  You'll easily find it but let me know when you're planning a visit as I could meet you if suitable. I can give you directions anyway. It's to have it's own car park and coffee shop as well!
                                  The present one is in the library (and you're right, just by the bus station) but it's a small room and every time I go it's so busy I don't have time to wait.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Thanks Woody - good news about parking and coffee shop - an essential part of family research, I think!!
                                    Can't wait for it to open and strange that i haven't heard about this before but glad that you mentioned it.
                                    herky
                                    Researching - Trimmer (Farringdon), Noble & Taylor (Ross and Cromarty), Norris (Glasgow), McGilvray (Glasgow and Australia), Leck & Efford (Glasgow), Ferrett (Hampshire), Jenkins & Williams (Aberystwyth), Morton (Motherwell and Tipton), Barrowman (Glasgow), Lilley (Bromsgrove and Glasgow), Cresswell (England and Lanarkshire). Simpson, Morrow and Norris in Ireland. Thomas Price b c 1844 Scotland.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Like everything in Inverness, it seems to be a closely guarded secret! Will keep you posted though!

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Woody, thankyou so much for that.
                                        That lady would be an ancestor of "Chrissie's" on her mother's side, but not of me.
                                        "Chrissie's" father was the eldest brother of my father and so it's her "English" side that is of interest to me. As I say, I only needed the birth years of uncle Jack's children to tidy up that bit of my tree. I was intrigued not to find an appropriate birth registration for Christina XXX and wondered if Mary Isabel XX was her. I can live with the mystery for a bit longer

                                        Jay
                                        Janet in Yorkshire



                                        Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                                        Comment

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